Marriage separation after deployment

Hi sophiesmom, like you, I don't know. I do understand what you are saying.

However, on reading about DadFMF experiences, actions speak. She's either 'married' or she's not ...

QUOTE=Erebos;5534998]Dad, the reason she there waS no talk of your marriage during her call is because she has everything right where she needs it.
A compliant and free babysitter so she is free to go to work,or go out with her fella.
She isn't interested in progressing your marriage or fixing it. But as I have said before, denial is part of the grieving process so take all the time you need.
Just don't stop doing things for yourself.
Take care.

Profound, did you consider that his messing around has stopped because your separated and he no longer feels driven to go out and do these things.I might also be inclined to say cheating is something you are inclined to do or not. It rarely changes.
I find rarely does returning to the previous failed situation result in a new out come. Still all the best,[/QUOTE]

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Erebos, I hear you. Believe or not, I am not in the 'trust' stage of this situation. And i am sorry that more details were not posted here at PC over the years, but as specific details grew messy and very private, I had to take it 'offline.' At the time, with those details, anyone knowing us would have identified us.

As you know, trust takes the hardest hit with infidelity &/or 'midlife mayhem'. I don't assume anything re cheating (or otherwise??), which is telling. This means regardless of my tone, my efforts & 'hope', that there is an area where suspicion lives in my mind. We all have instinct & I have put my whole situation under a microscope.

It's just that I am giving this a chance with professional help & guidance. I have chosen to do so because I think of myself as a 'lay person' of course re: psychology related matters. My logic is that those who have studied psychology ... human behaviour & the human mind extensively, are in a better position than I, to access situations like these. Apart from that, they are also NOT part, of it on an emotional level. So although I didn't start thinking about therapy when the chaos was rampant, I made that decision years later (after the acting out seemed to be *running out of steam which made me even *MORE confused! I couldn't always differentiate what I was learning about at the support group & elsewhere, & the behaviour ''morphing back a little to what was familiar. It was at that point that I begin to play with the idea of getting help.

I simply couldn't access the situation. My spouse couldn't either (we had the most explosive arguments at one phase ... clearly, all of our hurts over the years emerged in those 'raging with emotional fuel words'. Afterward, we had hit the wall - HARD, were no closer to a solution & in some cases seemed to have made it worse than before ).
Since I didn't have confidence re accessing it - I called in the pros. My spouse seemed to think that he could simply slide back into the marriage as tho nothing had happened. I refused this notion. I had also changed - i very rarely stood up to him.

My 'staying power' so far, I admit has to do with my lack of confidence to make right decision (there is A LOT of stuff on midlife out there. A lot that I still have to examine and check on. And also we have been married for 'this long' (nearly 'silver,' so its been a few years !) Should I walk now? Only to find out that had I held on a little bit longer that it stood a chance?

I know the odds are stacked against. I see the numbers in a our support group but some have succeeded thro effective & honest dialog. If my man child has grown up, has matured, resolved inner conflict - after all this expression of, then maybe we could start healing by being honest & open ( I was never assertive). If his character is weak after our last attempt to sort things out because it was never strong to begin with - & not the result of someone gone temp. crazy on reaching mid life, only to perceive his life as failure, with NO time left, then, I know I could leave (without any "what ifs").

I continue to work toward my own independence as I write here. I haven't had luck with work as I am capable of only junior admin stuff (which reminds me, I intended to peek at those forums here).

He will be fine. He's qualified and after many years of employment issues he's finally getting back on his feet 'bigtime,' unlike me (& he NEEDS to work. His value & worth is so attached to it - part of the reason that he 'cracked,' & ended up doing "what he wanted" as tho there was NO tomorrow). However, I don't feel the way i did years ago. And it is exactly because part of me does not trust completely, that I still continue to try re my $$, my friends - my life.

If all good - we're on. If not, I'm fine.
(hope this makes more sense (?) & will try to update on my thread in future, so that sequence of events reads in more coherent way)

DadFMF, keep on keeping on. Take care of yourself

I have only read the first and last pages of this thread, so sorry if I am off base in my comment.

You mentioned she is in nursing school. I am in my late 30's and graduated from nursing school over a year ago. I am trying to understand how she has time for nursing school, which is literally like a full-time job (and then some) on it's own, kids, did you say she works? as well as all of the hanging out she does. I only worked part-time while in school, have no kids, am not married, and I didn't have time to get enough sleep let alone time to go out with friends--and those friends were my classmates!

Anyway. I probably don't have anything super helpful to say. I do feel like, if I were married and back in school, the LAST thing I would want to do is go through a divorce on top of it all, especially if it would screw with a) child care--huge b) my time c) my financial status d) my student loan status (though she gets more aid as a single parent). Essentially, I wouldn't want anything to mess with the status quo. I have no idea what she's thinking, but it seems reasonable. I agree with everyone else, take care of you. I feel like you're not going to get anywhere trying to hash it out with her.

So what it boils down to is....should I wait it out and hope that a miracle happens or end it??

I do think it's rather dangerous for people here to tell you what she's thinking or doing. They are speaking from their own experiences and based on what YOU are saying.

We are not neutral marriage counselors who are speaking to both of you at the same time.

I'm sorry. I am having issues with some of this..."advice".

Good luck in your decision. I am sorry for your troubles.

I think she already has ended it. There's probably no way you would ever really trust her again. For some reason she's stalling about initiating divorce. You can pursue that without waiting for her, though you don't have to. You could simply hang back . . . not hoping for what's beyond unlikely . . . but just because no law says you have to do anything.

I was looking up legal separation, and, from what I read, I don't think it would accomplish anything better that what you already have, which is an informal separation. Here's the article:

Benefits and Disadvantages of Legal Separation (vs. Divorce)

If she already has ended it I need to see legal documents that say absolute divorce on them.

I didn't say your wife terminated the marriage. Only a judge can do that. Your wife, however, has deserted you. She has abandoned the marital relationship. She left the home or apartment where the both of you were legally domiciled. She left and and set up a new place of residence to which you do not have a key. You are her husband, but you are not a member of her household. What she's done is extremely decisive. But I misspoke if it sounded like I was saying that she's made an irrevocable move. Marriage is a legal contract. Right now, your wife is in default with respect to fulfilling her obligations, as a wife. That's what I meant by saying she has ended it. But it's not for me to say that she couldn't have a change of heart tomorrow, or next month, or next year. If you want to leave the door open for the possibility of that happening, you have every right to do that.

DadFMF,

Thats exactly what I said to my husband during one of our 'conversations' sometime ago.

I told him that he "left the marriage" (which he did not appreciate). I explained to him that we were only legally married (as he was cake eating). Emotionally, he had decided to spread his wings, was interested in his own space. That is not a marriage - she's either with you in the HOME (as a wife & mother) or she's not. She cannot have her cake & eat it too. Your wife has left - maybe not on paper but emotionally she's gone.

I know this from my personal experience. I 'held my ground' when I told my husband he left ... & in the end he understood exactly what I meant because he knew how he was thinking, what he wanted & what he was doing at the time. My dilemma is unlike yours because of the ongoing 'midlife debate' of which we are part. My husband is over 50. At this time, I await 'my jury' re: was his behaviour a character flaw or a symptom of midlife crisis? This, I will post on a thread in about week, as I do not want to 'hijack your thread,' with issues that are not specifically your own.

You need to press on with your own life, your own business & personal affairs. That can't hurt anyway! 'Time waits for no one' - You are losing time re: her, time she is not losing re: you! Time meant for you - time you give of yourself as a father (which will be better if you take care of you - an unhappy, frustrated parent will also impact on the children & not only you)

You mentioned investing in the marriage before ... Invest in yourself. Regardless of how things unfold (with her in future??? without? ), that is one investment that you & your children will benefit from - BIGTIME.

I really understand what you are saying. I'm trying to move on with my life. Joined softball leagues, gym, concentrating on work, spending time with my children but I'm lonely. I'm in the military and I can't just start seeing other people. If I get caught doing that, I could be charged under the UCMJ for adultery and lose money, my rank and career. It's not worth it. My wife can cheat, sleep around and she has no repurcussions. Either way, I'm not ready to move on to the next woman. I'm trying my hardest to change my flaws even though what she is doing isn't right. My therapist asked me a great question. She asked "How long would you wait on your wife" I told her a few months to see where it goes, because I have to live my life as well and can't be in limbo. She stated "It seems by what you just said, you already gave up". She told me you can't put a time limit on love. You have to be patient. She also said she didn't expect me to wait more than a year but to keep the contact about the children, stop communicating with her in regards to the marriage and SHOW HER YOU CAN CHANGE BY YOUR ACTIONS. This made sense to me as I pleaded, begged and it made me looked pathetic . This is my second marriage and my first wife cheated on me while I was deployed in Iraq in 2003. It's just a crappy situation to be in again. I was only married 3 years the first time but 10 years this time. She did a 180 on me while I was gone and found happiness after the last few years of us going through the motions. I wish I would have tried as hard as i am now back then... to be honest I just hate my life right now. It's hard to focus on my kids cause they remind me of my wife. Even songs on the radio or stores we used to go into reminds me of her.

ok DadFMF, it is I who now sees what you are saying. I am happy to hear that you are moving on but am really sorry to read of your overall situation (2nd cheating spouse, loneliness & children who remind you of life w/her). This must be very disheartening. I can understand why it is hard to focus.

These facts can't change of course, it's part of your history now.

I am not qualified to help here but moving forward, maybe you can replace some of those things with your own. Do things with your kids that 'belong to you (& to them).' In time it may begin to feel that way.

• Experiences/activities you did together with her,
• Experiences/activities she does with them &
• Experiences/activities they do with you

- all separate units, unique to each.

Where companionship is concerned, this one is tricky & complex. Again, I am not qualified here but just 'thinking aloud' as it were ...
(BTW, you are right, re:NOT worth your career - that's your investment),

Moving forward you may really have to scrutinize the women you meet.
They seem to want a nice guy with whom they enjoy some benefit(s), (or they wouldn't have gone with you) but still do their own thing, 'cake-eating'.

• Is there a certain type of woman that you are attracted to? Or something about their personalities ?
• Is there a group or network in the military where other officers have similar experiences like your own? It might be good to seek not only the current cases but the past ones to learn how they were resolved.
• What are key differences re the impact on military who have separated & those who have divorced, from military's perspective?

So far you are on right track & not doing badly given how painful your experiences are. Be mindful moving forward though re both career & potentially deceitful, crafty women ... I am glad you are not ready for other women anyway. You really need the time to heal.

Wish I could be or more help - but will check on you again. take care

I did not know that a person in the military can be punished for adultery. Thank you for explaining that. That might be why your wife is so nonchalant. As you say, she is not subject to legal repercussions, but you are - big time. To my mind, that makes what she is doing seem even meaner.

Your counselor knows you better than I do, but I wonder about her point of view also. Saying "you can't put a time limit on love" strikes me as expecting a heroic commitment from you to a person who seems to have no great sense of commitment, if any. You and your counselor know more about the circumstances of the marriage and what stresses on the relationship that may have been caused by you. And you don't have to go into anymore detail than you want to. The fact that this is your second time facing possible marital failure gives me the idea that you do have a problem in your relationships with woman. That could mean you have work to do on yourself. Alternatively, it could mean you gravitate toward women who don't make good marriage material. I would ask you to consider both possibilities. And it doesn't have to be an "either or" scenario. Maybe both those things are true. You seem to be very quick to take the blame. And your therapist seems very quick to think you are the one who needs to change. Of course, helping you try to change is how your therapist makes a living.

We all need to work on ourselves. You've sounded pretty patient to me. You are only human and a person can only take so much rejection. If your wife has some legitimate major grievance that could explain her going this far in her behavior, then it might be wise to try and resolve that . . . . if it can be resolved. Even if you were very wrong, in some way, your wife may have passed the point of being open to reconciliation. That's how it's been sounding to me. But I don't know this woman. You do. I'm not seeing where she still feels any love for you, but what do I know? If she would ruin your career over you being with someone else, when she is refusing to be with you, then I don't think this is a woman with much of a heart. But, like I say, I don't know her.

Loneliness is about the worst thing in the world. There is no amount of club joining and recreational activity that fills the emptiness of not being loved and cared about. At least, not when you're as young as you are. I expect to lose my boyfriend within the next few years because he is in seriously failing health. But I'm at the stage of life where friendships will be what I look forward to when he is gone. I have no desire to find someone to replace him. That is the good thing about being at the stage of life I'm at. However, when I was your age, I found being alone almost unendurable. My guy and me had very serious ups and downs . . . split ups and reunions. TBH, it was about as crazy a relationship as it gets . . . at times. I even left him and had other relationships. But I came back. So it's true that women sometimes do come back, even after there have been other men. I never completely stopped loving him, even though I got to a point where I completely could not put up with chronic drunkeness or chronic criticism. He's sober 20 years now. People do get through some awful ordeals and manage to save relationships that might have seemed doomed. Sometimes, when a woman (or a man) is frustrated or hurt long enough, she (or he) will find some way to even the score. Sometimes that has to happen before things can be turned around. Whether or not a bad situation can be turned around depends, I guess, on how much love was there in the first place.

Having said all of this stuff, you may reach a point where - for the sake of your military career (as well as your sanity) - you may have to initiate divorce proceedings. I suggest you google "marital abandonment" and "constructive abandonment." Also, google how those concepts apply specifically in your state. And please have a lawyer that you are talking to. Who knows what your wife may accuse you of tomorrow, or at some time in the future. There is something fishy about her not wanting to pursue either divorce, or counseling.

I agree Rose. I don't understand either. A good example of her attitude happened today. My kids had baseball practice at 5 PM. So I went to the practice at 5 PM to meet her so I can see my kids practice. She didn't show up. I called her and asked her if she was bringing the kids because it was 10 after five. She said that she did not know about the practice because I did not tell her and that she never had the coaches phone number. She goes on blaming me for hurting the children because I didn't go to practice. I ended up finding the text message I sent her with the times of the practice and the coaches phone number and she never replied after that. It just goes to show you she blames me for everything that goes wrong when I did nothing wrong at all this time. I'm really considering divorce at this point because I don't think my situation is going to get any better. And I definitely can't make a marriage work by myself

No you can't. It takes two.

You might also need a new therapist, or a break from therapy altogether, for a while. There are some things that no one can figure out for you, or even help you to figure out. I did years and years of therapy. I found it to be least useful, when I had a real crisis that required a major change in my approach to what I was handling. Therapy is supposed to be about change and growth, but - oddly - I found it tended to keep me spinning my wheels, if I was in the midst of a crisis. Therapists don't want to encourage radical change where there is risk. They don't want that responsibility. I don't blame them. They don't want to instigate the termination of a marriage where children are involved. For that matter, neither do I. That's one of those decisions that you have to make alone.

Therapists are very invested in the proposition that people are fixable . . . that relationships are fixable. That's how they make their livelihood. A century ago a troubled person would "take it to the Lord in prayer." Today, that has been replaced by "go to therapy and work on it with your therapist." And people expect more out of therapists than they would have expected out of Almighty God (if they were religious.) Never feel you have to have a therapist's permission to move forward. Being an adult means that, sometimes, it's all up to you and not up to anyone else. Some of my most important decisions were ones I made without getting anyone's blessing on. Maybe they weren't always perfect decisions, but they were mine to make, and I made them. If it's your sincere intention to be fair and responsible, you'll come to a conclusion you can live with.

She wasn't saying that I should stay married whatsoever. What she is said is not to give up so quick, be patient and try to give it some time. She also said that she would work with me to be a better man for the next relationship if my marriage didn't work. She was being very impartial to everything. I actually switched therapists once. The one I have now seems very enthusiastic about helping me get through things. I understand my marriage might be over, but I seen marriages work when one person puts in the effort and by action ended up getting their spouse back. I wasn't perfect in my marriage. I was lazy, never wanted to do what she wanted to do, texted another female...I put myself in her sposition and I could now see why she felt the way she did. If I wouldn't have done any of that, I wouldn't be in the position I am today and I know that for a fact. I know everyone on this board says to move on, divorce because that's the easiest thing to do. I see a lot of people on this forum giving up on their marriage because things are bad at the moment or they don't hear what they want to hear from their spouse. Strong marriages are because couples got through the tough challenging times. Am I saying that my marriage is going to work, no im not. All of this could be a wasted effort, but it's not wasted if you care and really do want to make the effort. I also seen where one spouse HATES the other, and within a year they found love again.

Guess my point is, is that people tend to give up so easy on their marriage. When I made a vow, I planned on sticking with it as long as I can until all options are exhausted. I'm not going to wait forever but I also don't want to give up too soon. I know for a fact that she will not initiate the divorce. Besides the medical benefits that she receives from me being in the military and the over a grand I give her for my children a month, she pays all of her own bills. She works 3 jobs now, going to school and takes care of our children. I could respect that but I feel things would have been easier if we put all of our problems, put them on the table and live a good life. We would be set. If she doesn't want that, only time will tell.

Divorce isn't the easiest way. None of your options are easy. I think, on this thread, we've tried to appreciate everything you've shared. You're the person in the situation. It's your call. If you think you can rekindle the love, then - by all means - work on that. Boredom can definitely kill a marriage. If you think you failed to put enough energy into the marriage, maybe that's something you can change.

As you say, time will tell.

The only thing I hate is the fact she didn't even give us a chance when I got back. I'm just at a crossroad. Her mother even said to me again yesterday that her daughter loves me and she has never seen her love a man like she loves me. She gave me a lot of words of encouragement. She even told her mom on numerous occasions that she didn't want the rest of her family(Grandma, aunts,uncles ect) to know that we are separated in case we do get back together, she didn't want them to look at me differently. Her family is involved with Kingdom Hall (Jehovah Witness) but my wife was disfellowshiped when she got got pregnant before we where married. I really wish she would get right with God again to help guide her instead of having those negative influences she is hanging around.

listening to her mother is not healthy, I am sorry but she can't possibly know if her daughter loves you. Your wife has proven herself to be incredibly clever when it comes to her self preservation, she knows what to say to keep everyone on side.She has experienced the backlash before of stepping out of line with her families beliefs and she is smart e not to do it again.
Mother in Law telling you what you want to hear is not supportive, your wife knows she will pass on the message and DiD you even hear what you just wrote?
She doesn't want her family to know incase you get back together.
Translation: just keep him on the back burner in case I fk this up too.Also she knows her family will pressure her into going back to you, you said yourself they are heavily religious,she probably just doesn't want the earache.

And If she did come back to you, she'll probably be resentful and embittered because things didn't turn out how she wanted.
You want to be her last option?
I dunno I guess if your happy so long as she is with you, wether she truly wants to be or not at least you'll be happy.
Have you always been so single minded almost blinkered in your views?

What I mean is, your wife is reaching out for support from these other people because they support her TRUE intentions.
Why do you think she doesn't turn to her family?
She knows what they will say, they will want her to work on her marriage. That isn't what she,wants and she obviously does NOT want people around her giving her that advice.

She has surrounded herself with people who she feels will support her decision to break free and move on.
Wishing for it to be something else is futile.

The more you tell us about your wife and this situation, the more intelligent she appears and the more well planned this seems to have been.

Whilst I was always aware she had orchestrated this carefully, I had underestimated the depth and complexities of hurdles she was going to encounter. She has done an excellent job of keeping everything absolutely in her control and moving at her pace.

I am sorry you find yourself no further forward, continue to go to counselling, keep doing things for yourself, I still think you need to extricate yourself from her mother a bit more. Is there not a pastor or someone you could go too?
Please take care of yourself.

P.s did it occur to you that her families beliefs are exactly the reason she doesn't want to be the one to petition for a divorce.
Now that you have brought into light the moral standing of her family. A lot more of what she is doing makes sense.
You might also consider this when our speak to her, taking off the pressure might result in her being more forth coming with telling you what she really wants.

Or has she told you and you are just not hearing her?

Maybe you could meditate on that for a while.

Take Care.

There is support and there is....opinion...from a bunch of strangers that you, OP, DO NOT KNOW!

People speaking here know NOTHING of you or your situation.

NOTHING.

And anyone you know could find this thread with a simple search....is that what you want to happen? Maybe....

I'm out. This is all too annoying to me.

Sophie, I'm here because I am lost, looking for support. I obviously need help, which brings me to this site. All I see is bad outcomes. I have yet to see a good outcome. It's just a place for me to vent about my frustrations.

Hi Dad
read through most of the threads... don't make any rash decisions, take your time with it. yes 10 years is alot of investment in another person, but it takes 2 people to try to make things work.

like the other's said. self care is so impt right now and being there for your kids....

yes its hard with kids involved...but kids are adaptable, and its better to be apart than to be in a marriage just for the sake of the kids, i know you still love her, i think your just struggling with the fact that your marriage could be really over...

like said earlier take your time, grieve if you have too. but most importantly look after yourself and your kids

My kids have their first baseball practice today. She is supposed to be there. This will be the first time physically seeing her and being around her since I left for deployment. This is going to be really ackward

You can handle it!

To game. At first we seen each other she said on the bleachers and I kind a stood on the side, but then I notice she started texting people Amy just made me feel uncomfortable knowing that she might be Texan other men. So I ended up leaving. Right now it's hard to be around all of that