Another tantrum

Blue, this can be really stressful and it really concerns me. Having a little downtime always helps me see more clearly and approach situations with more patience. I hope that you aren't feeling as if you need to in some way make up for what was stolen from you as a child. Could your H or a friend possibly take the kids for a few hours so you can have the chance to breathe?

Sounds like you did a great job! I always fought with fears of having my parenting skills judged by others out in public, but I would try to tell myself that I had to do what was right for us. It's always tough when the waiting time for an event is extended like that.

Well, I certainly don't want you feeling any extra stress if we do lunch sometime soon. What is it that you think makes you feel stressed? Is it what I talked about above? I can definitely relate to that. Maybe we can think of something to do together with her that will allow you to just enjoy the time. Hmm...

Would a punching bag help? I can't help wondering if some of the extra stress you've been feeling recently is not only due to the discomfort from intense therapy, but also from some part of you that needs tending to. Maybe a part that needs to go and do something for just you. Just a thought that ran through my mind...

Why afraid? Sounds like an interesting idea.

I dont know what Id do without this board. I really dont have anyone else to talk to about this.

I do have this fear of being judged when my little ones act up in public. There is one parent there who stares and shakes her head, but she is notorious for being this way and I dont pay too much attention. I thought Id be judged by my behavior if I got out of control. I was scared Id lose it, and I have lost it (not completely, but enough) in public.

I dont know what I am afraid of with asking ftt to do this other type of therapy with me. What could she say? no? I guess I could try. Im afraid she'll hate me and think I am too needy. maybe thats it. That I want too much from her.

Brightheart- We'll think of someplace to meet. If she can be eating miso soup, she'll be fine. I have therapy wednesday morning.....after that might work (hopefully I wont be a basketcase after the session).....lets PM more about it.....

yes. I think it is true. I need something, but I dont believe I can or will get it, tending to, I mean.

I will post about the rest of the evening. I feel like a failure after I got through the game today. I came home and my 15 yo d had really screwed up my computer. When I realized it she wasnt even home, she was at an cooking class she takes sunday evening, she is a good girl, but I really blew it. I am too ashamed to go into detail. I broke stuff etc and I broke my telephone. Not my cell, but my home phone. S**T! I knew this wasnt good and left my house in the car. I drove around for a while and I had my laptop with me so I went to Best Buy to see if they could fix the problem and they did. I didnt want to go home. My 15 yo texted me to pick her up at her friend's house after the class, so I did and I did not get into the computer thing with her. I thought I could not even go there. I just told her I didnt want her to use my laptop and it froze up and had to be fixed. That was all. No tantrum at her. I wouldnt usually do that, anyway. We went home and I things we ok then not ok then ok and not again. I am SO not usually like this. I feel like I am losing it. I cant trust myself to have any measure of control or sanity. My 13 yo said to me, "Mommy, do you remember you had a tantrum trance?" She was holding my hand and kissing me. She loves me and wants me to know that. I have NEVER heard her say anything like that before. I said, I remember (I sort of recall bits and pieces but not that clearly). And she asked me if I remember what I did. That means to me that she is aware of a lot more than I thought. That I dont remember stuff. I feel awful. Really awful. I dont know what to say or do at this point.

(((((((((((((((Blue)))))))))))))))))))

I think THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO DO is to stop working on the trauma stuff in therapy and to regain your footing in the here and now. Pay attention to the signals you are giving yourself. You are overwhelmed. It might take years to get through the trauma stuff...it has for me. YEARS. But if we can allow that, we can allow ourselves to move through it at a pace that we can handle without our lives starting to feel out of control.

When I started therapy, it was just before Thanksgiving two years ago. I do remember how overwhelmed I felt...and my boys went from having this really limited amount of screen time to being allowed to spend entire weekends playing video games. I felt horrible and guilty about it, but T's response was "so what?" And I realized he was right. A weekend of video games wasn't the end of the world. I didn't have to be perfect all the time. Things could be "good enough".

What would "good enough" look like for you right now? Is there anything that you can just let go so you can give yourself a break?

I think it is hugely important to realize when we've been pushed too far, and to find ways to scale back and get grounded again before we move forward.

Can you call T today and let her know what's going on? I bet Wednesday feels far away.

Thinking of you. Breathe. Be gentle with you. You will make it through this. Let yourself be "good enough".

What you do is take it one day at a time. You try to be gentle with yourself. I'm very impressed that you kept it together while talking to your 15 year old. That takes a lot of self-control. I would have exploded, said things I regret, and threatened punishments I could never keep.

I look at it this way - you took your rage out stuff, not people. Not the best idea, and as my T would say, it would be nice to be able to talk about anger rather than acting on it, but that's not where you are right now. And that's okay.

Being a parent is hard. Being a parent of 6 has got to be insane, intense, and amazing, but really hard! Seriously, there are times when I'm counting down the days when my stepsons will be in college (dh has custody, so they live with us full-time).

I could write a book about the harmful things I've said or done to my kids, especially early on in our marriage. Guilt I will carry forever, I'm afraid.

But I do try to put my energy into making sure there are times when they remember me being a good mom. It kills me when they bring up the times I've exploded or been mean. All we can do is keep going, keep trying, keep loving, ourselves, our families.

I'm sure you know this, but it bears repeating. Be gentle with yourself, blue. The more you pick at your scabs, the longer they take to heal.

Moon, Tree's last post was excellent, time to slow down.......... Your daughter is holding your hand and kissing you, your 11 y.o. son talks to you and tells you how he is affected by you. It sounds like you have excellent relationships with your children. You will all make it out of this. You all have needs and they all need to be balanced. You are doing a good job...........

And these tantrums do sound like triggering and dissociating.

(((((Blue))))),

Yeah, it does sound like you're doing too much in therapy all at once, too quickly. I agree that you've got to slow down, take 1 day at a time, and either call ftt today and tell her what's going on, or be sure to talk about it on Wednesday.

All this stuff is coming up for you and it's going to turn out well in the end, I know that!!!

I used to be critical of Moms whose kids had tantrums in the grocery store. That was before I had my kids and they did the same thing! Kids are kids, not grown ups, and they will act like what they are. It's not that we are bad parents! You are a wonderful parent, and I think your kids are so understanding because they know that. They are showing such love and concern for you. They will be all right.

Have you told your 13 year old that you don't feel well, that you're geting help, and that she shouldn't worry about you? Maybe she (and all of them) just need to hear that. She's on the verge of adulthood--13 yr. olds can be very mature, but still feel like children. I'm also impressed with how you dealt with your 15 yr. old.

Hang in there. Call ftt if you need to. She's been helpful to you on the phone already. That's what she's there for.

I wish my mother had realized that!

I am having a slower day. I feel more in control today and I should call ftt, but I am feeling still so shy about it. I never thought of myself as the type who wanted to handle it all on my own, Ive been pretty good about reaching out for help, but for some reason, I find it hard now. I dont want to be seen as a "needy" patient. I am going to try try try to be willing to call this morning. I think "good enough" would be if my kids came home from school today, I drive then to piano and voice lessons, and after I picked them up they eat, do homework, play piano and clarinet. I dont have to constantly clean up. I can tell them to clean up after themselves (this is the hard part) and if my boys play too much wii, then so be it. It will be good enough. How does that sound? I dont even know. Maybe its too much- if they are in a good mood, it can go smoothly. If the boys are teasing the girls, it get chaotic.

It seem like I have to regain my footing in the here and now. Ftt has said to me that we have to go slowwith trauma so as not to open a Pandora's Box, but how do you do that? Once its opened, how do you shut it again? I am not sure why I am having dissociated rages. I am supposed to notice what triggers the rages. I wrote it down, just once sentence for each tantrum, in my jouranal. I am noticing that I dont want to write much.

Wed feels like forever away. I am cooking now and it actually is sort of grounding for me while my 2 yo is playing quietly. I am SO grateful for a couple of quiet minutes.

(((((moonrise)))) I so understand you. And my kids have brought up the times I have exploded. I find that as they get older, they get more compassionate about it. I have a lot of guilt about the tantrums I have thrown and this "other side" of me they have apparently noticed. It was always my goal to have children that were close to each other. The older girls had even delivered my younger boys (with the midwife behind them) and it was a wonderful, bonding experience for them. I wanted them to experience the birthing of a family. We have always done things a little differently. And it has been the saving grace for the emotional difficulties I have as their mother. I think without the other things we have done to make them secure and safe in the family and closely attached to each other they would have experienced me and my emotional problems much differently. These problems I have are against a backdrop of the intense love I have for them. I can only hope they feel that.

I do feel like i have been pushed too far, but how is it that I cannot directly connect it to the trauma work? Is it the dissociating I do from my feelings?It is not a coincidence that I am doing deeper work on past trauma and now I cant handle my day to day life. Ftt seems to think this is my first line of defense when I get close to feelings. I am good at disappearing.

I just wrote some things down in my journal. My h is triggering me. Big time. When he doesnt help here, whether he can or cant, when it all falls on my shoulders, I get triggered....it builds up and then I can have a tantrum.

A note of wisdom from my Yogi teabag: Live from your heart, you will be most effective. I think when I live from my heart and not from my pain or my past, I am most effective and loving with my children.

Where were all you guys with your wisdom and insights and caring when I needed you years and years ago? I had hoped to meet some but almost never did. Did not think you existed.

(((((((((((((((pachy))))))))))))))

((((((Pachy))))) Are you OK? What is going on?

I wish my mother, or anyone, had realized that. But they could not have realized that. It wasnt who she was, she couldnt think that way because it didnt have to do what she wanted.

Im sorry you were a child with the same kind of mother

I remember when I first got into trauma stuff that it seemed IMPOSSIBLE to slow it down.

I can tell you some things that have worked for me...

I guess the main thing that helps ME is a promise that I will get to it later. I think I have these younger parts that are screaming to be heard, and that need reassurance that they WILL be heard, just not now. Can you tell the parts of you that are pushing at you that you hear them, and that what they have to say is important, and that they will have all the time they need to express themselves...but that right now you need to be grown up and you need time to work on feeling a little better?

Another thing that helps is to literally say "STOP" to the thoughts when they come. And to say to myself "I am here and I am safe now". And to really ground myself in the present. I like to use aromatherapy or simmer water with oranges and cloves...smells seem to help me get present.

Another thing that helps me is simply not talking about it in therapy. I go, and we talk about other things, things in the present. The more I do that, the more grounded I get in NOW, and the more the trauma stuff fades into the background...at least temporarily.

And finally - it really helps me to have things to keep busy with that are kind of mindless and fun. I played so much guitar hero when I started therapy that I could beat ALL of my son's tween/teen friends - for REAL Cooking is good. I played a lot of board games with my kids. Read non-triggery books (have you read Ann Lamott? I her).

It's hard, but it's worth it to try to reground yourself in the present.

Do you meditate? That helped me too.

BIG hugs to you...

Well, you are the kind of people that I always wanted to have around (and be like), and I never found any, or at least not enough of them, and now here you all are, and I wonder why now?

Blue, I'm sorry you're having a difficult time right now.

It's okay for you to need extra support right now and call ftt. I have a feeling she would much rather you reach out to her than to allow yourself to suffer. Did you call her today?

Tree has some good ideas about how to relax. I have scenic DVDs that I watch and music I listen to when I'm feeling stressed out. Or I write poetry and try to take in beauty...I really enjoy doing that. It feels very freeing and helps me to connect to my inner sappy self. When you calm your mind the beauty in little things seem so much clearer.

Blue, I truly believe that each and everyone of us could become triggered under those circumstances.

Hang in there, Blue.

You could start your own thread, Pachy. Why not now?

On what subject? Oh, I see. Sort of.

Here's something I have been intrigued with recently: "benevolent sabotage". As a therapy technique. That is, not going for "insight" to solve problems, but devising sometimes sneaky techniques to start changes taking place, getting people out of ruts, out of unproductive cycles of behavior. Once change starts to happen, then insight might come later as a by-product!

That is how I feel. I have memories that keep pushing at me. Everything triggers a memory and it is making me tense.

When I read this I remembered that this is similar to what ftt told me. To talk to my little parts as I would a child I love. They they will be heard later.
I can try, it might be hard to do that in the moment when my 8 yo wants to throw things, but I forgot that ftt told me to talk to my little parts that push at me this way. This is something that could really work and help to gain some adult control.

This is really good.

This is good,too. It makes me want to go twice/week. But I cant pay for that now. I know if I wanted to now work on traumatic memories, ftt would say OK. But I feel pulled to contiune, I am waiting for my session on wed.

[quote]And finally - it really helps me to have things to keep busy with that are kind of mindless and fun. I played so much guitar hero when I started therapy that I could beat ALL of my son's tween/teen friends - for REAL Cooking is good. I played a lot of board games with my kids. Read non-triggery books (have you read Ann Lamott? I her).[quote]
Maybe I can work on trauma and work on finding a way to be an adult during the week. To stay an adult. I dont know how that would happen. It seems like it would take more energy that I have. Board games can be fun, I havent read Ann Lamott. Actually, Im reading Irvin Yalomn....and the way he talks about his mother and his female patients triggers the s**t out of me. I guess not good reading at this moment for me....

I used to meditate. I thought about looking for a good yoga or meditation class in my area. There are many different kinds and Im not sure which to choose. It could get me out of the house 1 evening/week.
Thank, Tree

Brightheart- its true, my H can trigger me in a big way. Even if he doesnt mean some things the way I take them. Or just selfish behavior will trigger me.

I left a message for her this evening. I think she works a little later tonight and will probably call after she is done. I think.

Pachy- It might be a good idea to start a thread. Anything with the word sabatoge in it would probably generate a lot of responses.

I spoke with ftt tonight on the phone. I still cant believe that a therapist gives me phone time. She is so good and I did not feel like I was annoying her.

We talked about getting triggered and feeling out of control with anger and rages. She said that this is what can happen when we do trauma work, that we open a "pandora's box" and there is no going back. I was talking to her about how everything, every little thing, even watching Blue's Clues triggers me. SHe said that she wants my 8 year old (inside of me) to journal. And to draw. Or play a game. And she wants me to allow her to do it when I have some time to myself (another difficulty) or the kids are asleep. I had been saying I felt that she needed a voice. SHe is pushing at me to be heard.

We also talked about the dfficulty my 11 yo son is has when I am upset or feel out of control. He is feeling very sad about it. We talked about it and she said I have said to him all that I can say and that we have to do all we can to contain the feelings to appropriate times. But I will stay close to him and talk to him all the time.

We talked about medication and possibly doing something medication-wise that would be temporary as we do trauma work. She suggested to talk 1/4 of a klonopin. I took 1/2 last night and I felt really hungover today, but no rages or tantrums. SHe said that is what it is for and probably working the way it should. Or something called seroquel. Which I dont know anything about.

So, until wed my assignment is to allow my 8 yo to play, draw and journal. I have never done anything like that before. But I will try. If she is not pushing at me, how do get her to journal? SHe seems to push at me when I am angry or have strong emotions.

Do you think she would like to color? Or draw?

I think that's what Zen masters already do for a living.

101 Zen Stories, the same ones collected years ago by Paul Reps in Zen Flesh, Zen Bones. That particular website has relabeled them "koans" which (as far as I know) they aren't really.

Yes! Definitely. I used to paint and draw, but maybe what I used to do is too adult for her.

I think she just wants to see color. Even if it is crayon in a coloring book. We have plenty of those in the house. Actually, my kids have watercolor books...and I know i have my watercolors somewhere here. But, then, I might be too adult if I do that and look too hard at what I am doing. Or maybe not. Not sure.

Did you do that with T? I know you played Uno.......

I have colored with T. And played Uno! lol And dots (I almost forgot about that) which is a pencil and paper game. My younger parts (and actually, adult me) had a lot of playtime with T before they started drawing pictures of trauma stuff, etc.

Last winter, I colored a lot at home. Mostly mandalas. It was kind of meditative for grown-up me, and I felt like I was doing something for my younger parts at the same time.

I think when we have younger parts pushing at us, it's important that they feel safe and cared for...and reassured that they WILL be heard. It seems like for me, if everyone's needs are met, then grown-up me gets more peace. If that makes any sense...

That makes so much sense. And when my younger parts feel ignored or not having a voice, then I dont have much peace.

I am relating to so much of what you just wrote- in the sense that the younger part of me that wants to express herself, feels like she cannot. And has not. She does not feel safe and cared for at all and that she will be heard. Even though I am saing all of this about wanting her to have a voice, at the same time, I dont. I want her to shut up. SIgh....and the thought of drawing trama stuff terrifies me. Terror. I will just draw color.

I wrote out a whole PM to you and LOST it. ouch! A lot was about my feelings about deep color. And how I used to paint and draw, but I dont want the adult me involved as much as that right now.

Just a comment on painting and drawing, and child expressions. I'm glad you called ftt, Blue.

I used to draw and paint, too, but I don't have patience for it now. I remember finger painting once with my kids and my husband, and feeling so free doing it. Maybe you could do that. Or play-doh because then it would be more childlike. Fingerpaint has the potential for you to be very expressive and let that 8 year old come out, I think. Just an idea, though a lot messier than crayons, I know.

My child comes out when I'm anywhere near sand. I always loved to play in the sand, and I still do! Or bake with brown sugar cause it's like sand.