I don't belong here or anywhere for that matter. Nobody will ever accept, love, or even care about me no matter how hard I fight and struggle.

I'm pretty sure that the few people on here that claim to care about me and post positive things on my threads do so to look good to people or because it's socially acceptable. I doubt anybody here really cares about me. If I died tomorrow you guys would throw a big party and celebrate not having to deal with me anymore because I'm just a mean person I'm not nice and compassionate like you all.

I can't help to envy you guys. People care about you all but not me. I'm flat out envious that other people on here are shown more compassion and care than me. I am pretty sure that most of you have me blocked and I don't blame you because I hate myself as much as you all hate me. I wish I had people to love me and show me an once of compassion but I will never have that. Yet people who have such things clearly intend on making me feel even more worthless than I already do.

I came back to PC only to try to develop into a kinder person only so people would like me more. Clearly nobody will ever care about me no matter what so IDK why I wasted my time.

[Lefty Seven]

The people here who are kind and compassionate are genuine. You can take my word for it because I'm not one of them. Nobody hates you. I like you fine and I haven't blocked you... yet.

[Skeezyks]

I'm sorry you are feeling so... "defeated"? Is that an accurate descriptor? You know... I'm not a nice person in real life. I am married & have been for many years. But otherwise I'm pretty-much an entirely reclusive angry old goat. And, to a large extent, I even keep my wife at arms length. (It's a long story. I'll spare you the details.) If anyone really knew me, they wouldn't want anything to do with me. Hell... I don't even want anything to do with me. But I don't have a choice. Yet I think most members, here on PC, would say I seem to be a kind compassionate member.

You wrote that you came back here to PC to try to develop into a kinder person so people would like you more. I guess what I want to suggest to you is that, based on my own experience, you can do that. I myself could very easily have become an internet troll. (I still could be.) But a lady I came to know on YouTube taught me how to be a good person on-line. She didn't know she was doing it. She didn't do it intentionally. But she did it. So perhaps if you can find another member here on PC whose postings you feel good about, & model what they do, you can become the PC member you'd like to be. And the skills you develop here on PC can gradually carry over into real life. I don't know what has brought you to this place where you hate yourself so much. But I do believe, again based on my own experience, there is a pathway to the kinder person you want to be. And I send hugs your way with the hope that you might find your way to it.

Originally Posted by Skeezyks

You wrote that you came back here to PC to try to develop into a kinder person so people would like you more. I guess what I want to suggest to you is that, based on my own experience, you can do that. I myself could very easily have become an internet troll. (I still could be.) But a lady I came to know on YouTube taught me how to be a good person on-line. She didn't know she was doing it. She didn't do it intentionally. But she did it. So perhaps if you can find another member here on PC whose postings you feel good about, & model what they do, you can become the PC member you'd like to be. And the skills you develop here on PC can gradually carry over into real life. I don't know what has brought you to this place where you hate yourself so much. But I do believe, again based on my own experience, there is a pathway to the kinder person you want to be. And I send hugs your way with the hope that you might find your way to it.

Thanks.

I just feel something is missing, you know? I observe other people on here being nice to each other but I feel so empty. I have trouble connecting with and understanding people. I feel like other people on here have something that I'm clearly missing. I just cant empathize with people. I feel nothing for anybody. How am I to expect people to care about me if I can't even care about others? How can I love another person if I flat out hate myself?


When somebody says something I don't like I find it difficult not to lash out at them or at least belittle their intelligence. I used to do this even more before I took my break and I don't want to be like this but it's hard not to. There are at least one otherwise nice member that I know for sure that has me blocked and a second person that I would be surprised if they didn't block me because I said some really nasty stuff to them before I disappeared. I wish I could apologize to these people because that's what you do when you upset people, right?

All I do is hurt people. I'm unsure how not to be this way. I want to do better. How do I? I didn't choose to have such a messed up childhood that I lost the ability to feel empathy. That's just what happened. It's not my fault. Why should I be punished further?

I'm sorry you're struggling, Darkness.

So...a note about compassion and kindness (and also piggybacking a bit off of what Skeezyks said) : it's an interesting concept when I really think about it. I find myself beating myself up for not being as compassionate as I could be. I used to post a lot of support here, under my previous user name, but now that I'm KnitChick, something just changed. I more often post about my own struggles or random stuff on the social board (or just spend more time IRL). I feel guilty for not helping out as much anymore. I don't volunteer in my real life anymore. I see these positive and light hearted stories on the news. Like "man dresses up as santa and gives toys out to needy children." That was a real story on my news and I was fascinated, and inspired. But also, I don't do that stuff. I have been thinking a lot about compassion lately and whether it's more of an innate and natural thing for some people, but maybe not for others. I tend to put myself in the others category, to be honest. To me, since kindness is a value of mine though, I am also coming to learn that being compassionate with others does NOT always feel good. And when you think about it, maybe it shouldn't. After all, the meaning of compassion is to suffer with the one suffering. Most of us don't like going out of our comfort zones. And I'd argue that most of us are not as compassionate as we think we are, want to be, etc. I mean in the world and in society in general.

Don't be nice / kind, etc, just so people will like you. I think if you want people to like you...maybe start liking yourself as you are. It sounds like you may be struggling with self esteem and depression. I used to experience the thoughts you are describing when depressed. A LOT. I couldn't shake the feeling that no one would care if I died, and that no one really cared about me or liked me. The things in my real life, only mirrored my thoughts. I'd go on Facebook, and no one cared. I'd try to talk to my mother, who is naturally not good at helping me through that kind of stuff, (it was what I knew), but it made me feel worse.

I honestly believe that love is a verb. An action. Not just a feeling we get from others. But a form of caring and tending to ourselves and others. (And it's not always the thing we may want to do. It can be hard. It's a choice, sometimes a logical one, instead of emotional). Just like brushing your teeth keeps them clean and healthy, showing yourself kindness each day sows the seeds of confidence. For me, it started with becoming the change I wanted to see in my world. Maybe that was why I used to help here so much. I don't think it's wrong to want others to love you and to find happiness in other people. We are, after all, social creatures and we depend on connection for health and sometimes evens survival.

In terms of how you can tend to yourself...well, I don't have an answer specifically for you. I think keeping an open mind to ideas that seem strange, foreign, and unnatural is part of it though.

Originally Posted by DarknessIsMyFriend

Thanks.

I just feel something is missing, you know? I observe other people on here being nice to each other but I feel so empty. I have trouble connecting with and understanding people. I feel like other people on here have something that I'm clearly missing. I just cant empathize with people. I feel nothing for anybody. How am I to expect people to care about me if I can't even care about others? How can I love another person if I flat out hate myself?


When somebody says something I don't like I find it difficult not to lash out at them or at least belittle their intelligence. I used to do this even more before I took my break and I don't want to be like this but it's hard not to. There are at least one otherwise nice member that I know for sure that has me blocked and a second person that I would be surprised if they didn't block me because I said some really nasty stuff to them before I disappeared. I wish I could apologize to these people because that's what you do when you upset people, right?

All I do is hurt people. I'm unsure how not to be this way. I want to do better. How do I? I didn't choose to have such a messed up childhood that I lost the ability to feel empathy. That's just what happened. It's not my fault. Why should I be punished further?

You are not the only one who feels like this (empty, like you're the only one). You are definitely not the only person who feels empty and like everyone else has it together. Have you ever visited the depression board? Or some of the other boards for personality issues and mental health? You are not alone at all. I myself sometimes feel blank as ****.

If you have trouble connecting with people and understanding them, well, I think it's a good thing to 1. admit and 2. be aware of. Maybe it's a part of your diagnosis. Or it could just be who you are. Regardless, if you are attacking people who are just trying to help, that's a problem. It's good you recognize it. Maybe you would do well with learning interpersonal skills. Everyone needs them, and a lot of people could stand at least a brush up.

[downandlonely]

I haven't read many of your threads, Darkness.

But I can say to you that if you died, I certainly would not throw a party. Death (especially death by suicide) does not put people in the partying mood. I know because my grandfather killed himself. None of us felt better after he was gone.

I do think it's important to be compassionate and loving to yourself before you can suspect others to feel that way about you. I struggle with self-esteem issues too, and I think people sometimes pick up on that.

Also, I'm not sure what you said to cause someone to block you, but sometimes it is the other person's issue, not yours. I once mentioned medication and got a message saying I was insensitive and unhelpful. I think that person blocked me as well. I did not intend what I said to be offensive, but that was how the other person took it.

I don't like fake people and fake niceness. When I use caring words, I mean it.

The fact that you worry if you lack care proves your level of healthy self-awareness. A truly unhealthy human being would never be concerned about that but instead have a false elevated image of himself.

You contribute well to the group. I appreciate all of your inputs to the posts.

[Mopey]

You know, Darkness, that it takes a long time and a great deal of effort to get to know another person even slightly. My husband and I have been married over 40 years and we will never know everything about each other. Through years of dealing with life together we have come to love each other far more than we did when we got together, probably for selfish reasons

So I think I know what you mean about the people on the forum “pretending to care”. They can’t possibly know you well enough to “love” you in the traditional way. But they can love you enough to have compassion for you, take the time to read your posts, and to think out and send a response

I certainly don’t expect the people on the forum to love me in an intimate way, but we are all part of a larger community who struggle with certain issues in common and try to help each other get through

personally shy as I am I have already gotten a great deal of satisfaction from reading and interacting with the people all over the world who have a certain amount of faith in this forum.

Ive followed a number of your posts and have the impression you are quite artistic. I imagine that provides some satisfaction for you, as we are not all that talented.

As to relating better with other people, I imagine you could get some pretty good advice on this forum especially if you were a little more specific about when and where things go wrong

I certainly wish well and I hope you don’t go away discouraged. 😐

Originally Posted by downandlonely

Also, I'm not sure what you said to cause someone to block you, but sometimes it is the other person's issue, not yours. I once mentioned medication and got a message saying I was insensitive and unhelpful. I think that person blocked me as well. I did not intend what I said to be offensive, but that was how the other person took it.

It was something really stupid. I was upset at the time because I couldn't find and hold down a job and I was at risk of being homeless and was in a particularly foul mood after getting denied a job at Walmart in the frozen foods section during the holiday season so I was talking about becoming a pot dealer to get by since nobody would give me a chance at a job and the person said that I wouldn't like it in jail and I said that if I got caught maybe I would finally get the courage to off myself so I don't have to struggle anymore. It was awhile ago I could have forgot some minor details but that's how I remember it as.

But yeah, I am sick of people telling me to love myself when I don't know how. I don't know how to feel love, neither for myself nor for anybody else. People tell me to love myself like it's so easy. I just need to accept that my brain isn't wired to love anybody and I'll never have anybody to care about me no matter how hard I try since I clearly don't know how to love so whatever.

Originally Posted by DarknessIsMyFriend

But yeah, I am sick of people telling me to love myself when I don't know how. I don't know how to feel love, neither for myself nor for anybody else. People tell me to love myself like it's so easy. I just need to accept that my brain isn't wired to love anybody and I'll never have anybody to care about me no matter how hard I try since I clearly don't know how to love so whatever.

Are you referring to my post?

Originally Posted by KnitChick

If you have trouble connecting with people and understanding them, well, I think it's a good thing to 1. admit and 2. be aware of. Maybe it's a part of your diagnosis. Or it could just be who you are. Regardless, if you are attacking people who are just trying to help, that's a problem. It's good you recognize it. Maybe you would do well with learning interpersonal skills. Everyone needs them, and a lot of people could stand at least a brush up.

How though? I have tried in the past to improve my social skills and I still struggle. I find socializing draining and I'm not a people person. I find approaching people and starting a conversation with them extremely uncomfortable and intimidating. I also have a particular fear of approaching women. I am afraid of being rejected by them or seen as "creepy". I'm 27 years old, yet I've only had one actual relationship with a woman and that lasted a whole 4 months and I met her online so it wasn't anything serious enough for us to move together.

I've tried to improve but I just learn these types of things slowly. I have some trouble understanding social norms and I'm not good with small talk. I also have speech issues where sometimes I talk too fast or too slowly and I sometimes get nervous around people and have trouble thinking about what to say. I try and try but things just don't click.

Ya I'm good at tech. I built computers since age 7. I am a self taught computer hacker. I almost made it to being a professional gamer at one point even. Get me around people though and I outright struggle.

Originally Posted by KnitChick

Are you referring to my post?

Yours, Downandlonely's and anybody else that tells me to love myself before I can receive love. I've been told this a lot but I don't understand how.

There are a lot of ways you can care for yourself and take care of yourself. You may not want to hear about it though and I don't have much more energy to put into this atm. therapy, gaming, exercise. Boom. There's 3.

Originally Posted by DarknessIsMyFriend

Yours, Downandlonely's and anybody else that tells me to love myself before I can receive love. I've been told this a lot but I don't understand how.

Ok I see. Thanks. I wasn't telling you that. I know its more complex than that. And I was trying to help.

Originally Posted by KnitChick

There are a lot of ways you can care for yourself and take care of yourself. You may not want to hear about it though and I don't have much more energy to put into this atm. therapy, gaming, exercise. Boom. There's 3.

It's fine. Doubt I would listen anyways. I'm too damn stubborn for my own good lol

Thanks for trying though.

Originally Posted by DarknessIsMyFriend

How though? I have tried in the past to improve my social skills and I still struggle. I find socializing draining and I'm not a people person. I find approaching people and starting a conversation with them extremely uncomfortable and intimidating. I also have a particular fear of approaching women. I am afraid of being rejected by them or seen as "creepy". I'm 27 years old, yet I've only had one actual relationship with a woman and that lasted a whole 4 months and I met her online so it wasn't anything serious enough for us to move together.

I've tried to improve but I just learn these types of things slowly. I have some trouble understanding social norms and I'm not good with small talk. I also have speech issues where sometimes I talk too fast or too slowly and I sometimes get nervous around people and have trouble thinking about what to say. I try and try but things just don't click.

Ya I'm good at tech. I built computers since age 7. I am a self taught computer hacker. I almost made it to being a professional gamer at one point even. Get me around people though and I outright struggle.

Gonna read this later. Know I'm coming back to it. I just gotta do some stuff.

You showed empathy towards me and related to me over my feelings around the holiday season and how I couldn't stand it all..... I felt you were relating to me then. So I think you have the ability to both empathize and relate.

Originally Posted by DarknessIsMyFriend

How though? I have tried in the past to improve my social skills and I still struggle. I find socializing draining and I'm not a people person. I find approaching people and starting a conversation with them extremely uncomfortable and intimidating. I also have a particular fear of approaching women. I am afraid of being rejected by them or seen as "creepy". I'm 27 years old, yet I've only had one actual relationship with a woman and that lasted a whole 4 months and I met her online so it wasn't anything serious enough for us to move together.

I've tried to improve but I just learn these types of things slowly. I have some trouble understanding social norms and I'm not good with small talk. I also have speech issues where sometimes I talk too fast or too slowly and I sometimes get nervous around people and have trouble thinking about what to say. I try and try but things just don't click.

Ya I'm good at tech. I built computers since age 7. I am a self taught computer hacker. I almost made it to being a professional gamer at one point even. Get me around people though and I outright struggle.

When I said you could improve your interpersonal skills, I originally meant on here. But yeah, we do live in the real world don't we. So, I know whats worked for me. And really, that's all I know, so that's what I'll tell you. You may or may not be able to relate. I don't mind it at all if you tell me it doesn't help though, if it doesn't. That actually helps me to understand what might help.

DBT has helped me a lot. There's even an interpersonal skills component to it. In terms of my own anger, pausing, like, taking a moment to just chill, in between the situation and my response. Or even getting up and walking away from the situation, then coming back, helps me. I am not perfect at it. I can still be a beotch. But I've gotten a lot better with my family, and saying (Or rather, not saying) impulsive things online. Meditation has also helped me. Learning what I value also helped. I personally value kindness and have an interest in it. You may, or you may not. If you don't, that's ok. Maybe you value consequences of your actions though. Or being independent. Or being good at something.

There are books out there as well on the subject of interpersonal skills. I'm sure you know this. As well as information online. Maybe check there.

It sounds a lot like you experience anxiety in social situations IRL though. I'm sorry to hear this. Again, you're not alone. I had mega social anxiety all through my 20s. In terms of small talk, it's okay that you don't like it or aren't good at it. A lot of people feel that way. It feels fake to some. Ok there is a whole paragraph up there that I feel like you are being way to critical of yourself. I bolded it. lol. There's nothing wrong with learning things more slowly. Even social norms. Some people may find your way of speaking, nervousness, etc, charming or endearing. Most of the time, it seems people are really not focusing and criticizing us like we criticize ourselves. If they did I'm sure they'd be jerks. You're also probably an introvert. Introvert power!

I think it's really cool that you build computers and are so good at gaming. Strength right there.

I like what Golden Eve said too. I see you empathizing with things you can relate to, and being supportive. You've been supportive on some of my posts in the past as well.

[sarahsweets]

Darkness, since I am new here, are you willing to share your dx's and treatments?

Originally Posted by sarahsweets

Darkness, since I am new here, are you willing to share your dx's and treatments?

IDK how accurate I can be since the childhood abuse that I endured was largely due to a mother who would lie to the doctors to garner sympathy and use medicine and hospitalization to control me.

With that being said, here's what I know:

PTSD, Anxiety, and Depression are confirmed DX as an adult.

I was also told by a doctor a couple years ago that I likely qualified for a Reactive Attachment Disorder diagnosis despite not being diagnosed as a child due to the unusual circumstances behind my childhood. Never saw her again to get a confirmation on the dx though.

Other than that I was given multiple Dx as a kid. I'm not going to name them off because like I said, my mother lied to the doctors about me (this is also why I got defensive with you on my ADHD thread sorry about that I get sensitive to topics about meds). The only dx that I had as a kid that I'm beginning to think might have some accuracy to it was an Asperger's diagnosis. I tried to bring this up to 2 doctors though and both don't see how I could be since I appear to be "normal" enough to them.

No treatments at this time. Transportation is a huge barrier for me right now since I don't drive and live in a city with crap public transportation.

Originally Posted by KnitChick

DBT has helped me a lot. There's even an interpersonal skills component to it. In terms of my own anger, pausing, like, taking a moment to just chill, in between the situation and my response. Or even getting up and walking away from the situation, then coming back, helps me. I am not perfect at it. I can still be a beotch. But I've gotten a lot better with my family, and saying (Or rather, not saying) impulsive things online. Meditation has also helped me. Learning what I value also helped. I personally value kindness and have an interest in it. You may, or you may not. If you don't, that's ok. Maybe you value consequences of your actions though. Or being independent. Or being good at something.

There are books out there as well on the subject of interpersonal skills. I'm sure you know this. As well as information online. Maybe check there.

Thanks.

Maybe I should see a therapist for DBT though. I know there are books on it I just don't have the self discipline to follow through on my own without somebody to motivate me. I have a hard enough time balancing school and a job I don't think I can endure anything else on my own.

I tried improving social skills by practicing and researching guides on the internet. I even purchased a $300 online course last year that teaches you to socialize. I can do well enough now in low pressure social situations (like starting a conversation with a cashier) but get me into something high pressure like socializing with an important person, a girl that I like, or heaven forbid a job interview and I flat out struggle.

[Quarter life]

DarknessIsMyFriend

Mental illness bought on by an accident of birth, trauma, environment, faulty brain chemistry or associated illness/circumstances… is for all of us a heavy cross to bear, and is almost always exacerbated by taking to heart what others say, those who perpetually tell us that we just aren't good enough, that we are damaged, that we have no value as citizens of the world.....a heartbreaking waste of life.

So where to from here?...how do we find our place in the world? A place where our endeavors are valued? A place where we can strive, accomplish and be all the better for it?

Self doubt, fear of ridicule, and indeed failure all come into play causing us to procrastinate and bemoan the inertia of our lives. I spent many many years in therapy and medicated...it wasn’t until I started implementing changes by modifying my thinking and behavior that I began to move forward...It was like the gears on my life had been out of whack, the only way forward it seemed was to realign them.

I truly believe that you are more normal than you may think DarknessIsMyFriend. Several years ago I took a long hard look at my list of personal beliefs and my reactions to the world, including my constant worrying of what others thought of me. Some of my ideas were keeping me safe, but most were toxic, outdated or downright ridiculous. I have now come to appreciate that 99.9% of people care little about what I think or what I do...they care more about their own lives. I now understand that I can’t wait around for others to tolerate, validate, laud or honour me...I must do that for myself. The worst choice we can make is waiting for others to choose for us, or waiting for permission to choose, as we may spend our lives choosing nothing at all.

Please believe that your life is worth the living. No matter what you perceive others may think of you, it isn't something that causes great effect to their lives...It just isn't. Only we can cause effect in our own lives, and we are all capable of amazing things.

I've missed you, DIMF, and I'm glad you're back. I like reading your posts. I'm sorry I don't reply much but I'm a little crazy right now. Just wanted to say I'm happy you're still in college and working. Take care of yourself.

Originally Posted by DarknessIsMyFriend

I don't belong here or anywhere for that matter. Nobody will ever accept, love, or even care about me no matter how hard I fight and struggle.

What happened?

Honestly I think it is the opposite. I think there are a lot of people who do care but probably you don't think they do.

I definitely will miss you if you go because you do post intelligent and engaging posts.

My heart does go out to you because you are in some dire straights financially. It sucks. When I was first starting out even if I wasn't... it felt the same. I get angry every time I feel put in that box again.

There are plenty of times I feel I don't belong here but, what choice do I have? Not a lot of places left on the internet and zero real life friends to be had.