Letter to Desk t

BlueMoon6 · Oct 07, 2009, 09:38 PM

Again on this issue. Ftt gave me an assignment to write a no-send letter to dt. The reason being closure with her. We came to the decision that a one-way closure was the best that I could do because her reaction, which is pretty predicable, will trigger me to feel even worse about myself and what went on there.

I spent some time on this letter today. I have been putting it off all week. I kept thinking I was supposed to write some kind of first draft of a real letter I would send. Forget that. I started off that way and I couldnt get a single thought down. Then I began writing how I was feeling and it flowed out of me into 6 1/2 pages (on Word). There is no way I would send any of this to her. I even referred to a couple of previous posts of mine here on PC. I was writing incident after incident about what she did, how I felt blah blah blah. She did this, she did that, bad, bad dt. After I got out as much as I could remember, I had one of those AH-HA moments. The specifics dont really matter anymore. It started to seem ridiculous that Id have these feelings toward her. Love, intense love, disappointment, deep deep hurt and sadness. Lonliness, shame and fear. Anger. It became apparent to me that I transferred the feelings I had toward my mother onto her. Even down to the smallest detail. Idealizing the outside life my mother seemingly had (who wasnt home very often, always busy with her life, but abusive when she was home) and wondering what she could be doing. I dont have a need to send desk t a letter with each incident and how I felt. Even if I did use examples of what she did and how I felt, I know she did what she did according to who she is and how she conducts therapy.
How I felt was triggered by her style and her manner. And it was a bad fit theraputically. There, that is the letter I need to write. It took me 6 1/2 pages and numerous hours at my laptop to write those 2 lines.

In the end, I'll probably come up with something in the middle. She did a lot of weird things, untheraputic things, but in the end it is about what it brought up for me. And who she became for me. I (must have) had a very painful relationship with my mother. Still, I dont remember it, or her very much, but my feelings are very clealy there.

Sigh......

Oct 07, 2009, 09:57 PM

sounds like you did some good, hard work on this blue. good for you.

rainbow8 · Oct 07, 2009, 10:22 PM

I agree with Bloom. What you did sounds very productive and is good material to discuss with your new T. I'm very much impressed my your ability to realize the transference involved in your therapy with desk-t.

ECHOES · Oct 08, 2009, 04:59 AM

Wow! Writing the letter to dt turned out to be a powerful and insightful experience for you. That is great insight!

Why not stick with the 6 1/2 page letter and your post? It seems to cover it all and move you toward closure. I think it would all be very meaningful to talk about in therapy.

I also find I can relate to your comment about idealizing. I too have been thinking about that and I have also been thinking that I didn't always know where my mother was (searched the house, traipsed the neighborhood looking for her, only to find her and be greeted with some nasty comment about not being able to get away from me) and what a mystery she was to me...and I have been wondering if that contributes to the idealization of T.

Thank you for sharing your letter-writing experience.

Oct 08, 2009, 05:41 AM

Blue, good for you! Sounds like a very intense but healing assignment. I'm loving ftt more and more for giving you that assignment!

Are you actually sending desk T any kind of letter, or no more contact at all?

peaches100 · Oct 08, 2009, 09:02 AM

Bluemoon,

It sounds like your writing experience prompted some really important insights about the connection between the past and your interactions with desk t in the present. It will be really good material to discuss further in t.

BlueMoon6 · Oct 08, 2009, 09:36 AM

Echoes- I think what I'll do is read the letter to ftt. And we can talk about what my experiences and feelings were. Even though I transferred my mother feelings to dt, they are powerful feelings. And very real to me. Im sure it will bring up alot about my childhood.

Did you really have the same experience with your mother? That is exactly what my mother would say, that she is trying to get away from me. "Ugh! This kid is going to be the death of me!" I felt ashamed I wanted her. And I probably immediately pretended/stuffed that I didnt care or need her. When I was writing the letter, it was as if I could have been writing it to my mother, especially the idealizing part. It does seem to me like there is a connection. It seems that way, but it isnt completely clear, if that makes any sense.

Dream- I dont know yet whether I'll send her anything. This letter was for me to get my feelings out, ftt said just to write, not to be concerned with content. Just write and see what comes out. I just kept writing and letting it go the extreme without censuring anything. I am surprised I didnt have too much anger. Mostly hurt and why did you do this or that kind of thing. I am surprised that I have been somewhat afraid of her. That came up, too.

I may send her something, I dont know. I am not doing anything yet. I'll process more and see how I feel.

Peaches- yes- there is so much material in that letter about my past. Its hard for me to bring up out of the blue different topics about my childhood so the letter is a good way to open up the conversation.

Breathing......

Sannah · Oct 08, 2009, 02:01 PM

Blue, your ability to express yourself and then figure it out and increase your self understanding is incredible. You will do very well with this and you are going to have a very productive journey of healing..........

darkrunner · Oct 08, 2009, 02:02 PM

(((((((((((Blue Moon))))))))))))
(((((((((Echoes)))))))))
I'm sorry your moms did that to you.

Brightheart · Oct 08, 2009, 03:54 PM

It never ceases to amaze me just what one can discover through the power of the written word. If you are willing to study and explore these feelings further with ftt, there could be a lot to discover about yourself and how you've learned to cope and how you relate with others. Feelings really say a whole lot about who we are and what makes us tick, I think. sounds like good, hard work you did here with this, Blue.

BlueMoon6 · Oct 08, 2009, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brightheart

It never ceases to amaze me just what one can discover through the power of the written word. If you are willing to study and explore these feelings further with ftt, there could be a lot to discover about yourself and how you've learned to cope and how you relate with others. Feelings really say a whole lot about who we are and what makes us tick, I think. sounds like good, hard work you did here with this, Blue.

Wow Brightheart, that is exactly how I feel. The more I think about what I wrote, the more I am realizing how revealing it really is. I am not/have not re-read it b/c I dont want to change anything there. I want it to stay as it is. I am afraid I am going to be embarrassed to read it to ftt. She doesnt know me and already I am transferring my need to have her like me and think well of me. That letter makes me look so needy, immature and confused. I can tell her that, I am in a place where I am commited to saying and doing what I have to. If Im embarrassed, I'll say so. I just want to heal who I am, and not waste time. This aint going to be easy.

I am reading an amazing book, called Between Therapist and Client, The New Relationship. Someone here recommended it, maybe it was Bloom (before she was Bloom

) or maybe not

Anyway, there is a passage there I want to copy here (I am referring to desk-t and her "neutral" blank-wall appraoch:

(It is about the neutrality of an analyst)
"Someone who says neither hello nor goodbye, who doesnt answer questions, who remains silent under severe provocation, is hardly neutral. When one feels cold and lonely with such a person, Gill says, it shouldnt be assumed that these feelings come from one's childhood. Who wouldnt feel cold and lonely in the face of that kind of treatment?"

The point is that neutrality isnt neutral at all, but says something pretty loudly to the client as well. It says that "the analytic situation produces a considerable amount of regressed transference material,....but it seems likely that this material is not revealing the clients history at all, but is actually being created by the excessively cold ambiance the analyst has created in pursuit of neutrality." It then says something about this blank-slate postion assumes the illusion that the client is naive

Well....dt's neutrality (which isnt as neutral as she might think) has brought up a lot for me. I wonder if it is all/mostly transference or just a "normal" reaction to someone cold.
I wonder how someone (whoever that might be) who doesnt have the kinds of issues I do would feel about her in therapy. What would they say? Maybe it wouldnt bother them or they would be OK with her distance. Im not sure if I am saying it in a clear way, but Im wondering if someone with very little material to transfer onto dt would be unhappy with her attitude.

Brightheart · Oct 08, 2009, 11:46 PM

I think that transference is a very complex thing. I think it's way more than just past experiences. It's attitudes, feelings, the way you see the world... It's extremely fascinating.

I think the "blank slate" theory attempts to get the client to reexperience past feelings, but that inevitably the past mixes with the present as well. It's some complex blend, but often you may react to certain situations and feelings in the way that you have in the past. But I really think that all of those very same answers about yourself can be found in non psychodynamic therapy if you take a look at your relationship with your therapist. I'm still so amazed and very fascinated with what I discovered about myself by exploring my feelings for former T. Those feelings really are a blueprint of me. I feel almost awed by it.

I'll have to check that book out. It sounds very interesting.

Sannah · Oct 09, 2009, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueMoon6

I can tell her that, I am in a place where I am commited to saying and doing what I have to. If Im embarrassed, I'll say so. I just want to heal who I am, and not waste time. This aint going to be easy.

This is a great frame of mind to approach this with. When I came to this realization, that if I am embarrassed I will just say so, it was so freeing. We grow up becoming experts at hiding our true feelings and being ashamed of them. When we let go of this it really makes healing much easier.

Well....dt's neutrality (which isnt as neutral as she might think) has brought up a lot for me. I wonder if it is all/mostly transference or just a "normal" reaction to someone cold.

Why can't it be both transference and reacting to someone who is cold?

Oct 09, 2009, 02:33 PM

(((((((((((((Moon))))))))))))))))))

I read parts of that book (I have it upstairs!) and I remember that part that you quoted. I am trying to picture one of my friends with a "cold" T....(because I know *I* would freak out in that situation for sure)...I think some of them would be okay with it, but most would think she was just rude and find someone else. I mean, she really WAS rude, you know??

I think the processing you did with your letter was amazing. I hope you will read the whole thing to ftt and not worry about being judged. It sounds like there are a lot of valuable insights in there...and I bet ftt will help you find even more insights (look at what she helped you see about your marriage in ONE appointment!!)

to you

BlueMoon6 · Oct 09, 2009, 07:20 PM

Quote:

I think the "blank slate" theory attempts to get the client to reexperience past feelings, but that inevitably the past mixes with the present as well. It's some complex blend, but often you may react to certain situations and feelings in the way that you have in the past. But I really think that all of those very same answers about yourself can be found in non psychodynamic therapy if you take a look at your relationship with your therapist. I'm still so amazed and very fascinated with what I discovered about myself by exploring my feelings for former T. Those feelings really are a blueprint of me. I feel almost awed by it.

BH- This is so true. I cant hide from my t and from myself. The feelings I transfer onto her reveal so much. I have ftt on monday and I am feelings a little bit....something...uncomfortable(???) not sure what the feelings is....to read this and reveal so much of myself in just one session. This letter is a blueprint of me. But also so much about how she can help me is in that letter. I feel vulnerable reading it to her. When I used to read things I wrote to dt, I used to edit as I read. I dont want to edit with ftt. It would be good for her to see "me".

Sannah- You mean she brings up past feelings and present feelings. What is the difference between past and present feelings? Childhood issues and ??? I dont quite understand.

Tree- I know people who have seen her and didnt like her. And I read some real bad reviews of her. What I dont understand is why I stayed. I saw all of the same things they did. They thought she was distracted, preoccupied and mean.She was. I knew that. And I stayed? I thought she would change herself with me, I would get her to be nice AT LAST. Scary.....
I am going to do my best to put it out of my mind that she would judge me. I made my references to csa very general since I dont want to go there yet with her. I would like to feel safer. Does that make sense? Or am I wasting precious time not tlaking about that yet? Im not sure.

Oct 09, 2009, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueMoon6

I made my references to csa very general since I dont want to go there yet with her. I would like to feel safer. Does that make sense? Or am I wasting precious time not tlaking about that yet? Im not sure.

I think it would be a mistake to talk about it before you are ready...because you might overwhelm yourself, and then THAT would slow you down. I think you will know when it is time to talk about it...trust your own wisdom

BlueMoon6 · Oct 09, 2009, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treehouse

I think it would be a mistake to talk about it before you are ready...because you might overwhelm yourself, and then THAT would slow you down. I think you will know when it is time to talk about it...trust your own wisdom

But what if Im just comfortable going on and on like this....maybe I wont be....I havent been seeing her for that long.

Maybe there was a time I thought I felt comfortable talking to dt about it, I really didnt tho, I just wrote some memories down, and maybe it would open HER up. Maybe I did that. When I write that it seems like I could have been doing that with her.

I had some memories, but I wasnt sure what would happen from there....do I talk more or what. DT listened to it, and we came right back to talking about my present life. We didnt get into it at all. I wonder if it was my fault, I didnt talk more....or what. Or dt's fault. She didnt know how to help me. I dont know.

Oct 10, 2009, 05:40 AM

(((((((((((((((Moon)))))))))))))))))))

From what you've said in the past, it sounds like there was a time you were ready to talk about the memories with desk T, and SHE seemed like she didn't want to hear them. Of course that would shut you down.

Last year, I tried to talk to T about my October triggers. I couldn't say the words so I wrote a letter...and I was so scared that I went and sat on the bathroom floor while he read the letter. I don't remember how he reacted, but I remember feeling like HE didn't want to hear about it/talk about it. And I dropped it until this year!! And of course my T wasn't trying to shut me down...but I think we are so scared to tell (and have been told not to tell, and can't trust ourselves around telling) that we look for ANY sign that we shouldn't tell and it's so easy to just shut ourselves down. And that was with MY t, who obviously wants to be there for me and help me through this stuff. It seems really natural that you wouldn't be able to "go there" with desk T, who gave you absolutely no indication that she cared to hear about your past.

I think it will be different with ftt. I think when you are ready, you will bring it up. And maybe you ARE ready now, and maybe you aren't...I don't think you have to force yourself. I DO think you will know (maybe you already do). And I think ftt will hear you, and you won't have to shut back down and not deal with it. I think ftt will help you heal.

Oct 10, 2009, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueMoon6

I am reading an amazing book, called Between Therapist and Client, The New Relationship. Someone here recommended it, maybe it was Bloom (before she was Bloom

) or maybe not

blue, i'm so glad you are reading this book. i got the sense it would really be helpful to you but didn't want to be pushy and say GO READ THIS NOW!

i'm just loving it.

apologies to all for my scanty posting. i haven't been on much the last couple of days. i had a computer problem and was all worried i had spyware--looks like i'm ok though.

BlueMoon6 · Oct 10, 2009, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treehouse

(((((((((((((((Moon)))))))))))))))))))

From what you've said in the past, it sounds like there was a time you were ready to talk about the memories with desk T, and SHE seemed like she didn't want to hear them. Of course that would shut you down.

I forgot about that, she did shut me down. I was looking for some way to talk further, but then she would go back to current situations.

Quote:

Last year, I tried to talk to T about my October triggers. I couldn't say the words so I wrote a letter...and I was so scared that I went and sat on the bathroom floor while he read the letter. I don't remember how he reacted, but I remember feeling like HE didn't want to hear about it/talk about it. And I dropped it until this year!! And of course my T wasn't trying to shut me down...but I think we are so scared to tell (and have been told not to tell, and can't trust ourselves around telling) that we look for ANY sign that we shouldn't tell and it's so easy to just shut ourselves down. And that was with MY t, who obviously wants to be there for me and help me through this stuff. It seems really natural that you wouldn't be able to "go there" with desk T, who gave you absolutely no indication that she cared to hear about your past.

Yes! I look for any sign that I shouldnt tell anyone. There is someplace inside of me that thinks, c'mon, why are saying this, he didnt do anything wrong, you have only yourself to blame. Nothing really bad happened. It was just what it was. What are you making a big deal over?
Desk-t made me feel like I was making a big deal over nothing ALL THE TIME. Even when something was a big deal, I was afraid of the "what is the big deal" reaction and then a referral to my bpd and that is why I overreact. Boy, do I not want to see her again.....

Quote:

I think it will be different with ftt. I think when you are ready, you will bring it up. And maybe you ARE ready now, and maybe you aren't...I don't think you have to force yourself. I DO think you will know (maybe you already do). And I think ftt will hear you, and you won't have to shut back down and not deal with it. I think ftt will help you heal.

I think I will bring smaller, safer things up first. And reading the letter to her will reveal a lot. I want to talk about how I dont really remember most things. I remembered in the last week how EXTREMELY afraid I was of my father as a very small child. I was very little. And I remembered something else about a relative who reminded me of my father and how I reacted to him. My family would make a joke about it, and they still make a joke about it to this day. I cant remember what made me so afraid of my father (specifically) but I have an idea in general, if that makes sense.

BlueMoon6 · Oct 10, 2009, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bloom3

blue, i'm so glad you are reading this book. i got the sense it would really be helpful to you but didn't want to be pushy and say GO READ THIS NOW!

i'm just loving it.

apologies to all for my scanty posting. i haven't been on much the last couple of days. i had a computer problem and was all worried i had spyware--looks like i'm ok though.

Im glad your computer is feeling better

And to see you back on here

Its a good book... I love it too, it explains the t relationship in a very understandable way. Im about half way through.

Brightheart · Oct 10, 2009, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueMoon6

What is the difference between past and present feelings? Childhood issues and ??? I dont quite understand.

I think that sometimes we respond to a situation in the present in a similar way that we might have in the past. Something happens or we anticipate something happening unconsciously and it triggers a memory and then a response. So what we are feeling we are feeling now...it's true emotion... but the meaning behind the emotion might really have to do with your past.

So with desk t being cold, it could be both. You are responding to general coldness with memories from your past, but you might also be responding to her coldness now...in the present.

Or something like that...

BlueMoon6 · Oct 10, 2009, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brightheart

So what we are feeling we are feeling now...it's true emotion... but the meaning behind the emotion might really have to do with your past.

OK- I understand this.......

Quote:

You are responding to general coldness with memories from your past, but you might also be responding to her coldness now...in the present.

But I feel like a dope....I dont understand this

I dont understand what is the difference betweeen "normal" reactions to things, as in dt's coldness, or the reactions I might have from my past.

I am not sure if this is an example, but I will say it anyway:

I saw 2 friends this week who I had not seen in a really, really long time. We had a lot fun and were talking non-stop. From my past: I felt heard, cared about, validated and loved. Of course, there is a part of me that has difficulty taking it in, but I tried, I really tried and I liked being with my friends. What part would be from the present? The positive feelings of enjoying conversation? Maybe it doesnt matter that much which is from my past or present, but I am from a place of not being cared about, validated, heard, missed if I was gone or feeling loved, so it felt that much EXTRA good to be with friends who did all those tihngs for me. I miss having them in my life and living close by (they dont live in my area and we met at the airport).

I dont know if my question is clear. How do I know what is from now or the past.

I have this fear that I will project all these horrible feelings on to ftt that I put onto dt. Its just a matter of time. I feel sorry for her

I dont want to feel hurt by her when it isnt going to be her fault or anything she does. Its my past feelings.