[Checkers]

There's no easy way to say this, so we'll just let it go... I don't think my marriage is going to last. Been married for 3 years, wife recently had our first child - which is obviously the bigger hitch. I want to work on our relationship problems, but I get push-back from her on something as fundamental as counseling. I'll force the issue at some point, when things settle down with the baby, but I'm not optimistic about the outcome.

So I'm looking at maybe 2 more years, maybe 3. My primary concern is my son of course, and it's on that end I really have questions. I'm one who believes that two parents who stay together in a toxic relationship are more damaging to children than the process of divorce. I'm wondering how others come down on that opinion?

And with that said, is there a better age for this type of transition? Is sooner really better than later for his wellbeing? He is currently 3 months, so maybe looking at age 3 or 4... how rough is that likely to be for him compared to being older, maybe 6-7?

-C

[SeptemberMorn]

So sorry you've having problems with such a young marriage.

It's possible your wife is still going through some hormonal changes from the birth of your child. She's probably also going through mental and emotional changes. If you can, give her some more time. Talk to her doctor and get that person's opinion on what's going on with your wife.

As for kids and a divorce... Kids ALWAYS get stuck in the middle no matter how amicable the divorce is. But I would have to say that the sooner the better while your son is still unaware of what's going on around him. They are so impressionable once they become aware of their surroundings. Children always seem to think the divorce is THEIR fault, that they caused it somehow.

Bottom line, though, that child deserves both mother and father. Have you talked with your wife and gotten any reasons or clues as to why she's pushing you away? That would be a good place to start. If you think some counseling would help, then YOU go. That way you'll know that you tried everything you could.

[Checkers]

Most of our issues pre-date the pregnancy, though I understand the hormone levels and other complications don't help. Believe that we'll BOTH be in therapy, individually or together, before anything drastic happens. I'm not willing to let go without trying, I just worry not many changes will result. We've talked.. and talked, and talked some more, both before and after the birth, but she isn't yet willing to change even though she claims to want to.

-C

[kimmydawn]

Hi, Checkers, and welcome!!!

I'm sorry for all the difficult that you're having within your marriage.

I wish that you're wife would consider counseling with you. However, you could set a great example by going ahead and going for yourself. She might jump on the bandwagon with you. If not, it would still be a great source for you as you move forward from here. Please consider that. Often times, I've see one party in the marriage go, then the other will go at least once. Good luck there.

Regarding when is the best time...I don't know that there IS a best time, but still yet the necessary time. Please seek someone and talk this through so that you can have the support you need emotionally as well as an educated assistance with handling whatever might come with your wife and child. Even if a divorce is inevitible...there's a good and bad way to do those for the children as well.

I personally believe that the younger the child is, the better they adjust in the moment (however, it's a continual adjustment with the parents and how the parents respond/react will dictate how well the child does) and it prevents them from feeling alot of the guilt that an older child can feel, getting stuck in the middle feelings, etc. That said, alot of the time it can't be done at the younger age because parents are giving all they can give for it to work out. It's so hard, I know. I divorced when my daughter had just turned 5. It was very difficult for her, but alot of that was my youth and emotional state. I moved forward too quickly without realizing how that might've been affecting her. I think she would have done much better had I allowed her to adjust more because it wasn't the divorce so much that was so hard on her in appearance but my dragging her along with me in my "moving on" too quickly.

I wish you so well. Please consider seeing someone yourself. Again, welcome to PC!

KD

[Perna]

I understand/applaud your wanting to do therapy before the marriage break-up decision is made but I don't know that it can work if you don't think it will. My husband's ex-wife wanted therapy and I suggested he go and he did but he wasn't committed to it working so it didn't for him.

I would do as kimmydawn suggests and go yourself now and see where you head is actually at. No way you can determine when will be good/bad for you to split for your son or his mother, that's wholly up to their own personalities/life experiences and characters.

[jlove973]

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Checkers said:
So I'm looking at maybe 2 more years, maybe 3. My primary concern is my son of course, and it's on that end I really have questions. I'm one who believes that two parents who stay together in a toxic relationship are more damaging to children than the process of divorce. I'm wondering how others come down on that opinion?

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*****This is only my opinion. I do not wish that my words hurt anyone.*****

I am so sorry to here that you are having difficulties in your marriage. When I read your words I can see that you are hurting
IMHO - You can't put a time limit on your relationship and how long it will last or how long that you are willing to try to make it last. Yes there are children involved and that makes it harder to decide on what to do. Counselling is a great step to take if you want to try to make the relationship work. I gear towards that. But if you feel that councelling will not help you or your wife feels that it will not help then there is that next step. Divorce. Remember yes your son may be hurt, but he is still young. You would be/are hurting yourself by playing along in a marrage that isn't working anymore. RED FLAG-Some relationships bump for a bit when a child is born. It's natural you are adjusting to another person thats come into your world. It's possible she may need one on one therapy and you yourself unless you already recieve it? I don't know. It sounds as if you are eager to fix your relationship, but she is stepping back a bit? Like I had mentioned she may need therapy to get herself back. I had Post Partum depression after I had my daughter and it took a long time to get somewhat balanced.
I am so sorry Checkers, Your relationship can be fixed if both of you are able to work at it. Maybe she just need time? A pregnancy can due alot to a woman. How was the relationship before your son was born? Do you think that is important to take in consideration? I hope to here from you.

I wish the best for you!

Jlove

[Wants2Fly]

No kids and no advice or suggestions. Sounds like you're hurting.
((((((((((((((((((Checkers))))))))))))))))

[Checkers]

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jlove973 said:
A pregnancy can due alot to a woman. How was the relationship before your son was born? Do you think that is important to take in consideration? I hope to here from you.

I wish the best for you!

Jlove

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I do take into account the pregnancy, and it has certainly exacerbated the issues we have between us - but they did exist before he was born.

The real problem is from talking to her I don't feel she is willing to even compromise. For those things she admits need attention, there is a lack of will to fix them, so I just don't know where this will end up.

I've personally made a new patient appointment for the end of this month with a marriage/family therapist. My work schedule allows me to go without telling her about it... and I may not for a while. She's not been very receptive to therapy in the past and right now may not be the best time to deal with a new headache.

In the mean time I'm hoping to find some peace of mind.. maybe.

-C

[sabby]

I'm sorry you are having marital problems. Keeping communication between the 2 of you is very important.

"For those things she admits need attention, there is a lack of will to fix them, so I just don't know where this will end up." - Could it possibly be that she has no idea HOW to fix the problems that she admits to? Many times when we don't know how to fix something, we sweep it under the rug and ignore it. And, many times we are afraid to face the work that we need to do to fix the problem...it can be a scary reality.

I do wish you both well! Good luck with everything!

[Rhapsody]

Dear Checkers,

Your situation sounds just like mine, how my marriage use to be, with me being the one always doing all the work to fix things and to make the marriage last. I had to attend counseling sessions alone for six long years.... which truthfully did me well in the long run, for both my marriage and myself - my husband only started to attend counseling sessions with me within the last two years of it all (8 years in all).

I personally felt that my husband was really sorry and truly did want to change even though he did not always know how to make the change happen for years on end, but finally with many failed attempts and many words said that hurt us both, he (we) finally managed to work through all the hardships, past emotional wounds and a few addictions.... I am glad that I stayed around to fight with my husband and not always against him - no matter how hard life got or how selfish he seemed to act.

I honestly found out (after a few months of counseling together) that my husband needed my help &amp; uncondictional love to enable him to take those first few steps in actually changing the things that he needed to change and in admitting (to him self &amp; me) the HE the MAN / the MALE / the PROVIDER of this marriage and family had failed.... a very hard thing to do.
My husband truly was lost, frightened, angry and scared all at the same time. He feared from within that he was destroying us and that the love we once held for each other was gone forever, and he would be without me one day, due to his own selfish &amp; unloving actions.

Now please keep in mind that while my husband is not perfect and that he still had some matters to work on and some tough wrongs to face up to and to walk through - he is a much better person today...... even if it did take many years to make it all happen.

Please try to hang in there and try to understand that your wife, now a mother, will feel the pull of motherhood for about a good year now until she is able / ready to move onto the next task at hand, and that she needs your support to make this happen and that she still needs your unconditional love to pull it all together, as to make the marriage and family survive the tolls of life and failure.

If you do not mind I would like to add your marriage to my prayer list..... that which I read and pray over every night.

LoVe,
Rhapsody - ((( hugs )))

P.S.
Have YOU ever sit down and wrote out a list of all the wrongs, per your interpretation of the marriage, and have your wife do the same..... then share them with each other? You might be surprised to what each other actually sees as a problem in the marriage (the list is often different for each person involved).

P.S. P.S.

BTW............ did I happen to mention that we have been married now for 20 years, celebrating year number 21 in April 2007 - (so smile ) for you see, there is HOPE!!!

i divorced my wife 6 years ago when my son was 30 months old, long story, not far off what you re experiancing now, if the therapy thing doesnt work out for either of you, get a good lawyer in regards to your child, verbal agreements dont stand up in court in regards to visitation / custody. trust me on this if you dont do it right the first time, there is no second chance and you will be setting yourself up for a whole world of hurt in the years to come, you will have to come to some kind of amicable agreement with your wife regarding your child, so when / if the sh.it hits the fan and you split you still have a solid plan in regards to the child, make a appointment with a lawer to see what options are open to you in regards to this,
good luck and i hope you never have to use any of this advice

[justaguy]

hay dude are you sure that your wife isnt thinking that your ready to bail and figures that shed be stupid to invest in your relationship???? try acting the way you want your relationship to be for awhile.dont argue its only selfeshness. express how you feel with like im lonely or im hurting im sure you get the picture. as far as kids growing up with single parent homes well i spend alot of taxes on new prisons and rehabs the truth is all around you

[Checkers]

Thanks to everyone for the advice and support. I'm going to do my best to preserve our relationship, but I also want to be sure the worst case scenario is considered. Truthfully I am more worried about the consequences to my wife at this point... I know she would be hurt to know I am even having this discussion, but if she isn't willing to at least work with me on fixing our problems, I'm not sure what to do.

Should I have to be miserable for the long run so she will be happier in the short run? In part I feel I'm being incredibly selfish, but at what point is it fair for me to ask that my own needs in the relationship be met?

-C

[Checkers]

So I went in (alone) to talk with a marriage therapist. I actually received more validation than I'd expected, though I'm not sure how to take it. A large part of me wishes my relationship issues were entirely my own problem, which would put any potential resolution squarely on my own shoulders.

My wife was receptive, to a point. I didn't go into details on the session, I know how she'd react. First she was upset that I thought our issues were extreme enough to actually go... she said she'd go, but made it clear I shouldn't expect any changes. There is a lot of resistance, but at least she's agreed to go through the motions.

Of course, it's going to be a month before she gets an appointment for various reasons. I still don't feel she's taking this seriously and honestly at this point I'm not sure whether I feel better or worse.

-C

[breemarie]

I'm sorry you are having so many problems in your marriage. I was wondering what are the changes that you want your wife to make that she is resistant to.

[Checkers]

Well first of all it would be nice if she could acknowledge the importance of what I'm going through, even if she personally finds my objections trivial.

Specifically she tends to be extremely exhausted on a regular basis. She believes this is exclusively because of working and breastfeeding, and there is nothing she can do. She may be right... however she does noting to attempt a change. I've suggested blood testing to make sure her iron levels are good, or in case she's got thyroid issues (something the therapist actually suggested independently of my own thoughts) - this didn't go over well. I've suggested more exercise, etc... no go.

-C

boy, i sure can understand your frustration. i breast fed and worked......sounds like she needs a really good medical/mind checkup....it's hard to be the one that wants to work on the problem and the mate doesn't even see the problem. xoxoxo pat

[Checkers]

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fayerody said:
boy, i sure can understand your frustration. i breast fed and worked......sounds like she needs a really good medical/mind checkup....it's hard to be the one that wants to work on the problem and the mate doesn't even see the problem. xoxoxo pat

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I appreciate that... and you've nailed pretty much how I feel about this whole situation. Not only does she not see the problem (or at least, not all of it), she considers it a trivial issue. She thinks of what she does understand to be my "obsession".

-C

I was in an physcially abusive marriage for 12 years, so when I had my son it gave me courage to get a divorce. So I divorced when my son was under a year. I don't recomend divorce - but in my case it was essential.
My son adjusted because he didn't know any different. I consulted with T because I wanted to do the best for my son. So I worked hard at inviting my ex and his sign. other for holidays, birthdays and other outings, school stuff. When my son was in the hospital several times - my out of town ex and sign other stayed at my house.The T told me that it was important for my son to get the opportunity to have both of his parents doing family things together - or my son would always "long" for this. So there were breakfasts together at my house with his Dad, myself and the sign other. Just normal type things that families do.

In my case, I will tell you the weekends away with his dad sometimes resulted in my son being out of sync. It couldn't be helped I'm not saying that. But sometimes after vistation, I would put him in the car and just drive until he relaxed or I would rock him - that was in the early years. The school year was the most diffcult because my ex didn't support my son doing homework, or studying or even sleeping so my son often did poorly in school. It may also mean taking your child's friends for vistation along for company later in the teen years.

My son was probably the most adjusted child from divorce that you could find so the effort was worth it. Most people couldn't tell that he was from a divorce situation because it was early on. However, the toll it had on me was great.

If your marriage can be worked out, the effort may well be worth the effort since divorce is an even geater effort.

I should mention that my ex's physical abuse was always aimed at women - never children. And there were many sign. others from my ex that my son had to get used to.

I hope that this helps... I wish you the absolute best, my heart goes out to both you and your wife that you find yourselves at this point...

Sincerely,
freewill

[justaguy]

dude i once agian dont think you get it so fill a bag of sand (15lb) and carry it around alday work clean puta close pin on your nipple for 30min every few hrs. oh jog to the store to get that milk... inject yourself with whatever hormone imbalances occur in women aftre child birth. and yes in a year most of her problems will go away on threir own but will yours i still havent gotten over your referral to your baby as less than alive try giving him/her a bath and enjoy better yet embrace the changes in your life. if you dont well youll be sorry

[Checkers]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
justaguy said:
dude i once agian dont think you get it so fill a bag of sand (15lb) and carry it around alday work clean puta close pin on your nipple for 30min every few hrs. oh jog to the store to get that milk... inject yourself with whatever hormone imbalances occur in women aftre child birth. and yes in a year most of her problems will go away on threir own but will yours i still havent gotten over your referral to your baby as less than alive try giving him/her a bath and enjoy better yet embrace the changes in your life. if you dont well youll be sorry

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The only part of your rant that actually applies to reality is the breastfeeding reference. The rest is spoken from ignorance alone.

-C

you know, Checkers, you got a lot more responses than some threads do and plenty of good suggestions.

i actually agree with "justaguy" because being pregnant and having a baby and breastfeeding is very hard. how much have you done to look at it from that perspective?

and i do applaud the fact that you're working on it, but after reading your answer to "justaguy"......i'm not sure that i feel like i am getting the whole story on the marriage. i may be wrong and we can talk about it......do you have a short fuse? xoxox pat

[Checkers]

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fayerody said:
you know, Checkers, you got a lot more responses than some threads do and plenty of good suggestions.

i actually agree with "justaguy" because being pregnant and having a baby and breastfeeding is very hard. how much have you done to look at it from that perspective?

and i do applaud the fact that you're working on it, but after reading your answer to "justaguy"......i'm not sure that i feel like i am getting the whole story on the marriage. i may be wrong and we can talk about it......do you have a short fuse? xoxox pat

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Not at all. I simply don't find justaguy's responses to be particularly helpful, whether on my thread or elsewhere. He makes assumptions that are incorrect and proceeds from that faulty point of view. Since I've tried to correct him once already, I feel his presence is less condusive to resolution that it is antagonistic in nature.

So how about some background.. my wife does not jog to the store for milk, or pick up the house, or carry around the child on a constant basis. If a special trip to the store is needed - I go. Otherwise we have weekly grocery shopping together. Since I AM appreciative of both what she went through before, during, and after the pregnancy, I happen to perform the necessary housework (admittedly not too much in an apartment).

What is more, my wife doesn't have to change a diaper when I'm home. I help in every feeding - I change him, bring him to the bedroom, burp him between breasts, make his bottle (we suppliment), feed him the bottle, and put him back down. Not once a day, not taking turns - EVERY time. He now sleeps through the night, but there were evenings when I would handle the midnight feeding alone so my wife could get more rest.

When he wakes up late at night, I handle it. Most of the time we bathe him together, but I have done it alone to save time or rest.

I am the first thing my son sees in the morning - he smiles and even tries to laugh (getting there) every time and I wouldn't trade that for anything.

So look... I'm not resentful of what I do, nor do I consider it more than "my share". It is only my job as a Father. And of course you have no reason to believe me, and that will be up to you (and others).

This is however what I do... I love my family and I am trying to do what it takes to keep us whole. So no I don't appreciate it when someone implies I couldn't care less about my wife or my son. Personally I think that is fair.

-C

[justaguy]

i read that and its ok that you dont agree but now it seem your asking for a pat on the back for doing what your saposed to do... as far as the jugging to the store the referance was the strain on her body to make that milk in the furture ill try to be more direct {gee what hormone makes milk?} i know i destroyed my moms teeth im sure it was easy on her ups sarcasm slipped out

checkers, i'm rreally happy that you do all of that. you must have an incredible bond with your baby. i'm sorry that you're so unhappy and i'm bowing out of this thread.........i hope things go well for you in whatever your choices are......pat