[ncguynva]

I thought this might be better in the abuse forum/threads but that is more for survivors of abuse and I do not want to upset them in any way shape or form.

My wife and I are in a seperation ( I am military and currently in Iraq) and before I left for this place she admitted to me that she cheated on me twice with two different guys. Of course I yelled and screamed at her the usual....and then we went to therapy for about two weeks and I was off to Japan for a few weeks and then to Iraq. I did something stupid and drank heavily while I was in Japan and called her bc I missed her and of course things were still sensitive to both of us. Half the time she would say something to upset me and I was the cause of it the other half. We agreed that we would say where we stood when I got back from Iraq and decide if we were going to divorce or work this out. She did promise she was going to continue therapy and work on things on her end, and I would do the same.
During the drunken phone calls, tempers did flair and more often than not, I yelled at her. I also threatened to not stop my financial support, but not contribute as much as I had been because she was still seeing "guy friends", the very thing that got her in trouble to begin with. It was almost 4 days before I left for Iraq and I told her it is either she stops hanging out with these guys (for one I dont trust her around them, two- it is what got her in trouble in the first place) or we get the divorce.
After I stopped drinking, I called her to see how she was and she made a comment about how she and her therapist dont know why she went from abusive relationship to abusive relationship. Before when she talked about her abusive ex bf's, she said abusive ex's. I asked her why she said relationships and she came out with the fact that she and her therapist believe that I have been abusive to her. Can somebody clarify how or why she and her therapist consider it abuse?

I also told her if she thinks I am abusive to stay the ***** away from me because that is nothing that I want for her. I have always told my female friends that if they are abused by a bf, then get as far away from them as possible. I asked my therapist if it was abusive and she said no, because I am not trying to control her. I can kinda see why my wife thinks it is abuse, but I told her that I am giving her more money because she is working on the marriage and her self. She has now agreed that her going out with guys I dont know is not a good idea.

Help?

[cantstopcrying]

First of all---THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE!!
She's saying that you not giving as much money as before is abuse? What about what she did to your marriage? That's abuse. If you are able and willing to work it out, kudos to you. It's hard. I've been through it twice--both mine exhusbands were Navy and those 6 month med-cruises are hard. Without knowing you two, obviously, I don't see how you not contributing as much money is abuse. I'm sure a t would say it's controlling, but if divorce is a possibility, you have to be able to take care of you, too. I'm sorry for what you're going through and I hope this came out right .

[VoNPD]

Yes, I too THANK YOU FOR SERVING YOUR COUNTRY!

Maybe she considers the drunken phone calls from half-way around the world abusive?? Good for you to not call her after you've been drinking.

There is all kinds of abuse. It doesn't have to be physical.

I hope you both can work it out - I've been thru it 3 times.

[ncguynva]

I realize that abuse does not have to be physical and I cant live with myself being labeled an abuser....i hate that word.....I told her to stay away from abusers.....it does not make me feel good.
yes she was saying that me telling her that if she will not act like a wife (keep going out with guys i dont know), then I will cut the money I am giving her down to what she rates. She said it is controlling her, but then my question is alot of places say that the one that cheated should call when coming home from work....open up email passwords to their spouse....phone records/text messages....basically no privacy and everything open....is that abuse?
for instance....i am giving her 1500 a month....they are over paying me bc somebody did not put in her new address....i said i would give her that much so i am giving her that much.....she only rates half of what the marine corps gives me for housing.....which would be half of what the military says housing costs in that area.....i could only give her 500 dollars a month and be safe....but i give her 3 times as much bc she said she is wanting to work this out....but wouldn't stop seeing guys i dont know (and obviously not comfortable with)

Why would the therapist say that my actions listed above (not the drunken phone calls where I yell) are abusive or have abusive characteristics?

[ncguynva]

Cantstopcrying- Well she does not have a career yet, not even an internship. I pay 95% of the bills. So she only spends what little bit of money she makes at a dessert shop, plus what I give her a month. I am not sure if that makes a difference with the whole money situation.

[cantstopcrying]

Because they are seeing it as controlling or manipulative. "Do this or else..." My opinion is it isn't. If she is willing to work it out, that means she will stop seeing and talking to these guys. It would be different if it were a guy she had been friends with for years and years and nothing had happened. She is a wife now, not a single woman on the town. Speaking as a female, I 100% disagree with the "abusive" label. It's not like you're saying, "If you cut your hair, you won't get any money." It's totally different. She's expecting you to support her financially when she isn't supporting you maritally (I just invented that word because I couldn't think of the word I wanted!). You have enough on your mind being over there, please don't think of yourself as an abuser because she says a therapist said you have abusive characteristics. Please stay safe.

[ncguynva]

Originally Posted by VoNPD

Yes, I too THANK YOU FOR SERVING YOUR COUNTRY!

Maybe she considers the drunken phone calls from half-way around the world abusive?? Good for you to not call her after you've been drinking.

There is all kinds of abuse. It doesn't have to be physical.

I hope you both can work it out - I've been thru it 3 times.

Well 90% of the drunken phone calls ended in yelling and screaming obviously. There were times where I was not as drunk as other times and when she would start making me mad, I would tell her "honey you are making me mad, I am going to get off the phone here and smoke a cigarette" Most of the time she would scream into the phone "Dont hang up on me...Scott dont hang up on me" Most of the time I would because I knew I needed to cool down. I told her I would call her back when I have calmed down. Not even 20 seconds later, she would call. I would then say in a pretty stern voice "I said I will call you back....do not call me back" and hang up

[VoNPD]

No, I don't see you as an abuser from what you've said. Seems like most of the time you have yourself under good control. Be proud of that!

Save the drunken calls for mushy sweet-nothings.

It must be so hard for both of you to have such distance between you while trying to work on things. Trust is a big issue for me. Neither of you should have to call when you get home or read each others emails, etc. But being so far away can give temptation an open door. But weighing her 'worth' by assigning a dollar value to it does not seem right. I don't know what a Lawyer might say, but if it was me... I'd take away ALL money/support and ask that she decide who she wants... THEN resume the financial support if she decides she wants you.

The decision should be made with the heart and the head - not the wallet.

[ncguynva]

Well, she said she stopped seeing guy friends a few weeks ago, before I got here in the sandbox. I called her nephew to see whatsup with him and he told me things that had me in a flashbacks of when I was hot on her trail about finding out about the affair.
I asked him if he had talked to her lately and he said not within a month or so bc she pissed him off. (I have been friends with her nephew Matt since we were 14, and he was the one who introduced us). Since he learned of her actions that hurt me, he told me to get rid of her but I gave love a chance.
Well tonight he was telling me she was dating her 30 year old neighbor who cannot even pay child support. And she also didn't know which one she wanted to be with. And she has always told me she loved me and apparantly she told him she sometimes doesn't know if she cares about me. It shocked me so much I literally fell on my butt and puked. I had started to trust her bit by bit and the agreement was that she not hang out with guys I dont know. She also had bought a prepaid cell phone and she has been telling me she doesn't have a cell phone. He also didn't want me to drop his name if I confronted her.
So I called around to see who would give me her number and nobody would. I then got an email from her saying she was at a friends house and I had the friends number so I called and told her (without yelling at all during the whole hour I was on the phone with her) I am going to see a lawyer tomorrow to start the paperwork bc the trust is broken. She then brought up the fact of me yelling at her when I was in Japan. I told her and I know this doesn't excuse it, but I told her it was bc I was drinking and my emotions were all messed up.
She claims she just hung out with him a once or twice and thats it. He hasn't been in the house. I then asked her why she didn't want her husband who is in Iraq to not have her cell phone number. And why she lied about that. She said she didn't know.
When she asked me why I was divorcing her, I asked her "What have you done to betray my trust?" Her answer "What do you know?" I just cringed bc those were the same words I said to her and she spat back at me when I got very close to finding out she had cheated on me. She admitted she went to the river with him and that I set her up for failure bc I left her in the US and blah blah blah.
She also said she had come up with a plan for us to stay together. It involved her staying in the US to continue her studies and her to get her own money and financially stable. I told her there is no way trust can come back into the relationship with us being so far away from each other. Plus we would grow apart more so than we already have. She then said she would come out to Japan but it just seems like it is a lost cause.
She said she isn't dating the guy, but if she lied about not hanging out with guys, then how do I know? I was really starting to trust her more, not alot but more BC she wasn't hanging out with guys. I love this woman to death, I would walk on hot coals for her. There are very few things I wouldn't do for this woman. I told her SHE was my prioority ever since I got here. Not me. I can take care of myself. The marriage and putting her mind at ease about me yelling at her and her financial trouble were my concearns, not getting shot at. I told her since she lied to me about going out with guys, it seems I am not a priority to her. She claims that statement is false. I told her actions speak louder than words. It breaks my heart bc she told me the plan and it was the first thing I heard from her about our future together. Not hearing anything about what she thinks or what she wants had me worried and was chipping away at my hope that the marriage would survive.

I was really looking forward to coming home to my wife after a deployment too. To go home with my wife.....not back to my parents place (my parents and I dont have a good relationship bc I was working on the marriage). Now, I just feel my get up and go has got up and left. She was my world, the thought of coming home to her is what kept me sane and drove me to push through another day. I was starting to deal with the fact that she cheated on me before I left for Iraq and I would have to deal with that over here in a combat zone dodging rounds. Now I dont think I can deal with anymore lies.

[e_sort]

Originally Posted by ncguynva

I realize that abuse does not have to be physical and I cant live with myself being labeled an abuser....i hate that word.....I told her to stay away from abusers.....it does not make me feel good.
yes she was saying that me telling her that if she will not act like a wife (keep going out with guys i dont know), then I will cut the money I am giving her down to what she rates. She said it is controlling her, but then my question is alot of places say that the one that cheated should call when coming home from work....open up email passwords to their spouse....phone records/text messages....basically no privacy and everything open....is that abuse?
for instance....i am giving her 1500 a month....they are over paying me bc somebody did not put in her new address....i said i would give her that much so i am giving her that much.....she only rates half of what the marine corps gives me for housing.....which would be half of what the military says housing costs in that area.....i could only give her 500 dollars a month and be safe....but i give her 3 times as much bc she said she is wanting to work this out....but wouldn't stop seeing guys i dont know (and obviously not comfortable with)

Why would the therapist say that my actions listed above (not the drunken phone calls where I yell) are abusive or have abusive characteristics?

I don't know about whether it's "abuse", any more than her dating other people is abusive to you. But both are negative, unhelpful behaviors, as is regular yelling. You seem like a self-aware, good-hearted person and the following is just my opinion.

I do think withholding money based on your judgment of her conduct is manipulative / controlling, especially if she is dependent on you. (Whether she should or shouldn't be is a separate issue.)

Also, it's not reasonable for you to demand that she not spend time with people you don't know, male or female, especially when you are so far away, or to assume that if she does she will have another affair. That really IS controlling.

I also disagree with the advice that if one spouse has an affair they should give up all their privacy. I just don't see how that could work. There would be too much resentment. Everyone needs some privacy, even if married. If one person has an affair, you should try and work out the reasons why together. There's nothing to be gained by making them serve some kind of sentence. It doesn't matter whether or not it should be labeled "abuse".

Again I am not defending her or judging you just saying I am sure the situation is hard on you both.

If you don't trust her, divorce her and handle the finances with grace. If you do trust her, act like it and try to talk honestly and calmly about what you both feel. If you're not sure, pick the option that sounds more appealing.

[ncguynva]

She has not given me a reason to trust her

[cantstopcrying]

Oh I wish you weren't going through this. This is my life years ago and it breaks my heart. Just sitting here reading how much you love her is making me cry. I wish you wisdom, courage and knowledge to do what is right.

[Malachite]

Dear ncguynva,

You are using economic leverage, in an attempt to control your wife, plain and simple, that is abuse. I don't condone her conduct, and I have great empathy for your marital difficulties. My first marriage ended in divorce, under not so different circumstances. However, I feel compelled to give you a straight answer.

Please, don't think ill of yourself. All of us, have emotionally abused someone, at sometime. What is important, is to recognize it, come to terms with it, and cease doing it. Obviously, by virtue of you posting here, and discussing the situation with a therapist, abuse, is clearly not your intent.

I am not suggesting, you tolerate your wife's behavior. Advising her, you will pursue a divorce, if she will not honor the marriage, is not abuse. Pursuing a divorce, also is not abuse, provided, one conducts themselves, in a legal and honorable fashion.

I wish you the best,

Larry

[ncguynva]

I have done just that. I told her that I am divorcing her, still giving her exactly the same amount I was last month and will continue to do so until the ink is on the divorce.

I also have not yelled at her since a week prior to coming here. So in that sense, I am not abusing her anymore.

She wants another chance...I told her I have given her 6 chances since I have been suspicious of her affair. I cannot give her another one. I want to so badly, but that sense of security is gone now. I do not know if she was/is dating this guy, if she has slept with him or was it just they went to the river one time? I do not know.

What scares me is that she made a comment about "the latch wasn't fully closed so I tried to break out" That comment right there tells me that the marriage cannot survive.

[ncguynva]

Originally Posted by cantstopcrying

Because they are seeing it as controlling or manipulative. "Do this or else..." My opinion is it isn't. If she is willing to work it out, that means she will stop seeing and talking to these guys. It would be different if it were a guy she had been friends with for years and years and nothing had happened. She is a wife now, not a single woman on the town. Speaking as a female, I 100% disagree with the "abusive" label. It's not like you're saying, "If you cut your hair, you won't get any money." It's totally different. She's expecting you to support her financially when she isn't supporting you maritally (I just invented that word because I couldn't think of the word I wanted!). You have enough on your mind being over there, please don't think of yourself as an abuser because she says a therapist said you have abusive characteristics. Please stay safe.

She claims she has stopped talking to the ones she cheated on me with, but with the news that she has a prepaid cell phone, and the fact she lied to me about it, it is very possible.

She claims she only went to the river one time with her 30 year old neighbor who "Didnt have any friends" and it was on whim.

Then there is the fact her nephew said he hasnt talked to her in a month but I got curious and looked at the phone records for the house phone and saw he had talked to her a week or so ago. The nephew also said she is dating him, but has said that before about guys when her and I broke up (round 1 as we call it) and she as like no I just hung out with him. The nephew also claims she has told him that she doesn't know if she cares for her or not and doesn't know who she wants to be with.

Both parties have lied to me, one more than the other obviously, but I cannot fully trust either.

her words of "What do you know?" haunt me bc she said that before when I found out she had a male friend in the apartment from 1130pm to 330am and lied to me about it after promising me she wouldnt have ANY guys in the apartment. I tried to gamble a lil bit and told her that somebody found out you have done somethign very dishonest and they wont tell me while I am in California bc they are worried about what I might do. The she said those words and I told her "Hell no what do I need to know?" I blacked out for about 30 minutes and all i remember is her yelling at me bc i had admitted to her that i had a private investigator on her and what i knew was that she had a guy in there during those times i mentioned.

But the other night when she said those words and I told her I wasn't playing that game again she still poked around to see what she could find out by asking me "did this just fall in your lap or did you go looking for it?" like a dummy I answered and said it just fell in my lap. She then asked if it came from somebody i knew or only sorta knew. After learning where it came from she claimed that her family crest is now broken and shattered.

[cantstopcrying]

You have so much going on, so many issues that are hard. I still stand by my initial comment that I don't believe it's abuse. You aren't not giving her any money. If I remember right, the military won't let you do that. I think it's great that you have a lot of different opinions here, I hope you are able to sift through and take what you need and leave the rest. It is such a hard situation for you to be in and obviously ultimately only you and wife know whether you are able to work through this. One thing to remember is that you two got married for a reason. Don't forget about that love. Even if you do get divorced, try to hold on to the good memories, too. It's bad when you look back on a relationship and are so hurt you can't see the happiness that was there and be thankful for it.

[ncguynva]

I think my actions were abusive, but not intentionally. Since my wife brought it up I did not tell her to act like a wife or i will cut down the money, simply I will start the divorce. She agreed to that and well now it is time to fufill that agreemetn unfortunatley. I , unlike my wife, carry out my promises.

I don't think I can forget the good times I had with her. They were the best times of my life. I wanted to add to those but now I can't and that is what is depressing to me. The past 10 months of my life have been hell and misery. I thought if I paid my dues for being happy for the first year and a half or so of being married, maybe I can continue to be happy when I get back. I was wrong

[e_sort]

I really feel for you my friend. It's a painful situation. I think you're doing the right thing to make a break.