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  #1  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 04:57 PM
Anonymous37798
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Do you ever wonder if you are making stuff up in therapy? Sometimes I don't even recognize myself! I don't know who that person is that keeps talking about things with her therapist.

Could it be that I have pushed things so far down that I can't tell what is real and what isn't? When this stuff comes up, it flows freely. But when I step back and think about what I said, I don't even know that story. It seems surreal to me.

In my rational mind, I know that I am not making stuff up! I am so blasted confused right now. Am I living in the past or the present? I feel like I am in one of those time machines that visits the past. Squiggle is getting stuck back there and she doesn't know how to come back to reality!

It is almost like two completely different people. I am very confused and just about to lose my mind over this! Is it worth it to go back and dig up the past? Sometimes its as if we are going into areas of the mind that can play games with you. Is if real or fake? True or false? Did it happen or not? Are my details right? Are my emotions taking over and causing me to exaggerate things? Am I hallucinating?

I don't know that person who is talking to my therapist. Who is she?
Thanks for this!
Suratji

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  #2  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 05:19 PM
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Sometimes I feel like this unreal sensation in therapy. I know what I'm saying is the truth but it seems so far away from me, like I'm referring to someone else. I think, for me at least, that it's partly dissociation. Trying so hard to distance myself from the painful reality that lies deep within. Sometimes I feel disconnected, logically I know what's going on, but my heart won't make the connection. Does that help?
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  #3  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 05:47 PM
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Squiggle, I SO understand what you're talking about. When I first starting seeing T, I told her that everything I say will be a lie. Not that I would deliberately be telling untruths but that I know enough about how the mind works that I know I cannot trust it at all.

In "The Book of Mirdad" by Mikhail Naimy, it is written that "Speech is at best an honest lie." I told my T that my memory is poor, that I will remember just a part of the story, that my memory will be distorted, that it will have changed with time, that my emotions and thoughts will have filtered out most of the 'truth' of the story.

It's like that parable of the 3 blind men and the elephant. The reality depends on where we are looking.

So, should we be digging up stuff from the past? Or from the inner recesses of our minds? That is a question I keep asking T. I question whether I should be participating in the 'process'. I also keep asking myself if I'm being overly dramatic.
Am I embellishing stuff just because it keeps me feeling alive? Am I being creative in my story? Am I descending into fantasy?

Is it possible that I'm so in love with myself that I just want to keep talking because it's the best entertainment around? Do I want the attention? Do I revel in my self-absorption?

Lately, I also have felt that I'm losing my mind.
  #4  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 05:51 PM
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(((((Squiggles)))))

I feel this way in waves and I think this is one of the reasons why I avoid talking about deep things in T. Sometimes I feel like my normal old self- and other times (like this week) I get that feeling of not being sure any of this is real. I hate it. It's like a blanket is lifted ever so slightly from over my eyes and I see something and then, BANG- that blanket is dropped and I'm not sure if what I thought I saw is what I really saw. It confuses me too- and makes me want to do stupid things. I guess it could be dissociation of some sort, but who knows. All I know is it is a terrible feeling and honestly makes me feel like I really am crazy. So Squiggles, if you and I do feel the same thing- maybe it is real and we're not really crazy after all. But- who knows?

I think this topic is a really triggering me right now.

At least I know I'm not alone with this feeling anymore- thanks Squiggles.
Thanks for this!
Suratji
  #5  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 06:42 PM
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I feel like a different person with T. I have told her a lot "I'm really not this serious in real life", and I think she gets what I mean.
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  #6  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 06:59 PM
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I really really really don't think you are losing your mind at all, just your footing perhaps.

For me it was very easy to get caught in the swell of telling. It's like being lifted off the ground by a wave in the ocean. I think it's called derealization or something like that and stress can cause it.

Whatever the reason, I've definitely felt it in my therapy, and outside of it too. The key is to ground yourself in the now. Touch something (I actually like to physically touch the ground). Look at something and try to account for every detail. Another great way to snap back to reality (at least for me) it to pick a word on a sign and see how many other words I can make out of the original word. It's a distraction, but it works.

True or not, are you getting the details right? You know, I don't really think it matters. What matters is trying to connect with how you felt at the time.

Suratji is right, the memory is fickle - easily tainted, but the mind and body remembers all too well.

For me, there are large chunks of time that I have absolutely no memory of. My dreams are filled with rooms that I can't go into and words that I can not read. It was crazy making until, with my therapist's help, I realized that it doesn't matter. What matters is the feeling, and those are hard to make up.

That person in the therapy room is you. You're here, you're alive and you're growing.
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  #7  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elliemay View Post
What matters is the feeling, and those are hard to make up.
I'm counting on this being true or else I'm going to be swallowed up in the vortex.
  #8  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 07:26 PM
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Here's a thought. Think about what good fiction does. It tells essential truths even if the details are imaginary. A story isn't just something to get lost in; that's not why the best fiction captures us. It captures us because an imaginary story a writer dreamed up 100 years ago resonates with us today; it says something vital about our OWN experiences, our own wounds and hearts.

I believe this can be true for our own stories as well. Even when we're not clear about certain details, the emotional truths stay with us. You may not remember the chronology of X traumatic event (and in fact, it's unusual for that to happen--traumatic memory isn't encoded that way neurologically). But the impressions--of feeling terrified, trapped, hopeless, whatever it is--I think there's a terrible and important truth in those things. And that is the stuff of therapy.

I think that as long as we keep that awareness that the details may remain fuzzy forever, but the emotional themes are real material, then we can trust the therapeutic process and eventually get better.

Just my $.02.

LG

Last edited by lovelygirl; Mar 19, 2011 at 07:26 PM. Reason: edit
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  #9  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suratji View Post
I'm counting on this being true or else I'm going to be swallowed up in the vortex.
YES! the feeling or fear of being overwhelmed, sucked under. This is definitely something you need to talk to your therapist about.

It's been my experience that therapist's really don't want their clients to feel that way at all and are more than willing to help you contain it and develop coping skills to keep you here.

Therapy can definitely be wildly painful, but it should not be overwhelming or obliterative. There is room for sanity at even the most distressing parts.

I know you can find your way to it.
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  #10  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 07:47 PM
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Yes. I do wonder. But I know that the pain is real - even if the facts are not 100%
  #11  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 08:49 PM
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This all came about because (in therapy) we are going back to the time when I was sexually abused at the age of 10 years old. It happened twice, but at the time, I don't remember making a huge ordeal about it. I did tell my parents and they handled it. I don't remember what all went on after that. Back in those days, you didn't talk about this kind of thing openly.

Now that I am sharing this with my therapist, there are a couple of details that I shared with her, that I don't really remember for sure if it happened or not.

This part of the abuse would be really hard for a 10 year old to take in. Am I remembering it now as an adult, because the 10 year old could not handle it? Or am I making this part up? It feels like I am having flashbacks, but are they real?

When I think about it, I get very emotional and start crying. Yet I still feel like, "What are you crying about?" The tears are coming, but I question WHY they are there. I do not feel the connection between the tears and what I am thinking about the abuse. It feels like they are separated, yet somehow go together?

It makes me feel like there is more to my story than I am allowing myself to remember. But what does that matter now? How is that going to help me in therapy? How is revisting this area of my life going to help me now?

Last edited by Anonymous37798; Mar 19, 2011 at 09:35 PM.
  #12  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiggle328 View Post
This part of the abuse would be really hard for a 10 year old to take in. Am I remembering it now as an adult, because the 10 year old could not handle it? Or am I making this part up? It feels like I am having flashbacks, but are they real?

When I think about it, I get very emotional and start crying. Yet I still feel like, "What are you crying about?" The tears are coming, but I question WHY they are there. I do not feel the connection between the tears and what I am thinking about the abuse. It feels like they are separated, yet somehow go together?

It makes me feel like there is more to my story than I am allowing myself to remember. But what does that matter now? How is that going to help me in therapy? How is revisting this area of my life going to help me now?
((((((((Squiggle)))))))))

I know the thought of this is excruciating, because you're coming back to something so important in your early life and you want to make sense of it--wouldn't any of us? I wonder if you might be able to sort of "reserve judgment" on the accuracy of the details, just for the moment, and stay with the feelings that are coming up? Having been through this process myself, I might only suggest that staying true to those feelings and impressions--even if you don't "know" the details for sure--is vital to your recovery.

In terms of, can this really help me now? I think that is a good question to explore with your T, depending on where you are in your life. If you're struggling and clearly affected by early stuff, taking the plunge might turn out to be really helpful. But if you have a lot on your plate in your present-day life and a more straightforward, supportive psychotherapy makes sense at this particular moment for you, that's important to discuss as well.

Please don't hesitate to PM me if you want to talk further...I'm here.

LG
  #13  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Squiggle328 View Post
How is that going to help me in therapy? How is revisting this area of my life going to help me now?

Have you asked your T how it's going to help you now? What does she say?

In the book "Molecules of Emotion" by Candace B. Pert, Ph.D, she explains that our emotions live in our molecules. That's why we need to feel in our bodies, not just in our minds.

She writes, "If our emotions are blocked due to denial, repression, or trauma, then blood flow can become chronically constricted, depriving the frontal cortex, as well as other organs, of vital nourishment.

"This can leave you foggy and less alert, limited in you awareness and thus your ability to intervene into the conversation of your bodymind, to make decisions that change physiology or behavior.

"As a result, you may become stuck - unable to respond freshly to the world around you, repeating old patterns of behavior and feeling that are responses to an outdated knowledge base.

"By learning to bring your awareness to past experiences and conditioning - memories stored in the very receptors of your cells- you can release yourself from these blocks, this 'stuckness'."
  #14  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 09:38 PM
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((((((((Squiggle)))))))))
I wonder if you might be able to sort of "reserve judgment" on the accuracy of the details, just for the moment, and stay with the feelings that are coming up? LG
I did think about that. Just let these emotions come up and journal what I am "feeling". It is weird, though! Like an out of body experience.
  #15  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 09:46 PM
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Have you asked your T how it's going to help you now? What does she say? I sent her an email and told her what is going on. She may not reply until Monday.

"By learning to bring your awareness to past experiences and conditioning - memories stored in the very receptors of your cells- you can release yourself from these blocks, this 'stuckness'." That is VERY interesting!
I am leary of being brain washed or something. Like talking in therapy and getting carried away. Things comes out of my mouth that are foreign to me.

My body is getting really tense and I find I am extremely uncomfortable talking about some things. Even though I am not mentally aware of WHY I am so uncomfortable, my body is reacting for some reason.

This is when I get up off the couch and start pacing the floor, moving from couch to chair, to the floor, and then the cycle keeps going until I have calmed down enough to sit in one place.

I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THERAPY AT ALL!!!
  #16  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 10:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiggle328 View Post
I am leary of being brain washed or something. Like talking in therapy and getting carried away. Things comes out of my mouth that are foreign to me.

My body is getting really tense and I find I am extremely uncomfortable talking about some things. Even though I am not mentally aware of WHY I am so uncomfortable, my body is reacting for some reason.

This is when I get up off the couch and start pacing the floor, moving from couch to chair, to the floor, and then the cycle keeps going until I have calmed down enough to sit in one place.

I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THERAPY AT ALL!!!
What I've learned from my T is that the rational part of the brain will not understand - at least at first while we're letting ourselves 'go there'.

Something very very deep is hidden within you and it's crying to be released. I wonder if you stop trying to understand and just go with it for awhile, if it might lead to some amazing release.

Many of us have spent years repressing emotions and in order to be whole, we must allow them to come forth.

Thich Nhat Hanh writes about the wounded child: "Each time we're in touch with the experience of suffering, we believe we can't bear it, and we stuff our feelings and memories deep down in our unconscious mind. It may be that we haven't dared to face this child for many decades.

"Just because we may have ignored the child doesn't mean she or he isn't there. The wounded child is always there, trying to get our attention. The child says, 'I'm here. I'm here. You can't avoid me. You can't run away from me.'

"We want to end our suffering by sending the child to a deep place inside, and staying as far away as possible. But running away doesn't end our suffering; it only prolongs it.

"The wounded child asks for care and love, but we do the opposite. We run away because we're afraid of suffering. The block of pain and sorrow in us feels overwhelming.

"This child has been severely wounded. She or he really needs us to return. Instead we turn away. The wounded child is in each cell of our body."

He then offers some concrete suggestions on how to take care and soothe the wounded child.

Squiggle - we all need to listen to that child within us.
Thanks for this!
rainbow8, WePow
  #17  
Old Mar 19, 2011, 11:20 PM
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I've often wondered the same thing and thinking about it really upsets me. I feel like I've ruined his life by telling my family. I was called a liar and part of me wonders if I really am. Then I remember bits and pieces of things and I get this horrible feeling inside, and I wonder how I could possibly lie about something like this and feel this terrible inside and disgusted with myself if it wasn't true.

We're heading towards working on the CSA in T and I'm terrified. I know, the only way out is through. I'd rather bury myself in a hole and stay there.
  #18  
Old Mar 20, 2011, 04:18 AM
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Squiggle - we all need to listen to that child within us.
When I look back on all of my struggles, I feel an immense sense of gratitude and compassion for little ellie. Although she is me, she suffered what I could not, and stayed alive, and for the most part sane. She carried a tremendous load on her little shoulders and I honor her by telling her story and, as such, I honor myself.

What helped me immensely to wrangle those awful images in my mind was to (in my mind's eye) go back to the little me and offer that love and compassion.

Almost as though "I couldn't do anything then, but I can now" I have that power now.
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  #19  
Old Mar 20, 2011, 06:03 AM
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One of the sayings that help me when I feel like my body remembers stuff that my mind does not remember due to the CSA is this:

"The body sheds the tears the eyes refuse to weep."
  #20  
Old Mar 20, 2011, 07:13 AM
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I don't speak of the past much, and I never speak of details. When I do tell a childhood story or event it does feel a lot like a really bad made-for-tv movie, not my life at all. It never touches me really, but then again not much does.
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Old Mar 20, 2011, 07:34 AM
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I am remembering something too......and I wonder, how real is my memory, too? But I don't think I am making it up.....7 year old me did suffer something real. It's frightening, it's natural to wonder about the validity of memory, but I would just give yourself permission to feel the feelings and give the feelings and the pain validity. Don't worry about the actual details.....the pain is real, even if all the details cannot be remembered clearly or perfectly.....
  #22  
Old Mar 20, 2011, 09:11 AM
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About 8 mos. into my therapy, I was laying on my bed and just thinking about my childhood when I started having these images, kind of like little flashes in my mind of horrible things happening to me as a child. From the ages of about 7 to 12, as far as I know, but also remember having an irrational fear from about age 4, which I still have to this day. At first, I was thinking that it wasn't real, but, as I laid there and just let my mind "be", the memories started coming back. I am amazed that through all the talking of childhood memories my T and I did for 8 mos, every week, that this never came up in my mind. T said I wasn't ready for it to until it did. And throughout my adult life, I never remembered it, either, but it is monumental. I am just now beginnning to understand why certain things bother me, like any woman touching me, even in a non-threatening way, like a touch on the shoulder. T said it was just too painful for me to keep in my active memory, so I put it down so deep, that it didn't surface until I was opening up about other things that happened. So, Squiggle, it definately happens, and I wish you the best with your struggles. I know for me if I keep going and keep talking, someday it will be better. In fact things are better than when I first started therapy a year and a half ago. Blessings...
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  #23  
Old Mar 20, 2011, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiggle328 View Post
Now that I am sharing this with my therapist, there are a couple of details that I shared with her, that I don't really remember for sure if it happened or not.

This part of the abuse would be really hard for a 10 year old to take in.
Remember, a 10 year old's impression of sex would not be a "true"/adult view. You did not make it up but the words and images you have are those of a "foreigner" who does not understand the culture!

My mother died when I was 3, was sick all her life and my father remarried when I was 5. I "merged" my two mothers and spent 2-3 years of my therapy just on un-merging them, that one task. I remember when my T pointed out how "jumbled" my memories of the time was (the six months before my mother died, the year after she died, the four or five months he was dating my stepmother and then "we" got married (it took a really long time for me to not think/feel about my father marrying my stepmother that way, as "we" getting married)).

To unravel a problem so it can be reknit better, you have to go to the age where it took place and "be" that person again with those thoughts, feelings, viewpoint. The further back that is, the more tattered the yarn gets from the unraveling, like when you drop a stitch in knitting/crochet and have to go back and pick it up.
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  #24  
Old Mar 20, 2011, 11:10 AM
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"Fix the problem, not the blame". We always have to take responsibility for our own actions, they are always ours. But, understanding the thoughts, feelings, and choices we have made in the past help to inform us so that we might make better choices in the future.

I was sexually repressed and abused as a child and had a lot of difficulty with my sexually as a young adult; I did not meet my husband until I was 34 years old. I directly credit my therapy of the time for allowing me to take more chances and be more "there" in my dating/relationship with my husband over the next couple years and we've now been married for almost 22. Had I not been in therapy, not learned what I learned from it, I seriously doubt I could have made the relationship work.
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  #25  
Old Mar 20, 2011, 11:19 AM
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Hmmm... It's hard for anyone to say who has been abused and who hasn't. Not everyone in therapy is there because of abuse for sure, but, well, some are. Period. Sometimes you have to call what it was for what it was.

Without a doubt the power of suggestion can be very very strong and I do think it is important to view a repressed memory for what it is. It could be something that one simply can't remember, it doesn't necessarily have to have anything to do with abuse. My therapist and I both agree that what I do know is bad enough.

Also, regarding the brainwashing, mmm.... I think it's important to relate that only to your own therapy. Do you feel as though you have been brainwashed? If so, then it is right and proper to step out of therapy for awhile - or perhaps search for another therapist.

As soon as we assume the role of adult, we also assume responsibility for our own actions, to me this is always true. Letting go of the blame from the past helps us step into that role easier. Recognizing our own patterns of behavior, the distortions that we have and how to correct them is the essence of therapy.

I think for some uncovering the etiology of those distortions and patterns is essential to unlearning them. For others, not so much. Perhaps you should talk to your therapist about their orientation of therapy and whether or not it suits you or your goals.

It is so easy to get caught up in what I call "navel gazing" and the "why me's", but a good therapist and a solid foot in the here and now can help snap one out of that.

Yet, for some a story has to be told, it is so important for a past to be honored.
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