Is this "abuse"? (*triggers*)

I remember clearly a conversation with my father when I was 3 years old. He was talking to me about m*st*rb*ting -- which I already did frequently at that age, being born hypersexual and prone to fetishism -- and I remember him asking whether I'd ever "rubbed" myself down there, whether I'd ever kept doing it until I got a "big tickle" all over my body (orgasm), etc. Afterwards he told me not to tell anyone about our conversation, that it was something that should be "just a secret between daddies and their little girls". I have NO memories of him ever touching me inappropriately or anything like that, but this conversation disturbs me. I have sex with spirit beings, demons mainly -- feel free to regard that as hallucinatory content if you don't get it (I'm not here to argue the supernatural) -- and one time in the bathtub an amorous spirit came upon me and as it merged inside me and we were having it off, I realized it was my father, or something I was supposed to receive as my father (who is now deceased). I NEVER had any sexual fantasies for my father while growing up, that I recall. I WAS m*l*sted by older boys in my neighborhood for 3 years, between ages 6-9, but I don't recall any m*l*st*tion by kin or family.

Was this conversation with my father something that would be considered a form of s*xu*l ab*se? I hope this isn't a dumb question. I've basically dealt with my other ab*se issues already -- this one has just bugged me off & on for years. When I first remembered the line about "secret between daddies & their little girls" it freaked the CRAP out of me cuz I could not recall the reason I'd heard that line. Eventually I remembered the m*st*rb*tion conversation so that gave it context (and me some relief!) but I'm still wondering -- is this something that would be regarded as ab*se? After all he didn't touch me, even if the conversation was pretty inappropriate.

I think this would probably fall under corruption of a child, which would be considered abuse, yes. However, I want to add that I think there is a STRONG possibility that there are more memories you have yet to recover here, if you know what I mean.

Are you seeing a therapist currently? I think this would be a good idea, if not.

Just my two cents.

Angela

I just started seeing a t-doc, yes. My 2nd session is tomorrow. I am going to see if she brings up the idea of an eval and medication. if she doesn't then I'm going to bring it up. I need an anti-psychotic and a mood stabilizer.

I don't know about "more memories" about my father. I remembered everything about the m*l*st*ation by older boys, never covered or repressed that; it never went "unaware" to me. I seriously doubt there's dirtier stuff I repressed there. But thanks for the input.

You're welcome. Just don't rule out the possibility, ok?

I hope things go well for you!

Children m*st*rb*te from a very early age, it's quite normal. We seldom remember doing this as children because there was no sexual connotation to it at that age. Your father may have had a concern that you were doing this in public, which is a common concern for parents of children that age. It could be that he simply broached the conversation inapporpriately, and his line of questioning does sound slightly innappropriate, especially the fact that he asked you about org*sm and to keep it a secret, even if he had the best of intentions.
It's a good idea to talk to your therapist about this if it is bothering you. Good luck!

It doesn't so much bother me as arouse my curiosity. Like what on earth was he thinking? Of course, I can't ask him because he's dead now -- he died when I was 15. And even if he hadn't passed on, I doubt he'd remember the conversation -- my mother has serious selective amnesia when it comes to just about anything I remember from my childhood; he'd probably be the same.

I remember m*st*rb*ting very specifically as a child. I remember all kinds of strange things no child is supposed to know about at those ages. It was already VERY familiar to me (cl*tor*l orgasm included) by the age of 3 so I had to have been doing it longer than that. I was a born sex magick ritualist, LOL, I used to use it to control the evil spirits that scared me at night when I was little.

Allautumn, your avatar is seriously disturbed looking. I thought mine was pretty disturbed but yours takes the proverbial cake (and the icing too)!

Mal,

I really think there is a possibility of some repressed memories here. Really, really, really.

Good luck to you in figuring all this out.

Angela

Oh by the way I knew instinctively never to do it in public or when anyone else was around, watching, or could see me. I knew that instinctively. I only did it alone in my room at night when I was little. I had an innate fear of being seen doing it. One time my mother walked in on me when I was like 6 doing it and she hollered at me (thus confirming my instinct that I was right to keep it a secret!)

Angela, honestly I'd be inclined to suspect likewise except for one salient fact: I'm not a repressor. Never have been. I never repressed the m*l*st*tion by older boys that went on for 3 years, for example; I lived with it consciously.

One time when I was 10 I deliberately "altered reality" as a magickal experiment (by telling myself repeatedly "this never happened" after a neighbor's mother caught us playing "truth or dare" outside involving nudity) to protect myself from the negative consequences of an embarrassing incident, but that was deliberate and I remembered it 2 years later again after the time limit had expired on it -- it was a sort of self-hypnotic suggestion thing.

Sheesh, I sound like a perv. I have been hypersexual all my life, even before I knew what "sex" really WAS.

I used to flirt with grown men when I was a child. I craved s*xu*l attention even before I knew what it was. I wanted to be sexy, dress sexy, when I was as young as 6 or 7.

OK enough of this crap! LOL

I'm so disgusting.
Tainted ... abomination ... wh*re ...
Evil. I'm evil. That's all.

Mal,

You're not evil, or a pervert, or any of the other thigns you said. I don't think that about you at all.

And I don't mean to drive you nuts about it, but honestly these are all signs that point to the possibility that there are more memories there. It's possible you repressed some things and not others.

I'm not expert, but I am a psych major, so I do know a few things and these are some pretty strong signs.

I can be hideously suggestible & highly programmable (just ask Satan) and I'm afraid of becoming a victim of FMS.

I don't think my T. would ever do anything like that on PURPOSE -- no good T. would of course -- but sometimes it happens with the best of intentions, y'know?

I do know what you mean. But a good T who knows what they are doing can help you sort those things out, Mal.

I hope, hope, hope that you can find the answers.

Mal, if you were disgusting, and tainted you would not be here looking for support, you have many issues that need worked on your T is for that we are for your support
Angie

You're not disgusting! I think it's really good for someone to be positively sexually aware and enjoy them selves, and not be afraid to fantasize. You don't realize how common your childhood sexual experiences are. Like I said, most people don't remeber it because they were unaware of the sexual connotation of their actions, but I know a few people who were well aware, and there is NOTHING wrong with that, as long as no one was hurt. Sometimes just the awareness of what we are doing makes us feel guilty, but it's not necessary. I didn't realize how common these experinces were either until I read about it in psychology books and talked to friends that had actually had intercourse voluntarily with other children. It's part of learning to be human. It's unfortunate when we are made to feel guilty for expressing pleasure... you have no reason to feel tainted or ashamed. Just keep working through it.

BTW, my avatar is a pastel self-portrait, I just scanned it and shrunk it. It's part of a pastel series of "X-rays". I'm glad you like it!

Oh ((((allautumn))))) if ok...

I love your avatar, I was wondering about it. Looked like pastels to me, which is my absolute passion in life! I love drawing, but am not very good at it. Put a pastel in my hand and it's like magic! Nothing holds a candle to it, though I like painting too..LOL..

I think it's a beautiful piece of art, and you are very talented.

Take Care,
Kimberly.

Thanks Kimberly! I haven't really done any pastels lately. Haven't done much of anything except taking pictures and sketching now and then.
Are any of your pieces in the gallery? I'd love to see them. Did you draw your avatar as well?