[SeptemberMorn]

My youngest and his family came over this morning. He and his dad went out alone to run some errands and my DIL and the kids stayed with me. She and I had our first heart to heart in 7 years. I'm in shock and dismay! She told me some things that have been going on between her and my son. The only thing different are the players!! She has the exact same complaints that I have about MY husband. Lord God! Like father, like son!

Although she handles things quit immaturely, I can certainly relate to her! Before she left, I suggested, like I did to my son, that they try to set their feelings aside and TOGETHER, try to resolve the problems they're having right now. Too bad she couldn't give ME any advice! Obviously, what she's been doing isn't working. Not that what I've been doing works, either! LOL She can't motivate her husband any better than I can mine! While she gives her husband the silent treatment and I try reasoning with mine, neither plan works!

Anybody got any suggestions? I'm not even sure what it is I'm asking for...

[SeptemberMorn]

Oh, HELL!! I'm feeling ignored!

[(JD)]

We not iggying you sept! But when things have gone on for so long, it is never a quick fix! It might take a few years of therapy...couple therapy.. unless you both are Dr Phil fans and want that tough love advice... if it's just one person working on it, well, it won't.

One person can continue to bear under the relationship, but it won't "work" unless both work at it.

Just like I think you and I had a disagreement when I first came on here about ventilation and internalization (neither being correct) you said, IMHO, correctly that neither yelling nor silent treatments work.

With that said, let me offer this: try to recall why you married him in the first place. I found that most ppl are unhappy by the very things that drew you to them in the beginning. (Such as, you loved the way he saved money, and now you might feel he is cheap and chinzey!) Try and remember that men don't usually "sit and chat" in general... but like to talk out stuff while they are busy.. shooting hoops, golf, workshop etc. Many men also don't need to be "told" over and over again, they don't respond that way, and often would rather let you think it will be your way , than argue...

[shakes]

Sis Tomi,
I am really stuck for advice on this one. What kind of things do they have a hard time with? Maybe some therapy would be in order? I hate it when men do not communicate the way that they feel. What are we mind readers?
Sorry I could not be more help.

Jessica

[SeptemberMorn]

Thanks, Sky. Like I said, I wasn't sure what I was asking. Jerry and I have been to therpay and it didn't work then. It isn't going to work now, either. What I'm thinking is if I could find a way to get through to him. He'll listen and many times say I'm right, but the favor goes undone. If I could find the right words and the right way of putting them, maybe I could get him out of his "cave" (the Venus/Mars thing) to do something I want or need. But if it's not on HIS "want to" list, he "forgets" or gets "confused" on the order of priorities! Bah Humbug! If I figure out how to get through to Jerry, I could pass along the "secret" to my DIL and it would probably work on John, too.

[SeptemberMorn]

LOL Yeah! I've fought that mind reader thing most of my married life. gggrrrr

Right now my DIL and I are fighting with the guys about getting Christmas going, like the decorations and stuff. Chrissy and I like decorating the tree with our hubby and kids. Well, John did exactly as his dad does and hid in the bedroom and read a book while Chrissy was decorating the tree. It hurts both of us when they don't participate.

John is just like his dad in that he won't express an opinion one way or the other and when I or Chrissy make a decision without their input, they get mad as hornets! What the hell?!?! Makes us want to bat our heads against a brick wall!!

LOL Too weird!! I never expected to share my problems with my own husband with a DIL that I wasn't particularly happy with. Who knows... maybe this is a way that we'll both save or improve our marriages... someway, somehow.

[SeptemberMorn]

There was a time I wanted that "tough love" from Dr. Phil. Realized I don't need it but HUBBY SURE DOES!!

Sometimes it's tough for me to get motivated, but most of the time, it's imposible to get hubby motivated! Hell! I don't think he even tries! C'mon, Dr. Phil!! LOL

[Myzen]

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Lord God! Like father, like son!


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Hi SeptemberMorn,

I for one, am not surprised by your unwelcome discovery. I lost my first wife through behaving like my father. I learned the lesson and changed my behaviour, thank goodness.

In my view, these guys are not going to change until something gives them a wake up call. The change has to come from them, there's no other way.

The only advice I can give is to use assertiveness, pleading never works. You just have to stand your ground without hostility. It's not easy but you'll get some respect for it.

Good luck, Myzen.

[Wants2Fly]

Hi SeptemberMorn -- I wasn't ignoring you, somehow I didn't see your first post on 12/1.

I've got zip input on solving the Big Picture issue. One little thing did stand out for me, however: That the guys don't want to participate in Xmas decorating.

Why do they have to? If you and DIL and kids enjoy it, why don't you do it, a little time at her house, a little time at yours. If there is something the guys need to do (I need you to go on the roof and do X), make it a question with a specific answer:

When will you be able to go on the roof and install the X?

If he says -- I don't want to, don't have time, etc., several choices: justify why it must be done, fine someone else, do it yourself, and eliminate this part of the decorating.

If he won't give a date, make a suggestion: How about just before lunch on Saturday. We'll eat at 1 p.m., so if you get started by 11:30, you'll be done on time.

If someone doesn't want to participate in the joy of decorating, how much fun can it be for everyone else if the person is forced to do so?

[kimmydawn]

(((((((((((((((((( september ))))))))))))))))))))

maybe if i knew more of the issues in the relationship, i'd know more what to say. motivation is a huge issue...motivation for what, everything? also, you've tried talking...what have been the prior responses from hubby?

relationship woes can take a person under quickly. my hubby and i split up for three whole months 11 years ago, but are now doing well. we had to work hard!

if you can't post the specifics...maybe just generalize? look forward to hearing from you soon i think you're just fab!

be safe,

kimmydawn

[kimmydawn]

wow, i didn't see all those others posts before i responded to your first one, september. i see know what motivation issues you're speaking of.

september, hubby here is the same way about xmas and just about everything else...lol. i learned to realize that it wasn't that he didn't love me enuf to do these things for me (he would move heaven and earth for me if he felt he had to). it was just the way he, himself was raised. his mother did all of that, etc. so i found other ways in which he could give me attn. so that i would feel special...something that was easy for him. you may have to get creative there for instance, with xmas, he still won't decorate, but will now sit there and prepare the ornaments to be hung and do the lights...before he did nothing.

our relationship was so bad that he slept on the floor in livingroom for years, and stayed in front of t.v. when he wasn't working. he has made some changes for me (he's back in the bed...lol), but i had to stop being to demanding of attention and realize that his lack of actions weren't because he didn't love me, they were because of his own issues. we only realized that though, when we began to talk about them.

i know how hard it is to be in a relationship where you don't feel appreciated and where your spouse isn't involved. what i ended up finally doing was....finding my own interests, etc. it didn't take long until he was seeking me out for convo, time, etc! that was cool i was happier and he realized that my whole world didn't revolve around him and that he'd better get involved quick.

i wish there were magic answers but every relationship is so different and every individual in the relationship is very unique. i hope you find some contentment soon.

be safe,

kimmydawn

[SeptemberMorn]

Myzen, I've been dealing with my husband's lack of motivation for almost 30 yrs. He's even had his wake-up call. We were separated for seven years because of it. Guess I'm a "Never say die" kind of person. I'm still on a quest for the right words to say to hubby to get him to do some things.

Anger and pleading went by the wayside long ago. I've tried reasoning and I've tried to "make deals" with him. Sometimes it works, but NOT most of the time.

As for "having to," I guess they don't. My DIL got her brother to help her. I need help doing it because I can't walk or stand for very long at all and I sure can't climb a ladder! If hubby drags his butt tomorrow putting up the lights on the house, I'll have to get my retarded neighbor to do it. Alright... the whole decorating thing is an emotional thing for me. I'd like my Partner to be involved With me. I don't want to share that intimate moment with someone that has been driving me nuts, anyway! This kid calls me "grandma" and is believing that I am! I'M NOT!!! He's been taking just too many liberties that I can't and won't handle any more. See what I mean there? BUT... if I have to, I'll ask him to put up the outside lights for me. I'm pretty sure I can handle the inside decorations myself. HUMPH!

I guess the whole thing is aking to "feathering OUR nest" for me. There's no "our."

[SeptemberMorn]

Wants2, I understand what you're saying. Maybe not is so many words, I've tried first, telling my husband what my priorities are as an FYI. I've asked him several days in a row if he's going to clean out the shed "today" and hopefully find the tree. He says "Yes" but something else always comes up that he "doesn't get around to it." To me, it's just avoidance or he'd rather not do it. He never says so, though!

Today, he "says" he cleaned out the shed while I was gone and "says" the tree is nowhere to be found. He called me on my cell and said to pick up a tree. I did; a pre-lit one like I wanted! I had to ask him four times to bring the tree in the house so it wouldn't get stolen, too. (We're assuming that's what happened.) It's not like I wanted him to get out of bed or out of the tub or off the pot or stop eating. He was walked passed the tree at least twice! It's to the point that I'm wondering if he's not punishing me in his passive/agressive way!

As for my son, the more I think about it, the more sure I am that he's going through depression. He's handling his problems like his dad does. He crawls into his "cave" and reads. My son has every reason to be depressed. For as long as he's been with his wife, he's been going like a house afire trying to keep up with her and her family's demands. He can't make them happy because he was brought up totally different than she was. Living next door to his in-laws doesn't help matters any.

It's going to be tough knowing just how to put the right words to my DIL so that she doesn't think I'm lording it over her. Lot of it is her doing but I can't tell her that or I'll get her mad and defensive and nothing will get accomplished.

ARGH! As if I don't have enough problems!

[h0kie]

Are you sure you didn't marry MY husband?

My reaction to his lack of help is to do it myself. About the time I get the ladder out of the garage he comes out to see what I'm doing and cleans the gutters for me. And sometimes, I do whatever it is I wanted him to do by myself.

It's forced me to be more independent...which subconciously he doesn't like. I don't rely on him to do things. On some level, he wants me to rely on him.

There's another idea. It might work, and it might not, but it's worth a try. (((Morn))) I hope things get better.

[SeptemberMorn]

LOL No, I sure didn't marry you husband. I know because mine doesn't come out to see what I'm doing. He's totally oblivious because he's too busy living his life vicariously through his... get this... ROMANCE NOVELS! Yup! A 65 yr old man reading romance novels. LOL And MY hubby doesn't want me to be dependent on him in ANY WAY! The only time he doesn't ***** is when we go grocery shopping. Wonder why???

If I need to get my retarded neighbor to help me put up the lights, he won't mind in the least!

There HAS been movement on his part today, though. He even hugged and kissed me and scratched my back a bit ago without me asking! LOL

I'm getting ready to write an email to my DIL. I'm gonna give her some of the ideas posted here about at least trying to identify their problems and writing them down to discuss at a later date.

[Wants2Fly]

Awww, SeptemberMorn, I'm sorry all these people are ruining your holidays for you.

It makes me glad I'm single . . . . .

[SeptemberMorn]

It's getting better, Hun. Hubby needed to go to Home Depot this morning and the animal pound is on the way. He stopped to see what they had in the way of a puppy for me. That, in itself is major! They didn't have anything that he thought I would like, so... guess what he came home with?? A bunny!! He is SOOOOOO cute! I think it's what they call a Hotott or Hottot or Hotot. LOL Anyway, he looks like he got carried away with the mascara! hehe He's all white with black circles around his eyes, a black spot on his nose and his ears are all black! "Runny Babbit," as we decided to call him, is completely tame! I don't even have to pick him up by the scruff of his neck. I can just slip my hand under his belly and he comes willingly. I had mentioned that I wanted any scruffy old rabbit to keep for fertilizing the plants. I got my bunny and he's not scruffy! hehe

Hubby finally got the tree put together, so ... WHEW! All I need to do now is decorate it. It comes in three parts so I can sit on the couch and decorate and he can put it together. Did I mention the tree is pre-wired for lights?? YAY!!

Don't know what got into him today, but he made a complete turnaround. Hope it lasts through tomorrow so I can get the lights up on the house! IhopeIhopeIhope!

I'm such a big kid! LOL

[silver_queen]

lol Sept. I'm glad youve got a pet you like and that now you're feeling more cheerful.

[SeptemberMorn]

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Silver Queen}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}} Thank you, Hun!

[shakes]

Bunny!!! You and your pets *Laugh*. Now I want a bunny

Jessica

[SeptemberMorn]

LOL "Be careful what you wish for!" LOL I've got a menagerie going now and still wishing for a dog! If the manager of this park only knew!!! LMAO! OH! OH! The doves are eating on their own now! No more syringe feedings! YAY!!

Oh, BTW!! My tree is up and decorated! It took some doing, but we have success!! Now for the outside lights...