[SeptemberMorn]

Do you ever wonder how it came to be that you're in a confusing mental state? That's where I am right now.

Yesterday was the birthday party of my oldest son's boy. He turns 14 on Hallowe'en. It is also one of the two times that I see my ex in a year's time. Just a couple of days prior, I was talking to a friend and as usual, bath mouthing my ex. There has been a lot of resentment, hurt and anger stored up in me yet from my 12 year marriage to him. He was very controlling and emotionally/verbally abusive.

As I've stated before, his marriage to his third wife has, on the whole, been a payback for what he did to me and my kids. I've rubbed my hands and grinned vicious smiles as I hear what she's done to him and how she's managed to get the upper hand in HER control over him. Payback has been delicious to me... in the past.

Yesterday was another matter. The man had a quadruple bypass some 10 yrs ago although it feels like just the other day to me. He has consistently gained weight since before that. He must weigh 400 lbs if he weighs an ounce.

It had trickled down to me that he wasn't doing very well yesterday but I had not seen him since he was inside and I was outside enjoying the block party. The first I saw him was when he was coming out the front door of my son's house, using his cane and being very unsure of the steps he was taking. His wife wasn't 5 feet away from him, but she didn't even turn around to look at him. It was my son that have him his hand to help him down the last step.

The man was walking death! In those short minutes of him coming out the door and getting into the passanger side of his car was enough for me to see that this mean ogre I had been married to was a broken man, and to boot, on death's door.

How anyone, especially his doctor, had not even thought of testing him for diabetes is beyond anyone's comprehension! Someone related to me that his blood sugar was running at 400. One hundred hits borderline diabetes. He was on the verge of a diabetic coma!

You know what? Enough is enough! This goes way over and above payback! If I had wished payback for him, I would have called a halt to it years ago! Through some questioning and evesdropping to a conversation between my husband and my daughter, my ex's wife is killing him through neglect and hatefulness!

There's no way for me to know what my husband was thinking and feeling, but it was his choice to call my daughter and find out where in the loop she fits in. I have since talked to our youngest, my present husband and my child, because I heard that he had talked to my ex for a while. Then I talked to my oldest son (it's his dad). Everyone is in agreement that between my ex's wife and the doctor, my ex is being helped into the grave.

So... what am I feeling? Is it pity? Pity implies either tender or a slightly contemptous component. I have neither feeling. I married him because I pitied him and confused it with love. Compasion implies pity coupled with an urgent desire to aid or to spare. Is it compassion I feel? I don't know. I know that injustice in any form angers me to the point of rage! I'll own that one!! You bet!! Is that why I want this evil woman turned in for elder abuse? Is that why I want my ex's kids to fight for the money that she wants from the sale of the condo that her and my ex bought together?

I know none of this is my responsibility. It's actually none of my business... except that what is left of this man happens to be the father of two of my children; it affects them and it affects their kids. It even affects my youngest son which in turn affects me, too. Not to mention that I have a history with this man, no matter how ugly is was.

So, can I say "forgiveness"? It certainly isn't "indifference" anymore! I feel compassion for this shell of a man... and where did THAT come from??? And WHY??

I've done all I feel I can do for now. I've written my oldest son an email and filled him in about all the advantages of Medicare, both medical and personal. My ex can have a Personal Provider like I have to help him with all of his personal needs including diet. He can have a visiting nurse come check on him. Etc, etc, etc. I've told my son that if he needs any more help, I'm behind him all the way.

Why do I feel I want to do more???? Could it possibly be that I saw myself when I saw him come out of that door, almost dead yet having to fend for himself... alone... feeling unloved and uncared for? Was it my imagination or did I really see a fleeting look of hope on his face when he gave me a quick glance? Do I need to find out... or do I need to leave it alone, not go there? Why the holy hell am I in tears???????

[(JD)]

I guess it's from the nurturing spirit and a bit of denial also?

Please ... take care of yourself and don't get re-involved in this man's life.
Being able to get through that, and hopefully have different attitude in the future sounds good for you, imo.

[SeptemberMorn]

What do you think I'm denying?

Are you talking about my attitude towards him in the past... or now?

[(JD)]

past. you gotta be denying some of the past... don't cha think?

[sabby]

(((((((((((((( Tomi )))))))))))))

I am in the same type of situation with my first ex and my children. I said when we divorced that he would end up a lonely and sick old man before his time and that's exactly what has happened.

Through the years, when the girls needed help with dealing with his abusive ways (emotional, physical, alcohol etc) I have always made myself available. Regardless of what he has become, he is still their father (for what he's worth).

Even though there were hard times and feelings between us in the past, I have to admit, when I see him looking like the shell of a man that he is, it tugs at my heart strings. It's not that I have any feelings for him, but just that he is a human being and I hate to see human beings suffering, regardless of who or what they are. I would assume that you too feel the same way.

I don't think it's unusual at all for you to feel the way you are. Remember, even though you learned that you married him for what you "thought" was love....you still married him and had a relationship with this man. And, even though you are angry over how he hurt you, when a person is compassionate, it's hard not to feel some sort of sad feelings for what he is now going through.

Does that mean that you need to get involved more than in a supportive role for your children through this? Absolutely NOT. Does it mean you are a bad person for not getting more involved? Absolutely NOT.

Be a mom....be supportive of what your kids are dealing with and say a prayer for your ex.....For that is what your compassion brings to you.



sabby

[SeptemberMorn]

You must mean the fact that I took my vows seriously and was for 11 yrs totally commited to him. I'm not denying that at all. Just didn't mention it. I didn't think it was necessary. I've been Indifferent to him for the past 30 yrs and that was from the bottom of my heart. It was the best I could do for myself and for my kids.

[SeptemberMorn]

Now who is in who's head?

I made the same statement to my ex; that he would die a sick, lonely man. There's no satisfaction in that prophecy now, though.

I used to badmouth him to my kids in my effort to make them see that he really wasn't a good father and for them to watch themselves. Finally, one of them told me "You know, Mom. We know Dad is an as$hole, but he's OUR as$hole, so just please stop talking bad about him to us or in front of us." Was that ever an awakening! I stopped.

Exactly, Jean, it's Human Compassion I feel for him. I would have felt the same way no matter who it was that had walked through that door like he did. The only difference here is that my oldest son shared with me his concern for his dad and the hate that he feels for his dad's wife. There's a long line of people that feel the way we do.

It must be that what I saw affects my kids so much that it has intensified my compassion for him... and for my kids.

My ex's youngest daughter was close friends with my youngest for a while. Just remembered that last night. It's no wonder that it affects my youngest, too. My ex has always been fair with my youngest. There was a time that I hated and resented the fact that he called him "son." Didn't claim him as such, but included him when he was around my other two.

Oh, GEEEEZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!! What a tangled web! We'll get through this, somehow.

[SeptemberMorn]

My oldest son just called me. His dad is in the hospital in the CCU. They've got his sugar down to 197 from 400 but he's got accute renal failure. If his kidneys don't improve in the next couple of days, they'll be doing dialysis.

Between my oldest son and his half-sister, they got my ex to fill out an Advance Medical Directive taking all and any rights away from his wife. Good for them!!

I'm shaking!! It doesn't sound good at all to me! Wish my son didn't have to go through this. Jerry has said that we're going to visit my ex in the hospital tomorrow. Not sure I want to see him like he is... but I think he needs to know that someone cares.

WOW!!! Not only do we still laugh exactly the same but we have most of the same illnesses. It's just too trippy!!

Please keep us all in your prayers... especially my ex.

I can't believe I just typed that!

[SeptemberMorn]

Guess no one really gives a damn or wants to listen to an old woman having trouble with her emotions about and ex-husband.

WHATEVER!!

[Fuzzybear]

((((((((((((((((( Tomi ))))))))))))))))))

[bebop]

tomi I just now came across this thread. not sure why I didn't see it before. I think what you are feeling is human compassion. I know kind of what you are going thru. I left my late husband in 97. I moved out of state and didn't have alot of contact with him later. I loved him with all my heart. I was totally and completely devoted to him. his drinking got to me and I could not take it anymore. I saw him a couple of times in the years before he passed and he had gained so much weight from the beer and looked horrible. walking dead man like you say. When I found out he was so sick I rushed back to Ga to be with him. he had remarried his first wife with an agreement that he be able to drink all he wanted. she padlocked him in the house every day with 3 cases of beer knowing he was sick. she would take off with her bf and leave him like that. I got to him 2 days before he died. I am so glad I went to see him. I was the last person he spoke to and he told me he loved me. it was tough.

I really think Jerry is right. you should go see him. if this is his time to go you need maybe to say goodbye. maybe even tell him you forgive him. even if you don't really for his peace of mind at this time. I think it could be healing for you both. that is just my opinion though. hang in there hon.

[SeptemberMorn]

Thank you for responding, Be. I'm really having a tough time with my emotions. The daughter he had with this wife and I talked for a long time this morning. It's almost like I was talking to another daughter. She looks and sounds just like the daughter I had with this man. The only difference is that she's blonde.

We not only talked about "Dad" and his quirks, but we talked about her testifying at her uncle's trial. He was found guilty of child sexual abuse... so we talked about that. My daughter told her about mine so she knows. It was tough, but I didn't break down.

All of my upbrining interfered with my emotions. Why would I give this woman any support? She was born out of wedlock to my EX for heaven's sake. But I can't deny my feelings for her, either!

Even she thinks that her mother is helping her dad to die with her nastiness and her neglect. I can't tell her how I feel about her mother and I sure can't act like I care more for her dad than I do. You're right. It's Human Compassion and I have to make sure I get that across... nothing else.

Yet, I've felt my anxiety rising. This is stressing me out more than my own health issues. It's a personal problem I have of wanting to run and scoop up in my arms, whoever is having a rough time and "rescuing them." Nope! I can't do that! The last time I did that with my ex, it sent me into 12 yrs of pure HELL!

He's a different man now, but I have a husband! I can't involve myself with ANY man that way! It just seems that I have a constant battle inside me. Then to top it all off, Jerry seems to be very concerned about him, too. It doesn't help! LOL Knowing why Jerry is concerned for him, because of the two kids of his that Jerry raised, doesn't help me, either. It makes it easier for me to follow my instincts.

Oy vey! It's not always easy to be a compassionate person! It would have been so much easier if I had remained indifferent to him! ggrrrrrrr

I really do appreciate your response, Be!

[(JD)]

[Fuzzybear]

[bebop]

hon you have kids by this man. in my opinion it would be good for you to be there for your kids if nothing else. I think when people are as sick as he apparently is they want to know they are forgiven whatever bad they did in their past. maybe there are some things inside you that you thought you had dealt with but maybe haven't completely let go of. go with jerry as a couple. let this man know you are happy. take care of you too though hon.

[SeptemberMorn]

I AM there for my kids, at least my son. My daughter won't have anything to do with me. I'm even there for HIS daughter. Funny... I saw her at the block party this past Saturday and we barely smiled at each other, yet today she poured her guts out to me. I'm glad it happened.

Jerry and I are going to see him tomorrow, as a couple. My son told me to warn whoever is in the room with him that we're coming in so "he will cover up some." I'm wondering now if he's laying there in all his naked glory! That would be scary!!! Then I remembered that he always wore pj's. Should I stop by somewhere and get him a rediculous pair? He'd love a joke! Or should I get him a gown and nightcap? Or would that be too personal? Why didn't I think of making him an "Omar's tent"? It would be fitting since he "affectionately" called me "Tub O' Lard." (As$hole! !!!) Now the shoe fits HIM! LOL Payback's a ******!

Eh! We'll see.

[CJR520]

I have read all of this, and I think I know how you felt before, and a little of what you are going through now. My ex just took off, and there was one woman after the other, completely ignoring the kids and their needs. He cancelled their insurance, didn't pay child support, and stopped seeing them. My hubby adopted them, then. I feel indifferent like you do towards him. On a rare occasion, meeting up just on the street, I do not even speak to him. When people live like this, they really have to expect to end up alone and sick. Don't feel so guilty! My ex husband's second ex hates him as bad as I do. Some people just never learn. It is good that you have compassion for your ex as a human being, and your hubby right now seems to be very understanding. You are very lucky to have him! Good Luck! Hug your hubby and your kids!!!

[bebop]

oh lordy woman lol "omar's tent" lol

[SeptemberMorn]

Our stories are pretty much the same. I didn't see him for years but now we have 4 grandkids in common. Luckily, two live out of town. The only time I see him now is in Oct and Jan at two of the grandkids birthday parties.

If the tables were turned, there would be absolutely NO WAY he would let me visit an ex! I'm blessed that I don't have a jealous husband. He's pretty open minded knowning that this man's illness affects the kids he raised and calls his own. He wants to be as supportive of them as he can.

Do you think I might be feeling some guilt?? I don't know what about. LOL If anything, he owes ME. But like I said before, I guess I've forgiven him. The price he's now paying for all his evil deeds is way too much!

CJ, thank you for your response. I truly appreciate it. You haven't been going through a very easy time, either.

[bebop]

not sure guilt is the word hon. maybe feel bad you bad mouthed him to his kids. I don't know hon. I don't think you can have a long marriage and have kids with someone and not care at all. doesn't mean we love them but just care as humans. What are the drs saying today?

[bebop]

just wanted to say too that as some know I am in my 4th marriage. One of my ex's use to hit on me and force me into things I did not want to do. I was with him 10 yrs til I got sick of it. he always put his children above me and mine. It took a long time for us to get past our divorce. today we are able to talk and actually have fun together. our son was here a few weeks ago and we all went motorcycle riding. guess where I rode? on the back of his lol. my hubby followed in our car with my dad.

[SeptemberMorn]

His kidneys are getting better but he still can't tell me at what percentage they are working. His stupid wife was there and she tried answering for him, but I didn't even look at her when she spoke.

He's also got emphezema. I got cussed out because I still smoke. Some things never change. LOL He called me a dumb as$. I'm still chuckling over it.

He's sure not the man I married!! I found absolutely NOTHING familiar about him. Let me take that back; there was the name calling (once) and the coloring of his face was the same as when I knew I was gonna get hit. His brow line was red and above that, it was very pale. SOB has ONE grey hair!! He's 70 for pity's sake! LOL

I found him a set of pj pants and a robe... the size of "Omar's tent." He looked in the bag but didn't take it out to look. Oh, well. Poor guy can't even get up and stand... and he's got all sorts of tubes running from him. At least none in his mouth, but they've got him on oxygen.

He's brought a lot of this on himself throughout the years, but he's still pitiful. Thank goodness I didn't feel like taking him in my arms, cuddling him and telling him everything was going to be alright... like I did 45 yrs ago! GAWD, he's still ignorant, wants to stay that way and so damnably bullheaded!!!!

I may go back and see him when I know his wife is working so I can have him to myself and twist his arm back behind his back, get right in his face and tell him "Looky here, BUSTER!! This is the way it's gonna be!!!!" LOL Yeahright! I have to have my go at him, though.

What a trip!

[bebop]

tomi that was so sweet of you! yeah you need to get to him without her around.

when my ex was dying his wife had me and the kids banned from his room. what she did not know was I had been there for hours before she got around to getting to the hospital lol. poor guy held onto my hand for hours. at least even in his coma he knew I was there.

keep us posted hon. I will say an extra prayer tonight.

[SeptemberMorn]

What was sweet of me??? That I went to see him or that I bought him something? LOL

Since yesterday, I've felt like I'm trying to prove something, but what that something is, is a mystery to me.

I'm not enjoying giving him so much time in my thoughts, especially since yesterday. Maybe it's a reminder of how life was when he WAS in my life.

Maybe the next time I go see him, I will coordinate with my oldest son, see him together and then close this chapter, too.

My daughter is going to be in town this weekend to see her dad. I'm already having dreams of being with the boys. I know that won't happen, but hope springs eternal. At least I saw the boys in my dreams.

For spit seconds of my day I find myself wishing that my adult life had begun and ended with no one else in it but Jerry and my kids. Ah, well...

Aaaahhhh! My daughter is already in town. She just called Jerry.

[bebop]

lol that you bought him some pj's silly!