What does your T do?

Here's another question: do you ever take something physical away with you from your session with T? An object of some kind?

I know someone in another thread say they borrow books.

I sometimes accept my T's offer of a bottle of water at my sessions. I usually don't finish the bottle by session's end so I take it with me. I have a lot of "his" bottles at my house. As with other water bottles I have, I wash them out and reuse them multiple times. Whenever I use one of the bottles from him, which are a certain brand, I think of him. That is so dumb! Kind of pathetic. But it helps me feel closer to him between sessions.

The only other thing I ever take with me is his business card.

Hi Purple, long thread to read, but an interesting one indeed, so hope you get through it all.....as for the core issues, yea at first she told me I needed my sypmtoms under control to be able to deal with the outcome. I accept that, it's just been that I don't feel she goes there as fully as I'd like and my frustration now lies in the fact that I've told her this more than once...and I feel my symptoms were under control enough to warrant that. Not sure if it's her inability or her wise process...

Sunrise, that's not pathetic, especially if it helps you! My T made me a cd and I have it and that was very cool....she said she wanted me to read this book she was going to bring in and I said I'd love to read it....but she never brought it in so guess she forgot which makes me feel...........forgotten.

See, these are the little things that I pinpoint and hone in on and think......she's not that good....

> at first she told me I needed my sypmtoms under control to be able to deal with the outcome. I accept that, it's just been that I don't feel she goes there as fully as I'd like and my frustration now lies in the fact that I've told her this more than once...and I feel my symptoms were under control enough to warrant that.

i guess that she doesn't see that your symptoms are under control enough yet. that is why she referred you on to p-doc and why she won't risk doing anything to have you dysregulate further.

it could be the case that she is misreading the intensity of your distress?

it would be worth talking to her about what it is that makes her think that your symptoms aren't under control.

hear what she has to say...

it might be that you can see the sense in it or it might not. would be nice to give her the chance to explain though.

Yea maybe alex......I want her to know the severity of my emotional distress so she'll go to the core with me, but then maybe she sees that as symptoms not under control...grrrrrr....the balance of that blows....

So yea, haven't called pdoc---yet.

Wrote 4 page summary (ha ha summary ya) about "us" and how we need to get on a track and get "unstuck" and I'm open to hearing what she has to say and I know I can be petulant. So, that's where we're at, I sent it off, yes with email, to her and I see her tuesday. Thanks alex, I will hear her out on this.

> I want her to know the severity of my emotional distress so she'll go to the core with me, but then maybe she sees that as symptoms not under control...grrrrrr....the balance of that blows....

Yep. the balance of that does indeed blow. But yeah, I'd say that that is what is going on. When I read your initial post I understood why it was that she referred you on to p-doc and why it was that she didn't want to go any deeper with you. Of course I also understand your frustration in wanting to go deeper and deal with this stuff. And I also understand the frustration of conveying how intense emotions are but also wanting to convey that they are manageable to a certain extent... But yeah, the balance blows...

One thing that it might be nice to work on (in preperation) is some emotion regulation strategies and some distress tolerance strategies as well. It is really important to keep up with practicing those strategies because the core work can be really very painful and life can become about stringing together such coping strategies in order to get through at times.

I'm a bit scared of falling apart under the pressure of the core stuff. I have a tendency to sink into depression and just want to die. I start to feel like that during the week a little. Trying to implement strategies around acting opposite to emotion and exercising and self soothing etc but it is hard. I'm out of practice, you see.

Could you ask your therapist if she knows anything about Linehan's DBT skills? The mindfulness meditation, distress tolerance, and emotion regulation skills could really help you out. Especially the emotion regulation one by the sounds of it. Sounds to me like your t needs some evidence that you are able to regulate your emotion before she is prepared to risk talking about the core stuff. Why? Because she doesn't want to to disintegrate (which is horribly horribly horribly painful for you).

Alexandra - What is emotion regulation? How do you do that?

http://www.dbtsf.com/emotional-regulation.htm

The following lists all the emotion regulation skills but it opens a PDF which takes a while to load.

http://www.borderlinepersonality.ca/...regulation.pdf

when you get to talking about past traumas and the like things get a lot more intense. it isn't just the sessions that get more intense it is out of sessions that get more intense too. there are more flashbacks. there are more intensely distressing emotions. it is much much harder to keep up with daily activities.

it is hard because often people struggle with those things anyway. and the way forward (so life isn't such a struggle) is often talking about and working through the past. but it really is important to have good coping strategies in place before talking about the past traumas. otherwise... people can disintegrate to the point that they need to be hospitalised because they simply can't cope with daily life. if that happens (and one is hospitalised) then the focus shifts from the past traumas to present coping, so if that happens then one doesn't get to work through the past traumas anyway.

the first phase of therapy is meant to be about building trust. it is also meant to be about building up a reportoir of coping strategies and the like as well. when you are coping fairly okay with day to day requirements then you are ready to start doing the intensive work. without those coping strategies in place one is only going to disintegrate in trying to talk through the trauma. that can lead to a lot of abbreaction (intense emotions) and no working through. lots of pain and rumination and flashbacks with no progress / real gains.

i'm getting to the point now where i started touching on some of that phase two trauma work. and now i need him to back off. i need to go back to phase one because this is getting a bit too much for me. i'm getting in touch with the pain (which is a kind of a flashback experience). i'm getting intrusive memories / ruminations. i'm unable to continue on with my work obligations. i'm unable to get out of bed / stop the rumination and refocus on things that i know help me feel better (like doing some exercise, going for a walk, enjoying my friends company). so it is time to back off the phase two and return to phase one in order to consolodate some of those coping strategies.

i'm really thinking that your t is kind of caught between a rock and a hard place. you want her to see something of how hard things are for you so she will be motivated to help you. so she will plunge into the hard work with you so you will feel better. the trouble is that plunging into the hard work is going to make you feel worse for quite a while. ultimately it will make you feel better, yes. that is why it is worth doing it. but short term it will make you feel one hell of a lot worse. so you need to be strong enough to feel even worse than you do right now.

that will take time. takes time to build up trust with t and a good working relationship. to develop a positive transference so her presence can help you regulate your emotions and so you can internalise some of that to carry her around with you so that your idea of her can help you regulate your emotions. time to figure out the sorts of activities that typically have a positive effect on your mood (going for a run or taking a long hot bubble bath etc). learning via experience that acting in spite of ones emotion (e.g., going for a run instead of ruminating in bed) helps one feel better and keeps one involved in life so one doesn't get lost in the horrible emotions.

my t asked me last year if i wanted to do dbt skills group this year. i said 'no'. but i'm going to ask him next week if that would still be an option. because i'm struggling yeah. i wasn't able to act opposite to emotion yesterday and i'm only feeling calmer now because i took a valium and now i'm binging on potato chips (which replace the panic with lethargy).

sigh.

((((hang in there sweetie))))

> I went last evening. Fell to pieces.

(((((((((((((((((((talulah))))))))))))))))))))))
(((((((((((((((((((alex)))))))))))))))))))))))))
sounds like you are both doing a lot of really great work. you both inspire me. thank you.

I have so much to tell you guys about what happened!!!! I'll try to keep it short.....ha ha....

So, i emailed the 4 page list of "%#@&#!" going on with me. She had it ready when I arrived and had another copy for me too....I knew she would....

We went through it all, point (paragraph) by point. We addressed every single item on it. We went well over the time but she was so patient and incredible. She had many thoughts and new ideas and suggestions. It's soooo much to tell you guys, but overall I had this amazing session with her. Absolutely inspiring and strengthening for us. I hope I can keep this feeling.

So, to address some of your awesome posts above:
She loaned me a book to read...yay....!
Yes, taking "something" away from therapy feels great. Also she has some new ideas about where we will go and what we will work on. Also, she will give me more directed "homework", which makes me happy.

She brought up mindfulness!!!!! Yay, alex and others who've mentioned this, I smiled pretty big when she talked of this and she asked me if I had looked into this as I was smiling about it. I thought of you guys! I felt happy that we'll try to incorporate some of this.

Overall, I laid it all out.....how I feel about her, her approach and us......it was so intimidating and scary. I challenged the crap out of her! I asked her sooo many questions. She was great, answered everything and was very genuine. It became easier to "talk" to her and we felt more solidified. I asked her some difficult questions that she could've easily taken offense to but she was secure and reassuring.

The only thing I didn't like to hear was, in response to me telling her I wanted her to take control, she said, she has a problem with that and will not do that to me as abusers have in the past.

There's so much to tell.....but I want you all to gather courage and ask the questions you most need to.....even if you start with just one.......

It is very hard, but we cannot gain ground without these attempts. It's the only way to get unstuck if you're like me and wedge your t in a small box. Anyway, hope this *high* lasts and that I can remember these emotions when she makes me mad or I invalidate her in my head again........

If anyone has any questions or wants to know more personal stuff....just PM or post and I'll answer otherwise, I'll probably bore the crap out of you if I go on........

(((((((((thanks you guys))))))))))))))

That is fantastic news, Talulah! It sounds like your client/T relationship has grown by leaps and bounds! You had so much courage and it totally paid off.

You said we could ask you questions, so here goes. What did she say about your feeling that you weren't getting to the core issues? That she didn't want to go deep with you and deal with the root stuff? Did she say why she won't go there with you? Does she think you're not ready? Or it will not be productive? I'm all ears! (as my T likes to say, lol)

This sounds like she is nurturing the inner child in you. Giving the nurturing your mother could not give you for what ever reasons.How the inner child and the adult feel: like feeling safe accepted and loved without judgment are safe feelings.I had an older friend who did that for me once and I cherished that moment and still do.Because no unwanted boundaries were crossed.And it helped me to remember that I am love able and a loving person even though I felt I was being mistreated by my husband and being accused of things that was not the truth of me.This was much needed affirmation in a timely fashion.And was paramount to my changed direction in life. It gave me the strength to do what was best for me.

Smilie

Smilie

Sunrise, we discussed this at length and she said its a fine line she walks as she has to try to determine if the symptoms are under control enough while still validating the pain I try to articulate. She said I am the best monitor of my symptoms and i need to be more clear with myself and her on "how" i am doing.

She admitted needing to show me more "nurturing" as I feel invalidated much by her and that is not her intention. She apologized for that and said it gets tough to have a "wise-mind" balance with her rationality and emotions with me. She thinks she may need to show me more of how I affect her.....but typically she keeps this kind of response under wraps as she needs to be able to have a rational input and be able to balance that as I cannot. She knows my boundaries are askew and she treads a bit lightly I think. She seemed more 'powerful' or confident, almost to the tip of a bit more stern with me this time like she needs to impose on my boundaries a bit for me to evolve. I think she's trying to still feel out my comfort zone.

That said she does want to go to the core issues with me, but reminds me that she's not a mind reader and that I need to take more "control" of where we go. I told her I hated that and I wished for her to take control and dig for my secrets. She said she would not take control....but could help me in tip toeing back into the past. She also said she knows there are things we haven't touched on and she knows more than I realize and she has it noted that we need to go there and will go there when she "feels" it. I guess, I needed (need) to trust her and not try so hard.

She used some wonderful analogies that were heartwarming and made me feel really cared for and that helped quite a bit. She also said the ruminations need to be more at bay before we go into more details. When ruminating i cannot deal with the reliving the traumas. I know she talks with pdoc abou this stuff...

Yea, we are growing (by major leaps and bounds) and our relationship is like a weird courtship......reaching out for one another, being careful and it's all very exciting. It's in a vulnerable and scary place right now so that is both exciting and nerve wracking, but overall I think it means we aren't against that wall anymore and we will keep on together...

Hey Smilie, you are so right about this. And it does feel good. She doesn't want to be "seen" as a mother transference figure with me but is trying to get through to me that she cares very much about me. She nurtures, in little itty bitty ways......she realizes my boundaries are weak but told me with great confidence that hers are firmly in place and so i can let the guard down a bit......I'm liking this nurturing tho and it makes me feel shameful (blush).

Wow, what a cool T. I think she sounds good to me. I'm glad that things worked out for you. I'm glad that you were brave enough to bring this up with T. Keep up the hard work!

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Sunrise, we discussed this at length and she said its a fine line she walks as she has to try to determine if the symptoms are under control enough while still validating the pain I try to articulate. She said I am the best monitor of my symptoms and i need to be more clear with myself and her on "how" i am doing.

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Talulah, that's great! I think you have been feeling ready to work on some of this stuff and it sounds like your T is ready to trust you on whether you are ready or not. Yay!

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She knows my boundaries are askew and she treads a bit lightly I think. She seemed more 'powerful' or confident, almost to the tip of a bit more stern with me this time like she needs to impose on my boundaries a bit for me to evolve. I think she's trying to still feel out my comfort zone.

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That's really interesting. How do T's learn what our boundaries are? Sometimes it's hard for us to articulate that, and we may not know ourselves. So they need to have ways of probing. A couple of sessions ago, near the end of the session, my T pushed and pushed and pushed, really aggressively (for him). He's never really done that before. He pushed me so hard I was lobbing defenses his way right and left until finally all I could come up with was repeating "I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared." Then he immediately quit, and I was exhausted but OK. Now after reading what you wrote, I think maybe he was looking for my boundaries. Guess he found them. And we know more now, and we move on.

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She used some wonderful analogies that were heartwarming and made me feel really cared for and that helped quite a bit.

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Hmmmm, that sounds great.

Talulah, it sounds like things are going great for you in therapy. Your big risk paid off. (((hugs))) I learn so much from reading people's "therapy stories" here on the board. Thanks for sharing.

Talulah, I am so happy for you. Your seesion sounds wonderful. I am so glad that you were able to talk about all those difficult things. What courage. I can not wait to hear where you go from here!!!

Thanks guys......your support helps me to do this....it really does. Especially when i have a crap session, you all are there with your stories........xo

talulah i have taken so much from this thread. its been invaluable. ive actually truthfully taken notes on what you ve said so i have pertinent questions to ask T next week to hopefully truthfully deepen our relationship. ive been having a lot of trouble (and i mean a LOT) relating truthfully the emotions ive been having to T but with your thoughts i at least have a vocabulary to put my own feelings into words with. you have been endlessly helpful. so thank you so much. and i hope you continue to have this sort of success with your T!

Thanks Biiv, that means a great deal to me! I have so many more questions I've asked my T, and I just haven't posted them all here. I wrote that 4 page email and it was intense. I'd always be happy to send you any I've written to her if you ever want them......even though our situations may differ, I sent some pretty long and intense discussions with her and it helped me put words to feelings I couldn't do in therapy. It strengthened our bond as she went paragraph by paragraph in therapy and encouraged me to face her and hear her replies.
You may find them helpful if you feel ashamed about what things you want to know or feel from your t. At least to know I felt (and feel sometimes) the same way about the dyad and how we connect. Anyway, if you ever want the inner-most workings of my twisted little mind, PM me and I'd be happy to share.......or hear yours as well........

((((((((((((((Biiv)))))))))))))))))))))) you can grow by leaps and bounds when you push that comfort zone between you and T.

the only time ive actually handed my T a sheet of stuff she started to go through it line by line with me and i had to stop. i just couldnt face it. since then its gone in one of her drawers and she nearly brought it out once since but i asked her not to.
this week im so determined to make this session count. i didnt get to see her last week and ive been feeling really stuck with her recently so this week i have some journalling done, been working on some exercises, getting clearer in my head where i want to go (not that thats very clear at all!) etc. BUT today i found out i have something seriously terrifying to do for school this wednesday and im seeing T on tuesday so im afraid my anxiety over this may take over the session and i ll be soooo annoyed if that happens! stupid anxiety. grrrrrrrrrrrr.
ok though i have one question for YOU... can i have your T please?? hehehe. she sounds fantastic. im glad you have such great support.
id love to hear from you in PM if you ever want to share/chat/vent etc.
(((((((((((((((((talulah)))))))))))))))))

Talulah,

I haven't read this wonderful thread in a while.

I'm so glad things worked out with you and your T! She sounds like a great T and I admire you for asking her challenging questions and reviving the good feelings you have for her and therapy!