[BlackCanary]

I am sure that quoting a 1984 Animotion song will date me but that's really the least of my problems today....

I'm feeling rather obsessed with my ex-T.
He was my first.
First therapist ever.

My husband was surely joking after I said I was sad that I can't email exT anymore (he is ex) and hubby said "Oh don't worry, you can still stalk him online". I stick out my tongue!!!

I'd been thinking about the scenario where I run into him at a BBQ at my new managers house. My new manager lives very close to ex-T. Not that my manager is likely to invite me and my family to a BBQ with him and his family and various neighbors who happen to include my ex-T.
BUT given the less than 1% chance this occurs, I want to be ready.

So, how would I react? What would I say? Could I get him to hug me? Should I challenge him to basketball one-on-one? How would I talk to his wife?
Figured I'd best look up that famous singer with the same name as his wife. Which led me to her facebook page.
No, I never got to looking at the famous singer's page.

He's in the profile pic with her, could have spotted him at 20 paces w/o my glasses. His wife's page has their wedding pics from 20 yr ago (a very slick tux!) and a pic from their 20th anniversary celebration in November. OMG he totally loves her and she totally loves him, absolutely the cutest pics.

Now I've got her profile pic - he's got a real Mona Lisa smile in this one - as the wallpaper on my phone. He really is a good looking guy, I can see why my heart beats faster when I think of him even now.

And I would pay serious money to have this painful obsessive experience extracted from my mind and body.
I am ashamed and embarrassed that I feel this way.
I really need some first aid for this situation.
I do wonder if anyone had told me at the start of therapy that I'd feel this way at the end of therapy - what would I have done???

[darkrunner]

Hi Black Canary,
I think about seeing my old T sometimes, and what I would say and do. The thought terrifies me.

Obsessions are so tricky, because the more you try to stop the the more obsessed you become. Sheer will-power does little to help. I guess distraction is the best thing.

What do you think is behind the feelings of shame and embarassment?
Try not to be so hard on yourself.

(((((((((((Black Canary)))))))))))))

I've always thought that if my therapy ended badly, or at the wrong time, I'd need therapy to get over my therapy. Seriously.

I feel most obsessed with T when there are things that feel really "undone", or when t and I are in the middle of some kind of conflict. It feels like the younger parts of me are in such a state of WANTING and NEEDING, and like T is the only person who can "fix" it.

I can imagine that if I had that feeling AND T was just gone, forever, I would totally get into that place of not being able to fully be in my own life and let it go. I HATE that feeling.

Do you think this something that time will help? I know that when I am on a long break from T, things do start to feel easier eventually.

By the way, you SO put that song in my head. I went to sleep with it, and woke up with it. Help. lol

I hope it starts to feel easier, Black Canary...

[rainbow8]

(((((Black Canary))))),

I'm gotten obsessed with Ts and other people my whole life. It really, really hurts!!! I know how you feel. My way of dealing with it is to keep finding someone new to obsess over, which is a very unhealthy way. That's one reason I am in therapy so long.

Obsession for a T is like an unfulfilled romance. There are some books about giving up obsessions, dealing with loss of a love, and so on. I can't recall the titles now. It's not anything to feel embarrassed about or ashamed of. Loss of someone important to you like a T can be devastating. Like tree said, distraction helps, and also accepting your feelings helps.

I've always thought that if my therapy ended badly, or at the wrong time, I'd need therapy to get over my therapy. Seriously.

tree, seriously that's what I had to do after my first therapy ended disastrously. Actually, I quit, but I didn't want to. So, yes, I saw 2 more Ts to get over the first one. You might even say I am now seeing Kt to "get over" Bt. Sigh. I don't mean to hijack, Black Canary. Obsession is a feeling close to my heart. I hope you can get some relief. Are you seeing another T now whom you could discuss this with?

[BlackCanary]

@dark -- I'm ashamed because I feel this passion about him, yet I am married and love my husband. It feels unfaithful. I am failing my marriage in this obsession. I am on my knees begging for forgiveness.
My priest made me feel ashamed when I told her that I would not be seeing him again, she was so glad to hear I was leaving him. I know she did not mean it like that, but she's like a mom to me so that's how I hear it. Plus I am losing my priest now also, she's retiring.
Therapy is a secret, so it's a secret, special relationship. And mourning a secret relationship is awkward, filled with shame.
I'm embarrassed because I'm perhaps admitting the underlying physical attraction, finally. I denied and suppressed it the whole time in therapy. I once told him I'd do anything to get him to like me. And how stupid to feel this way for someone who I will never see again, who was untouchable, who has no attachment to me. I am an idiot.
I know that part of it is triggered because I came back to work and saw the manager who lives near originalT.

@Tree, @rainbow-- I'll have therapy with someone else, but I cannot tell her that I loved this originalT, the client who tells the T "I love you" is not discussed, not revealed, it's like I'd be embarrassing him to talk about this.
Today I'm going to listen to a guided mediation about grief, to help me with my losses and to distract me.
And it is my inner teenager who is so crazy about him, driving my behaviors and thoughts. I feel like I am 18 again, when I was crazy about my secret older "friend", I desperately wanted to feel loved by him. So, in a way I need to put her to sleep for a while, give my adult working parent self some time to recover from this loss.
I think it will only be fixed by time, little by little, one day at a time.
sorry for the earworm, tree, I'll try to give you another song to think about (My Sharona? 8675309 Jenny?)

But I would cut this pain from my body if it were possible, it is that horrible. It feels like a tumor that must be excised by a surgeon (not by me, tyvm, I do not do SI).

[rainbow8]

I'm embarrassed because I'm perhaps admitting the underlying physical attraction, finally. I denied and suppressed it the whole time in therapy. I once told him I'd do anything to get him to like me. And how stupid to feel this way for someone who I will never see again, who was untouchable, who has no attachment to me. I am an idiot.

You are NOT an idiot for feeling that way. Many clients feel physically attracted to their Ts. It seems to be almost normal for the therapy process. Some of the feelings are transference, but some are real. It's hard not to feel strongly for your T. I've seen only woman and I'm not gay, but I have those feelings too. I think it's inherent in the way therapy just IS.

You say you will not tell another T about your love for your ex-T. Believe me, your T will not be surprised nor judgemental. It would help you if you could tell. I really think it would relieve your pain. You sound like you are suffering, and a T can help you see that you are not a bad person or an idiot for your feelings.

[BlackCanary]

thanks for the hugs, really need it.
I had not expected that this ending would kick me in the @$$ like this.
The new girlT is on vacation this week. Have to stick it out for now.

[BlackCanary]

Postscripts -
1) I'd like to thank my hormones for helping me achieve that special level of distress I was experiencing earlier this week. &%@)*!&!!!!
2) Substitution: I know that this is likely also about someone else. So, I've tried to think about the someone else, and that helps a bit.
3) self-care: I engaged in my self-care activities (music, plans with friends, family time, exercise, etc) and those things have helped also.

All of your support is appreciated !!!

[BlackCanary]

Instead of starting a new thread, figured I'd follow up here with this

So, maybe this inner teenager, who is so angry at being abandoned, needs to have an appt with originalT.

I can probably see him at another center where we works part time, unless there is some "poaching" restriction in place from my HMO.
It would be worth the cash to have a chance to resolve this pain; but if he will not see me then it would be even worse.
I'm really unsure.
this girl is really clawing her way out, pounding on me on the inside.

Did you ever manage to have an appt with an ex-T after you formally went through termination?

[rainbow8]

Yes, I did see my first T after we formally terminated. The problem was that I quit suddenly, without really settling anything. I saw another T for 2 years, who encouraged me to go back and say "goodbye" to my first T. It worked out well the first time I went back, but 3 or 6 months later (I forgot how long) I went again, and I started obsessing about her all over again. It ended up worse, and I saw a 3rd T to resolve all of my feelings.

Still, I think it was worth it to tie things up with her.

I officially ended with my former T who I've been calling Bt for blunt T, but it was open-ended, so I saw her every few months. That was okay until I realized I wanted a different kind of help, and found my new T, who I've been calling Kt for kind T because she's so kind.

In your case, do you think seeing him could resolve the pain, or would indeed make it worse? What exactly do you want to achieve by seeing him again? If you're like me, what you really want is that "fix" again, and you'll be unsatisfied. But if you think telling him will solve something, or if there is something else left unsaid, that it could be productive. I still think discussing it all with your new T would be more helpful, at least before you try to make an appointment with old T.

[sittingatwatersedge]

hi there,

you don't have to pay serious money, this is just a suggestion that I found to be surprisingly sound.

To deal with intrusive thoughts (what she calls them) T recommends the following:
Set an alarm or timer for ten minutes and tell yourself firmly, "OK, I am going to think think think about this for ten minutes only, and that's it."
Start the timer and go.
When time is up, stop.

I didn't believe that it could work and said so. but the next time it came up, I tried it and it did...... wooooo... sneeeeeeky therapists......

[pachyderm]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

I didn't believe that it could work and said so. but the next time it came up, I tried it and it did...... wooooo... sneeeeeeky therapists......

I'm not sure I believe it, but you make me chuckle anyway...

[tears_of_a_clown]

Originally Posted by rainbow8

.

I officially ended with my former T who I've been calling Bt for blunt T, but it was open-ended, so I saw her every few months. That was okay until I realized I wanted a different kind of help, and found my new T, who I've been calling Kt for kind T because she's so kind.

Thanks for clarifying those abbreviations. I had seen them on other threads and wondered what they were for.

[tears_of_a_clown]

Originally Posted by pachyderm

I'm not sure I believe it, but you make me chuckle anyway...

Works for a lot of people. An alternative is to say the obsessional thought into a tape recorder and play it back again and again for 20 minutes. The more exaggerated the thought the better. The brain has a way of oversaturating and then shutting it off.

I've done the "obsess for 10 minutes" thing (actually, about T!) and it totally worked. I laid on my bed and MADE myself think about him for 15 minutes. By the time the 15 minutes were up I was sooooooooooooooooooo done. It felt really freeing.

[tears_of_a_clown]

Originally Posted by BlackCanary

I am sure that quoting a 1984 Animotion song will date me but that's really the least of my problems today....

It's also the title of a Cheap Trick song from 2003, so that wouldn't date you as much (although I guess Cheap Trick does anyway!)

[BlackCanary]

@SAWE - I have given myself permission to think about him; I did not use a timer so I went way over time. For me, just immersing myself in what I am supposed to be doing - vs. obsessing - is the best outcome. I am pleased when I accomplish my task, more satisfying than the obsession.
But, should the intensity of thoughts return, I'm TOTALLY going to use the timer method.
The pain, though, is present all the time.

Originally Posted by rainbow8

... It worked out well the first time I went back, but 3 or 6 months later (I forgot how long) I went again, and I started obsessing about her all over again. It ended up worse, and I saw a 3rd T to resolve all of my feelings.
Still, I think it was worth it to tie things up with her. ...

In your case, do you think seeing him could resolve the pain, or would indeed make it worse? What exactly do you want to achieve by seeing him again? If you're like me, what you really want is that "fix" again, and you'll be unsatisfied. But if you think telling him will solve something, or if there is something else left unsaid, that it could be productive. I still think discussing it all with your new T would be more helpful, at least before you try to make an appointment with old T.

thx for the hugs!
Ah, you had a long break before your return, but it was still worth it. I think that the timing of my return visit - now, when I'm still working thru my termination - will be productive and let me feel more resolved.
This is a serious point you make -- It can't be about a "fix"
I'd finally decided I wanted to terminate and find a female T when he announced his departure. I did not have the time to put all my feelings about it on the table in three final sessions. SO, if I combine it with SAWE's concept, then I'd only plan to have 1-3 more sessions with him, to finish. If I wanted more than that, then I'd have to self-check on my motivation.

Writing in my journal last night helped. I can see - in writing - what I might need, what feels incomplete. I had a neat and tidy farewell, since the time available was dictated by his last day. I did not want to "waste" the final few sessions with messy feelings. Feelings would have been a distraction to having a review of our challenges and accomplishments. So, I planned out the sessions, controlled it so that we "accomplished" our termination goal.

That works OK for the logical adult self, the one who is used to having favorite colleagues move on to new jobs.

But this T is the one that my teenage self opened up to, shared her tough story with, and she is feeling abandoned. So, she'd benefit from another session or two with originalT in order to have her say. And, since HE left her, it ended up having a different feeling than when I was choosing it. The feelings move from one extreme to another!

I'm definitely not going to get very much into the topic with the new girlT; it is something unfinished between me and originalT. However, new girlT and I have not yet built our therapeutic relationship.

I'm feeling pressured because the only office phone# where I can contact him is where he works on Saturday. So, if I don't call tonight he's not going to hear from me for a week, and I'd be another week further from resolution.

[BlackCanary]

I called and left a detailed message with the appt request. I did feel relief after making the call, my mind was clear and free for a while.
It's like I did what I could for the inner teen, who wants to communicate with originalT; all I can do is ask for the opportunity. It seemed to calm the urgent feelings.

Possible outcomes:
1) no response at all
2) return call with yes, when would you like to come in
3) return call with no, I cannot give you an appt

Overall, odds are not in teenager's favor.

For #3, there may be various reasons given, and I am considering that the actual reason does not matter so much (since I'm likely to argue against some of them, like "You've got a new therapist and can talk to her" - but I only met her once! this is not about her, it's about finishing with you!; or "The HMO requested that I not see prior clients" -- but this isn't to continue therapy, the purpose is to end the therapy! I had the therapy with YOU, not the HMO!, etc, etc, etc.), Teenager argued with adults all the time.

But, since I'm doing the asking, I need to be ready to respond to the No in a graceful and composed way.
(you're my suppression....)

[BlackCanary]

He called.
He said No, I'm not going to give you an appointment.
Then he made it worse by saying, I'd like to but I think it's a bad idea.
?? What do you mean??
I'm torn.
I told him that this was not helpful, if it was no, then just say no.

I presented my argument, like I knew I would.
He told me I'm not going to talk him into it.

He also said if I call him again, he's not going to respond at all.
So professional.

His parting words "Good luck with your life".

I guess I've kind of been in a train-wreck relationship for a while, but unable to see it or accept it that he was the wrong therapist for me.

[rainbow8]

(((((BlackCanary)))))

I feel so awful for you. He sounds like a jerk! Yet I know about obsessions. At least you know that you can't see him. How are you feeling about him right now? Maybe that teenage part can decide he's not worth it. However, I wouldn't write him off as "the wrong T for me". You did say that you accomplished some things with him that you discussed at your final session. It's not a black and white situation. There's something to be learned from each T, even if it's just knowing what you need from a different T.

I know you said that you aren't/can't talk to your new T about him and your therapy, but I really, really think that you need to. Have you seen her yet? Do you think she will be "the right T for you"?

Ugh, (((((((((((Canary!))))))))))))))) - it's like the worst case scenario. I'm SO sorry.

If he would just be open and honest with you, it seems like it would make it easier..but it feels like he is avoiding, and handling it all so immaturely. If you call, he's not going an answer again??? WTH?! That makes me so angry for you. Therapists are supposed to be trained in how to communicate and how to move in and out of and through relationships...what he's doing feels so passive-aggressive to me.

I agree with Rainbow...this really feels like something that perhaps your new T can help you with.

How are you feeling now?

[seventyeight]

ugh, yeah, what a jerk. i'd like to tell you not to call back, but at this point - what the heck? may as well do whatever you feel like doing in this situation, because it seems you're not going to get the response you want anyway. just be mindful of yourself though. it sounds to me like this is like the 'cycle of abuse.' like he's abusing you, you're the one to say "sorry" and then grovel back to his feet. i don't know, but that's the first thing that came to mind when i read your post.

anyway, i think the main thing to take away from this is that despite what it seems on the surface, you've moved on. for one, you've found a good therapist that you are working well with. and for two, you're done working with this guy - so a few phone calls here and there aren't a big deal in my opionion. just do what feels right for you in this situation, but when you're able to step back - please recognize that you deserve WAY more than this.

[WePow]

wow

Well - 1st of all - I cannot tell you how PROUD I am of you for ASKING for what you needed - for making a stand for YOU and for your healing.

2nd - I don't know his side of things - but that comment about life shows that I think you are FAR better off without him as your T. Y

UCK! He sounds like a SMUCK!

3rd - Don't stop fighting for yourself or your healing. You have every right to feel anything you feel. You don't act out on those feelings in a way that would harm anyoneo. It does a number on a person to be emotionally nude infront of a T. And transference is expected.

Allow yourself to grieve THROUGH this.
Realize that T's make some frikin HUGE mistakes!!!
Now you know what kind of a person he is on the inside - that is going to sting. But use it to empower your heart and learn from it.

VERY BIG HUGS to you dearest one!

and ps - if any therapists are reading this thread, I hope you pay close attention to the emotions this dear lady is having. These things need to be done in the RIGHT way!!! Serious damage can be done by a T when this type of thing happens.

[BlackCanary]

to everyone!

I really needed your support today and you all came through. I feel a warmth in my center and a small smile on my face

I feel angry - at T for how he handled this request, telling me he'd like to but he did not see the ultimate benefit. I heard "I like you a lot, so I"m uncomfortable seeing you again. You let me off easy not getting into the feelings part and I'm not going to open the door for that baggage". (T runs from my feelings?)

I'm glad I got some of the feelings out while he was on the phone, and I reserve the right to leave messages with additional feelings

I'm angry at T for how he handled my transference for the WHOLE time - 18 mo - he thought it was about him, so that's how he reacted, was uncomfortable the whole time. So I kept thinking it might be about him liking me back vs. about the connection to feelings and experiences in my past (which I was talking about, he just could not do his part). I don't think I really understood this failure until now

I feel stupid for not trusting my instincts over all these months that he just wasn't right in some way - maybe 75-80% right. And maybe I was measuring against the wrong things, so his score is over-inflated. I feel stupid for staying with him for so long - even when others kindly said "Maybe you should find someone else? Maybe a woman?"

I'm still glad for what I learned, about saying no, setting my boundaries, sticking up for myself, keeping myself safe. Making pro-me choices. I'm glad that he approached working with me in a way that I felt comfortable, willing to return. I'm glad I had a place to go and be angry. It was good to know that what he really wanted for me was that I learned to love myself.

So, it's probably good that he left; I'm not sure - even with my plan to terminate - that I'd have managed to leave. He always thought he could be the perfect T, solve any problem, and I always wanted to give him the chance.

At the end of this day, I know that if I want to leave it as-is, I can probably do so in peace.

I don't think you should feel stupid at ALL for trusting him these past months; he was your T and you SHOULD be able to trust your T. However, your T obviously needed some consultation re: his countertransference feelings for you, and not only did he choose not to go that route, now he is choosing to make the termination end in a negative way for you (as he runs and "hides").

I kind of feel sorry for him, too...being a therapist so unwilling to deal with one's own feelings and emotions is really sad. He should be able to "do better," first off, for YOU, but also for himself, because he is responsible for future clients and his other present clients as well.

Anyway, I am so sorry this happened. I understand why you might want to see a female T right now (that is a great, safe place to work through your anger, as is here, of course!), but don't let this one T turn you off of male Ts for life...as we have seen on this forum, some of them are pretty great...I know mine is! Hugs to you as you work through this and move forward to something much better!