I think I'm a stalker...

Thanks rainbow8

I'm not doing very well actually. I don't think I will be able to Tell T about what I did. I am too scared of losing her. Haven't discussed not coping between session yet as we don't see each other until next Thursday and I don't want to call.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Maybe don't admit to being in the parking lot. Just say that you're struggling inbtwn sessions and am missing her. Say you're wishing for some connection during the long break. But you should talk to her. If that is difficult for you, maybe write her a letter. Then you won't have to come up with explaining your feeling on the fly.

I agree with Scarlet.

It's obviously something that you are struggling with- yet I understand your reservation in telling her you waited to see her. You can still address the bigger issue of missing her and looking for connection without saying specifics. Hope that your next appt is helpful for you, and it gets easier for you. I know how challenging the feelings can be/are!

I don't know why someone would become (or continue to be) a therapist if they are not comfortable with clients exhibiting obsessive behavior, especially given that the structure of therapy provokes this kind of response with regularity. If a therapist has stalker fears, they ought to see their own therapist about that, so it's not clouding their judgement. Or find another line of work. I don't think this is unreasonable.

The only expectation I see here is that therapists not rush to judgement or pathologize the client's behavior (as people seem to be doing in this thread), whether due to their own fears or ignorance.

By virtue of payment, clients have earned the right to get the benefit of the doubt, within reason. Therapists are held to a higher standard because that is their job.

But . . . if the fears are not just fears, but a reality (and it can become a reality unfortunately in some cases), they are perfectly within their rights professionally and legally to do what they need to do for their own safety and that of their family. The law will back them up on that; stalking, no matter who it comes from, no matter what a person's profession is, is against the law.

Again, don't at all think that is what is going on with the OP.

A one-off situation I don't think is stalking. It is most definitely a slippery slope and could lead in to full blown stalking in the future.

OP I think you're human and vulnerable and can understand why you did this. But I think it's good you are recognizing and want to get a handle on it right away.
________________________________________________________________________
Second thought: I think it's interesting people have these different opinions. They talk about stalking behavior as ok if it's not coming from a "dangerous" person. But stalking is stalking whether or not it's coming from a pleasant but vulnerable human being as it is coming from a sociopath. The intent can be different but the behavior can feel threatening in both situations. Intent is NOT all that matters with this. Having someone peeking outside your window can be very alarming whether or not that person has plans to physically harm you. it is potential for psychological harm.

You chose the profession, suck it up if you're stalked??? Wow.
There is a realm beyond black and white that allows for the understanding that the client is suffering and perhaps needs adjustment in treatment while still realizing that a therapist has a right to their privacy and personal life and does not deserve to be stalked. I'm not talking about dangerous therapists who deliberately manipulate clients beyond the brink, but your run of the mill therapist. that you cannot see that these truths can both exist at the same time is unfortunate. Stalking can be scary for not just the individual but the individual's family, if they get wrapped up in it. So the therapist's spouse and kids are just asking for it. They chose to have a therapist family member right?

A one-off catching a glimpse of the T in public is one thing. but you seem to think it's acceptable to cruise by a T's house too. Really? No. That is not just the T's home oftentimes. It is their spouse, their kids, their roomates home too and THEY deserve privacy even if you think the therapist needs to check that at the door the day they stepped into this profession.

OP: I hope you are okay.

I would like to make a gentle reminder to members to be careful of taking a thread off topic and unsupportive when interacting between one another. The OP posted a difficult subject and many of us will have differing opinions and experiences. Threads are not the place to take issue with another member and continue the issue to the point of taking the thread off topic and unsupportive.

If you look up at the beginning of each page in this forum there is a link to something extremely important to remember here. Please take a moment to read it again, step away from the computer if need be for a bit, put another on ignore for awhile to make yours and everyone else's experience as best as it can be here.

http://forums.psychcentral.com/psych...ment-here.html

It's okay to have differing opinions, it's not okay to call one another out over those opinions and make it personal.

Thanks!

I never said anything about clients cruising by a T's house. I also did not say Ts should just suck it up if they are stalked. You might want to read posts more carefully.

My suggestion was that Ts should be prepared for obsessive behavior in general from clients, since therapy clearly brings this out. And if they are not prepared they are in the wrong job. That is not the same as giving the client free reign. I said this in part because OP only sat in the car one time, and yet some people here labeled it stalking, which I presume to be a reflection of prevailing attitudes among therapists and therapy culture.

Also seems that obsessive impulses from clients are frequently framed as client pathology, and clients are blamed and demonized. But in truth it MIGHT be that a natural response to the extremes of a "normal" therapy relationship: love bombing, intense attention and attunement for a very brief period, followed by total separation for a comparatively long period.

**In other words, I contend that the pathology or dysfunction might be in the relationship, this manifests in client behavior, and then the client gets blamed. This could be the worst and most toxic sort of victim blaming.**

The mature and ethical thing to do is look at BOTH client and therapist behavior to see what is contributing to this. The other ethical thing to do is have a discussion up front (informed consent) where the therapist explains that it is common and gives it some context BEFORE it arises. Seems this rarely happens.

BTW, the way you quoted my post it looks like I said something that I did not. Appreciate if you could fix this.

I did read this link carefully and one of the things it says is that we are to accept each others accounts and not 'play detective'. In this regard it seems to me that if a person claims he has no malicious intentions and that he once waited somewhere for a glimpse of his T then we should offer support for the way he is feeling and not classify his one action in terms which make HIM sound dangerous and make his behaviour sound seriously pathological.

This is not a thread about 'stalking' in general - and what rights a T has when subject to such behaviour. It is a thread started by one person and it involved a fairly innocuous act. The claim that such an act is on a 'slippery slope' to 'stalker behaviour' cannot be made without substantial evidence and it seems not only unfair to me but also potentially HARMFUL when said to someone who is likely to be depressed and is struggling with difficult emotions.

Hi Loco4,

I very rarely comment on threads in this forum as I don't feel I've had enough hours in therapy to have much to contribute. But this issue you are discussing and what you should do about it just kind of grabbed my heart so I wanted to say something.

There are many reasons we go into therapy. The mainstay of talk therapy is to talk, to communicate with the t. Through this communication we learn more about ourselves, we feel things that may bring us to act differently than our normal way of acting. There is nothing wrong with wanting to see or be near your t. I think though that you really need to have a good communication with your t about your feelings, your needs and how you can more readily ask for what you feel you need. Having this conversation should help you know that your feelings and thoughts aren't wrong, but to maybe find out different ways of feeling the closeness of t when you can't see them that don't include putting yourself into a position of feeling like you've done something wrong.

Going through therapy is difficult enough without feeling like we've done something wrong because of a normal feeling/need from our t's. I think you would do yourself and your t a disservice not to talk about what happened and what can help you in moving forward. I know it's scary to consider telling your t, but letting this go unresolved can do you more harm than good.

Take care!
sabby

Just went and re-read OP and would like to answer the questions it asks - whether or not they are rhetorical.

Q: Am I a stalker?

A: Nothing you wrote in your comment suggests that you are a stalker. Waiting somewhere once in order to get a glimpse of someone who makes you feel safe DOES NOT A STALKER MAKE.

Q: Am I a creep?

A: No, 'creep' is a pejorative label without any substantive content. (Though the Radiohead song is a classic)

Not only should you NOT be calling yourself these things, but you should not be accepting such labels from others either.

#YouAreNotAlone

As a t, I really don't think this is stalker behaviour. I think it shows a deep longing for connection with your t. I think it's a very personal question and each individual therapist would answer it differently. I really don't feel it would warrant any red flags for me if a client did that but telling me they did that would be different. It depends on how they tell it and would they own their own strong feelings and what those feelings were. I guess I would worry about erotic transference and be curious about what was happening under the initial just wanting to see your t.
I have often wanted to see my t outside of session and drive by her house but I strongly resisted because I won't allow my obsessions to dictate my behaviour. I always think about others boundaries and if I would be comfortable if someone did that to me. Loco, I just wanted to say you did nothing wrong and if you feel you can't tell your t about it, I would trust your intuition perhaps you know or feel your t would not be happy about this and that's ok because those are her boundaries. Every t has completely different boundaries. Would you want to know or be comfortable if someone wanted to catch a glimpse of you?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Are you saying that the act would not ring alarm bells for you but that a patient reporting the act would ring alarm bells?

Well I guess what I was trying to say was we know when we have crossed someone's boundary. We know when we are crossing a line but I can't speak for OP and say what they feel about it but I know if I told my t that I had done that she would want to know exactly what my intentions were, if they romantically driven or if I wanted a connection with her, if I did need connection I could ask and she would usually try to help. Where as I am not sure again if Loco's t would be open to accommodating her needs if he/she could express them.
I would be curious about the desire that drove them to be secretive about wanting connection. Perhaps the OP has reached out to people in the past and been rejected, that would certainly keep my intentions hidden. It sounds as though this was nothing only a genuine need for connection in a hard time.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It sounds like Loco's concern is that revealing this might jeopardize the whole relationship, and then the attachment bond is broken forever. Frighten the T and you might get "referred out" aka abandoned.

What I don't see acknowledged in this scenario is who holds all the power. The T sets the boundaries and rules, has much more power to define what is "normal" or acceptable, and can sever the relationship in a unilateral way thus abruptly turning off the supply of the elixir to which the client has become habituated. This power differential has a profound impact on what sorts of things the client can risk revealing.

I can hear that this is a concern of Loco's that her t could potentially take Riis the wrong way and it could damage their relationship. She is hesitant to disclose this and I encourage her to follow her instinct because she is the best judge of her therapy and her relationship with her t.
As for the power issue you refer to, this seems to be moving away from the thread. We all have the power to leave therapy and to start and the way I look at it is the client has most of the power because they choose to do both.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I can't speak for anyone but myself, but I often feel unwanted, intrusive or that i am being a nuisance, when that is not the case. I also often feel guilty or bad when I am actually doing nothing wrong. These are engrained reactions and as far as I understand quite typical of depressive personalities. For this reason I did need to verify quite often with my T. So I would disagree about always knowing.

I also think a person's motivation can be quite baffling - even to that person. For instance, my T provided a purpose for living and a sense of security. There was also various types of transference going on. I was generally open about all of this and obviously he did not see me as much of a threat!

Editing to say - I obviously don't know the relevant details about OP or his/her T...

I agree that you don't always know when you have crossed someone's boundaries or how a person will respond, which can be quite scary in a T relationship.
The best description of therapeutic boundaries I have ever heard was on this site (I can't remember who said it):
Therapeutic boundaries are like an invisible electric fence; you don't know where they are but when you step on them it hurts like hell.

I'm sorry you - and others - have had such a highly fraught experience. While my first therapist was somewhat inconsistent and could be hurtful too, my later one was fairly laid back and never acted in an aggressive, harsh or punishing manner. I'm beginning to see how fortunate I was...

Boundaries are always tricky because they are different with everyone. The boundaries between a t and client are perhaps more difficult to navigate, they can be both confusing and hurtful and exactly like Echos mentioned like an invisible electric fence. Sometimes we don't know when we have crossed a line with somebody else but we know when somebody crosses our lines and that's sometimes all we have to judge by.
Loco, how are you doing with all of this?
I just wanted you to know that I felt like a stalker too with my first t and she thought me about boundaries, before therapy I had never heard of the word. I used to ring through to her voicemail every night, I just needed to hear her voice! She was not pleased and immediately let me know this was crossing her boundaries. I think we all long for connection and it's only natural to seek that from someone who listens to us and tries to understand us!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I disagree. This has everything to do with power. Seems the OP's predicament hinges on the perceived threat of losing the relationship if she says the wrong thing. Or being subject to labeling or punitive boundary setting, which is the exclusive domain of the therapist.

As for power to leave, scan this forum. Many clients apparently live in fear of losing the therapeutic bond. They live in fear of the associated rejection and abandonment, suddenly being alone with all the stuff and having no place to go, being shamed if they reveal too much or too little.

I am going to step away from this now because I get the feeling that whatever I say there will be a reason to question and argue and that is not what this thread is about or what I wanted by responding.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks for your input regarding a T's likely reaction. We are all hypothesising about how a T might react so good having a real life one give an opinion!