Couch 246: Choose Change

Home from a very soul-full session with L this afternoon. She was definitely on her A-game today!

Doorknob confessions make perfect sense. Freeing in a way because you won't have face your therapist until the next session.

Updating a friend is perfectly understandable.

Dr T should be aware that he is blurring the boundaries with his disclosures. That should be brought up.

After also reading your Dear T post- you did nothing wrong.he will never be the T you want him to be. Look at what he is showing you now.

Glad you had a good session Art.

I've been in a phase of watching Cash Jordan videos on Youtube about New York.

It makes me want to not visit.



Don't mind the rats, just the crazy rents. $5165 a month for a studio or net $4304 with free months.

Thanks, Lemon. It wasn't quite doorknob, like 10 minutes before, but still. I think he's trying to make it clear he isn't a friend. But yes, the disclosures are confusing. I suppose I need to bring those up.

I do feel he's really helped me lately. He may not be the T I want him to be, but I feel he's often the T I need, if that makes sense. Maybe it's better in the long run that he does have certain boundaries? I don't know.

I did end up emailing him. I started with the irony that I was emailing him about wanting to email. But I tried to make it clear what I was feeling, including conflicting thoughts--and how the shame was winning.

Glad it went well, Artie!

I disagree that the therapist bringing some info about his life is blurring boundaries. First - a lot of people seem to want to know about the therapist (granted - I don't know why) and LT has asked for such disclosure - and it is often couched in ways to trust or feel more secure in therapy. To me that is very different than wanting to tell the therapist how some third person is after surgery. To me it would be different if the client was having surgery - then updating the therapist might make sense. But what would be the point of writing the therapist and saying something like "my husband's surgery was fine" = particularly if one has another appointment where it could be talked about in person. To me that is close family friend/family info. Why not tell a friend instead of the therapist?

SD brings up an interesting point. There is no point in writing an everythings fine email. If you are worried, you should be getting support, a family member accompanying you to the hospital. If things go very badly, then an emergency phone call to t would surely be in order.

It's not like you can have 2 emails in your draft folder, depending which way it goes! Thats just cold! That will end up on Court TV!

He did say it would make sense if it was my surgery--so I think his headspace and view on this is similar to yours.

For me, it wouldn't be telling therapist instead of a friend, but both.

I do get what you're saying. And I'm not sure what's behind this for me. But I think it's something that I need to address in therapy. Like to figure out what's behind it, why it matters, etc. I wish he'd go in that direction, like, 'Let's examine what's going on here--why does this matter to you? What's it about?" Instead of seeming to shut down and/or suggest it's not appropriate.

Earlier in session, Dr. T joked about my digging a grave in the backyard to prepare. Which is where the Addams family came in. (And I brought up Rear Window, which he said he'd only seen part of.)

And yeah, he said "no news is good news." And he said if things go badly, then I can send an emergency text.

I don't know why this matters to me, and that's what I want to examine. I'm pretty sure it's not just about him, or even primarily about him.

Instead of waiting for him to guess correctly or think in the way you want him to do - why not couch it in those terms when you bring it up?
"I want to examine why I want to do X"

I agree that explicitly stating things (assuming that you are aware of what you need or want) is most useful. However, to be fair, examining things in this way is a basic aspect of therapy and he really shouldn't need for this to be highlighted to him. If he does need this to be clarified, I would not have any faith that he is skilled enough to do this kind of exploration. He is too caught in the subject of LT's request/need/want to be able to intelligently work with her process (or indeed to be sufficiently aware of his own process in order to keep the focus on LT, but that's a well beaten drum by us all at this point).

Yeah it sounds like they ALMOST get there, but not quite. It's hard to not be jokey (the client). If the t is being jokey, thats very bad. This sounds like the recurring conversation my t and i would have every time he left town and i would invite him to stop by my place on his way back from the airport (which sounds appalling to me now!).

Yeah, its not about him. It's about trying to be in control of those ambiguously seductive scenarios we were put in growing up.

But it’s not a basic aspect of every therapy. It’s a basic aspect of the kind of therapy LT desires and that this guy doesn’t do, and has been pretty clear that he doesn’t do.

Another well-beaten drum on this topic: why keep trying to change someone who isn’t going to change? If I wanted medicine and I went to Dr. SD, who refused to give me any medications because Western medicine sucks, why wouldn’t I then go to Dr. Ex-Hankster, a firm believer in medication and bonus leeches, instead?

I'm sorry I mentioned it.

Oh gosh sorry LT, did I sound harsh when I referred to a well beaten drum? That was not my intention at all. I meant that it's probably not useful for me to say it since many people have said it before and it might feel like a pile-on to you. I did not mean that you shouldn't have mentioned it. Your experiences of it are important to discuss.

Dont say that

T and i returned to the subject many times before we both got it right. But its like what yogi berra said about therory and practice: in theory, theyre the same; in practice, theyre not. Wanting him to ask you what you really mean is getting stuck in theory.

I admitted to last t that i wanted prev t-pdoc to come to family dinners to defend and protect me, to prove my worth. You blaming ex-mc for all his wrongdoings is denial of these feelings, for both him and t. Feelings are not facts. These guys are supposed to be SAFE, thats the point. That may be why it feels like t withdraws - he is showing you safety. But you must still state what you feel.

Yes, that's true that it isn't a feature of all therapy and I did wonder about that as I typed it. I suppose I discount therapies which don't focus on process or depth work. Also, I imagine part of the confusion for LT is that there are some instances where some kind of process work happens and deeper exploration takes place, it's not like it's just CBT counselling for example. Given your attachment needs LT, it's not surprising that it would be hard for you to switch to a Dr Una, even if you liked the look of her leeches. Wait, I think I am confusing my metaphors. I thought it was about drums...

And cupping - don't forget the cupping

My leeches are fantastic - and they're REAL!

Eta - i think i got that backwards, but its funny this way, about leeches, right?

To the therapist or here or both?
To me, and obviously I could be wrong, it seems this is your pattern when the therapist says no to some request (both this guy and exmc). You ask for something usually around more contact or info about them, the therapist doesn't respond how you want, and then there is this aftermath - I am wondering if it is more shame around asking and being told no - The asking isn't particularly a wrong thing to do - the stuck part is in how when the answer is no - you get extremely worked up and then go through all of this time and time again.
Or not - just my thoughts.

what? I worry about you.

I guess both? And I know this is my pattern.

I do think it's more shame around asking and being told no. Actually, I don't even think it's the "no" so much as his suddenly shifting his demeanor and tone if I ask about something like that (he confirmed the shift, so I read him correctly). Because that makes me feel like I did something wrong. If he just stayed as he'd been earlier in the session and simply said "no, I'd prefer not to do that," it would hit me differently.

It threw me because I wasn't even thinking this was a big ask. Honestly, I wasn't even asking him, but saying, "I kind of wish I could do this." (I guess it was a veiled question.) But apparently, it triggered all these thoughts about boundaries and implications for Dr. T (he said this in his email response--I'm not just assuming). He did say he doesn't want me to feel shame about it and said he hoped we could get to a better place about it Monday. So we'll see, I guess.

Thanks, Comrade. It wasn't you in particular, more the combination of responses. Combined, at the time, with my not having heard back from Dr. T yet, when he nearly always replies in the morning (usually before 9), including on weekends. There have been a couple times he hasn't responded to things when he was irritated or mystified by them, so I was concerned this was one of those times and I'd managed to just compound things by emailing. (I haven't emailed much lately at all.) He finally replied around 3 pm (he did apologize for not replying sooner, said the morning got away from him, plus he wanted to give thought to my email before responding).