Emotional walls

[I admit I haven't read all the responses]

You've heard the adage I'm sure 'you want what you cannot have.' Is it perhaps the experience of the persuit that is the attraction?

If you really do love this woman - which is wonderful - patience is golden. There are proactive things you can do too. Have you had a sit down yet and discussed her mental health challenges? What about discussing your own thoughts and dreams? Showing interest in her will go far. Include her in your life and she may include you in hers, ex. I'm going to such in such, do you want to come along? Be careful though that you stop short of her looking at you as merely a confidant. Of course, there is always honesty. Ask her out.

Good for you

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I include her in as much as I can, to the point that she almost gets fed up with me asking "do you want to (insert activity) with me?" I have told her how I feel, and it always gets met with distance. If I said "the L word" she would probably never talk to me again. I she knows that I have very strong feelings for her, but never gives any indication of how she feels about me, except that she sometimes wants to hang out (lately only if she needs something done around the house), or sometimes she won't talk to me for days. She knows my issues, and I know hers. She knows how I feel, but I have no clue how she feels.

oh gosh, you are in a difficult conundrum.

This may be pretty hard; as she apparently knows your interests, what about getting her to discuss her own?

It sounds like she has possibly come to think of you as a confidant already. One way to discourage this is to not make yourself available to her at her beck and call. You need to keep that ball in your own court. You need to show her that you are not dependant on her too. The idea is she see you as your own person - one she wants to get closer to.

I put it all out there, and I feel I was pretty clear.

"I need to get something off my chest. Last month was one of the most challenging times for me ever. Huge ups and downs. My home life turned upside-down, and it was very difficult to deal with, on top of being in the deepest depression of my life. I got to meet and spend time with a beautiful and intriguing woman, though, and that made things much better. You helped me through a very dark time, and I'll be forever grateful. There's a problem, though. I developed very strong feelings for you. Ones that I am afraid aren't reciprocated. I understand you have your own issues to deal with, but I think I need to be honest with you and with myself. I think I need to walk away. I'm falling in love with a woman who will probably never love me, and it's not healthy. I don't want to give up, but I also can't wait around hoping that one day you'll decide you want to be with me. This is really hard for me to do, but I hope you understand why I have to do it. If I'm making a huge mistake, please tell me. Otherwise, thank you for some amazing memories. The day at the aquarium was one of the best times I've ever had. Cruising around in the country in the Tahoe, dancing in the headlights, the airshow, Red Balloon, I'll never forget any of it. You're beautiful and smart, and I am lucky to have had the opportunity to spend time with you at all."

To which she replied (predictably):

"Okay... Wow. Can I have a while to digest that before replying?"

That's what she always says when I try to explein to her how I feel about her. Yet she never addresses it. It is never "digested," she just ignores it like nothing happened. I'll be interested to see what she says here, if anything.

It's over.

I regret not trying harder. This will be the one that got away. Maybe if I worked more she would have loved me and I wouldn't have had to leave. Maybe if I made more of an effort to show her my love she wouldn't have pushed back so hard. How do I continue to have a friendship with her sister, who is great and has really looked out for me through all of this. How do I continue to develop a friendship with her parents? They were awesome to me, and her father supports me in a way I can hardly explain. He always had encouraging things to say to me; I'm in the middle of a HUGE career change, moving into the field from which he just retired and he always had a tip for me, or the name of someone I need to contact. He is my "in," and in the line of work I'm going into, it REALLY all about who you know...and he was really high up.

I'm going to miss her so much, and if she misses me even a little, she sure as hell won't be telling me. That hurts.

You have nothing to regret. Trying harder? You already tried too hard. Honestly asking a man to do things around the house while not being into him isn't "hanging out" is using the person to ones advantage. Sure maybe she has nice parents but that's not a good enough reason.

By the way I am friends with my ex's adult kids. They asked and I agreed. And I was the one who left their dad and they still wanted to be friends. There is no law against being friends with family of your exes. You can do it just fine

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It wouldn't be weird to be remain friends with her family? Now that I think about it, one of my ex girlfriends stayed friends with my mother for years afterwards. It was a little weird, but I guess I didn't care too much.

I what I meant by not trying hard enough was that I didn't try hard enough to be who she needed me to be. I like doing housework and projects and home improvement stuff. It's kind of my thing, along with anything with a motor (there's nothing I can't fix), so I didn't mind doing it, I wasn't expecting that when she asked me over that day...on my birthday. "Happy 30th; here paint my room."

I don't think it's weird. It sometimes complicates things but it happens.

But I am talking about long term relationship of 9 years, we lived together and I was there for his kids graduations weddings child births etc they were my step children. They didn't want to be just cut off. In your situation I don't know, you weren't really in a relationship.

As about trying to be who she wants you to be is a bad idea. You need to be yourself. Sure helping each other around the house is great if you are a couple. Other wise it is one sided and she is using you

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Thanks for the insight. I'm off for a little Monday funday now.

Time for introspection;
In vino, veritas.

You've tried as hard as you could. It seems she just was stuck between shaking you off out of guilt or using you for her needs/loneliness. But she clearly doesn't have feelings for you and is very selfish. If you tried any harder she would've pushed back twice as hard, e.g. "stalker".

Keep the friendship with the sister, just back off the girl herself. Let the chips fall where they may- you're trying to rationalize staying in this. Her sister and parents may very, very well disappear due to the awkwardness. It's not your concern. Often ending things like this you're not just ending things with one person, but whoever they decide to bring with them. Try your best to be just as you were to the family, but if I were you I'd keep a distance for a few weeks to a month, just so the awkwardness dissipates.

You're such a sap, I love it. lol

If you have to mold yourself into what someone else wants in order to win their affection and love, 1) they will never respect you and probably just feign to use you and 2) you'll be empty and lose all dignity. The right girl will love you for you, and won't ask for you to change. It's kind of inhumane to have someone change to fit your needs. Also in line with dignity, try practicing quid pro quo. Painting/moving etc. are all specialty jobs. If you know how to do it, do it once as a favor, and if she seems to be using you, ask for some pay. That way she will know she can't use you, and move on to the next guy to use. Always aim to keep your dignity intact. If someone offered me Kim Kardashian in exchange for my dignity I'd turn the offer down in a snap. She knew she had you because you were lapping after her and eating up her every word. That's when women become users and manipulators. Let's be honest, how many women here have asked a guy to help them with their cars? A pretty smile can save you hundreds!

Hope you don't take offense to any of my tone, lol. I can be a bit brutal.

Not even a little. It was all great. And yes, I am quite the sap. Always have been. I'm a sucker for little things that may seem inconsequential. Like when this girl touched my face one evening with a little smile and said she liked my grey hairs (there was a bit of an age gap, if you hadn't read that). I nearly exploded, partly because that was a little bit out of the ordinary for her. She had those moments all the time; little lapses in guarding herself so carefully. That's what kept me hanging on as long as I did.

Age difference? Try dating women between 28-35? Women as old as 27 can be very immature. 20-24 is the WORST. I know I'm generalizing, but where's the incentive to settle down and take life seriously when at that age the world is "your oyster"? I was dating this 23 year old last year and she actually told me she's looking for a love relationship "for now" to hold her over. Dafuq? Go date a 21 year old frat boy then.

Aim higher and don't be afraid to kick 'em to the curb if your needs aren't met. Your feelings aren't a game and your time could be spent with someone better.

As for little things, I'm like that too to an extent. Chasing after crumbs. Best advice I got on this matter was from a friend who said your job in getting to know a girl is to qualify whether or not she is good enough for you. If you are just ready to accept her regardless, she has the power to do whatever she wants to you.

I'm 30, she is 23. Until this, I had never dated anyone more than 2 years younger...and I thought that was a bit of a stretch! I was pumped to have such a young girl interested in me, it made me feel attractive; like I've "still got it," you know? I also tend (not on purpose) to date women with established careers and very steady lives. She has a great job (HR for a very large, multi-national company), but not a very steady life otherwise. Serious health issues (which didn't bother me), stressful childhood, and really bad relationships immediately prior to me coming along (scared me a little).

Yeah, now that you mention that last part, it can very well be her not knowing how to deal with a decent guy. After all, what's unfamiliar is scary, a turnoff, etc. What I find is that with these types you have to be a certain type of person and the relationship is more or less on their terms. It can be a chore. You're better off.

My ex pinned this today (not the girl this thread is about, the previous girl).

Have I given up on this girl too soon?
Do I need to try harder to accept her quirks?
We're my expectations too high?

...Am I am idiot?

Not a single day has passed where she has not consumed my thoughts. She even sent me an unsolicited text an hour ago. Just as soon as I had distracted myself with a little homework (anatomy, airway management, cardiac emergencies, and pathophysiology. FML) and Jameson, she injects herself back into my mind.

Bartender; another round, please!

(New mantra: In Vino Veritas!)

We are often the most consumed by thoughts about very wrong people because it's familiar.
There are no quirks. She just isn't into you. So what she texted

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She thought about me. That's what. It meant so much to me to know that she was thinking about me. She would never day "Hey, thinking about you," but DAMN IT a random text is as close to that as you'll ever get with her. There is subtext. She said...well, it doesn't matter...but she SAID "you popped into my mind to an extent that I couldn't ignore it."

Meanwhile, I'm busy self-destructing and, for some reason, trying to ruin my relationship with my ex. FFS, she showed up at the bar where I've been all evening unannounced to try to talk through some stuff, and all I could say is "I wish you weren't here." I meant it, but at the same time, I didn't. She loves me so much, but in don't know why. I cheated on her with this girl. I told her about it the next day, but that doesn't change what happened. I moved out of the house we bought, I have been distant, I don't talk to her much, I've used her for sex a couple of times (Lord knows this other girl wasn't putting out...a man has needs, after all). Yet still she sticks around. I don't know if it's a sign she is really strong and confidant in what we had, or if she is like me; glutton for punnishment.

Hahahahaha...

"Hey, there, I thought about you today" is all she gives you after you tell her you're done torturing yourself for a girl who doesn't feel the same way? She won't even tell you if she thinks you're making a mistake. You made everything plain as day and completely made yourself vulnerable to her. She likes the attention you give her, my hipster friend.

You cheated on your ex, who still loves you, for this girl who gives you the dust off her feet in exchange for your everything? Who knows if your ex is a masochist, or really loves you, or is just going through the throes of realization of an ended relationship (which what you're doing right now re: the other girl is a microcosm of). Man...

Can't tell you what's up with the ex, but I will say this girl is just using you and she knows how to manipulate you. Can't blame you though. Power of the pee you ess ess why, man...

I hate your opinion




Because it always makes too much sense.

Girl #2 ("E" if we want to use my earlier designation) is the manipulator, and I know it. But I'm not convinced it's because she is a bad person, but because she doesn't know how to show her emotions. Or because I'm a sucker.

My ex (let's call her "N" out of convenience...and accuracy) loves me. But I don't know if I still love her. I want that intense love you get with a new relationship. We sort of had that, but I have emotional needs that are heavy. I need to feel appreciated, loved, I need to be told I'm attractive. I want to feel doted on (again).

I've been married before, and (for the first 3 years of 5) I got the emotional support I need.

I've had about $50 of Jameson, poured way too strong (bartender thinks I'm cute (she told me (on two occasions ))) so I should probably stfu for the night. I will reevaluate in the morning.

This is hitting too close to home. I posted exactly what I told her, but not our very short conversation afterwards where I asked her to correct me if I had misread her and she said my interpretation was correct. Yet this happened today.

I must be some kind of asshole to think maybe there was ever a shot. Lol (at me).

Eyes opened.

#DrinkTillYouCantFeelFeelings

LOL. Thanks! I'm gonna have a narcissistic moment...



It doesn't matter if she's a good or bad person. In fact, such dichotomies don't exist. I'll get **** for it but I don't think even Hitler was a bad person. Not out of some sort of empathy, but out of principle. Good and bad are entirely subjective constructs and almost everyone in their minds thinks they are good/decent, despite the horrendous damage they cause to others. Most lack self-awareness. And self-awareness is something you can never get enough of. I don't even think it's possible to be 100% self-aware at all times. Humans don't have a long enough lifespan to accumulate that kind of knowledge, lol. The thing is, E gets her needs met this way. It's damaging to you and she's so hungry to get her needs met that she doesn't care or care to know how it affects you. That's on her. Your fault in this is that you keep showing up for more and hiding how much it hurts, hoping she'll see the light and change her behavior. You can't change someone's behavior or thoughts of you, no matter how much you somersault. It's in their control, and lots of times, it's unconscious, so it's not even like they can control it in real-time. You can extract yourself from this situation and end the pain, but it's too much to ask another human being to understand how their actions affect you, especially someone like her who is hungry for attention and has seemngly serious issues. I'll repeat that. It's too much to ask another human being to understand how their actions hurt you. Deep down no one wants to see themselves as a bad person. Most people aren't capable of swallowing that conclusion maturely, and what hurts you may not be hurtful to other people in their lives, and that'll just open up a Pandora's box of rationalizations and bs. What you have is the choice you make to spend your energy/body on someone who can hurt it vs. going elsewhere where you can actually get your needs met. People only care if there is an incentive. People will only empathize or understand your pain if they love you. If you are coming back for more torture, she'll think you are alright with it. In her mind she probably doesn't realize what she's doing to you. In fact she's very far off, probably. She probably thinks you were alright with it. And she's probably done this to so many guys and none of them tore her a new one for her selfish behavior, so she has no eyes with which to see, nor does it serve a function. It gets in the way of her established method of getting her needs met. Again, control yourself, try not to seek to control or change others.

You want infatuation, you want passion. Love is romance, passion, companionship, duty, service, understanding, forgiving, and all that jazz wrapped up in a capsule of longevity. It's normal for relationships to fizz out in the passion department. Especially as responsibility and monotony set in. Imagine how it will be like when you have kids. Lol, this is why many couples keep having kids... to keep some sort of passion, drama, excitement alive. It's totally normal to run low on passion. That's why you do things to spice it up. A relationship is hard, continuous work. Just like life- you never stop. Once you reach a plateau, try something new. Your s/o is a universe of her own- every human being is a universe of their own. I guarantee with all the years, etc. you've known her (N), you probably don't know a lot about her. It's a constant discovery of the other person. Through sex, shared responsibility, new commitments, projects, traveling, etc. This is why some couples find meaning and more love after they have kids. The responsibility shows them a new side of each other they haven't seen before. About your needs- did you ever make it clear to her? Did you two ever try couples or sex therapy?

Go talk to the bartender. She probably wants your tip, but if she wants the whole shaft, who knows you may end the night off well. LOL

Well if you want intensity of a new relationship and all this crazy feeling then you are in for a lot of disappointments as craziness fades and then it either goes deeper and becomes more meaningful or dies. If you dont go deeper it will always die and you'll chase the next one.

As about the girl I stand by my line "so what she texted". It means nothing

And hey be careful with drinking. It sounds to me you have been doing a bit much of it? Stay healthy

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Yeah, probably too much. 3-4 nights a week is getting to be taxing. On my body, on my wallet, on my schooling, on my sanity, on my relationships.

I respect you, I really do, so if anything I ever say comes across as rude or ungrateful, I apologize. It's either because I don't want to hear it (but probably need to) or the Jameson got the better of me.

Oh no you aren't rude at all. In fact you are rather polite even in disagreement. I appreciate it. And sometimes things don't come across right. Drinking started to concern me as you mentioned it more than once. Hopefully you stay on track and take care of yourself

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