[zeninfinity]

I have a new girlfriend going on 5 months. She's from the Ukraine,

Possible trigger:

Her father committed suicide on her 6th birthday.

He loved and adored her, suffered a bad head injury and became depressed.

Her mother then basically abandoned her and shipped her off to her grandparents. Her grandmother treated her like a princess. She's 41 and often says, "I am a princess" in a joking tone, but we all know how that goes.

I'm a fairly aware guy. For the most part I am present a fair amount of time. But since I met her there is no doubt I am in my head more and I have been triggered into undesirable behavior a few times now. Basically old wounds reappearing, lol and I THOUGHT I was awake.

I've gotten jealous a few times. I have felt rejected and have been put down.

2 weeks ago I made a commitment to stay present when I am with her. Which helped me see behind the mask. She mentioned on 2 different occasions that guys were hitting on her. Another situation is when she brought and old boyfriend. It was obvious, she was trying to make me jealous. Silly girl! When I present it's really easy to see through her bs behavior. If anything, I just feel more compassion for her.

This past weekend I lost my cool and snapped. In short she was mad at me and put on the deep freeze. I was present when this was all going on and honestly, at first, didn't care. I just saw her as being stuck in her head. We were at a party. She basically ignored me for 6 hours. If I tried to touch her she would violently brush me off. Basically she was withholding love from me. By the end of the night i was starting to crack. Then she decided it was time to be a little nice to me. It was pathetic. I lit up like a neglected puppy and was just so happy to get her attention. Sad but true.

On the ride back she went back to ignoring me. I just kept letting go and staying present and stayed calm. I wake up the next morning and I thinking, "is the deep freeze still on?" Instead of embracing my fear i choose love and reached out to touch her. She brushed my hand away.

Man, this triggered some old story BIG TIME! I jumped out of bed. Went to the shower, ranted and abandoned her. I was DEEP in my head and it took 2 days till I could be somewhat present again. I haven't taken a wild emotional ride like that in years. Ugh. I did some work on myself and could only pull out a memory of my friends in 3rd grade all turning on me and not speaking to me, ignoring me for a day.

On one hand this woman is a great teacher for me in a spiritual sense. On the other hand she wreaks havoc on my ego. If I'm present, this is no problem. If not, I behave very poorly. I mirror back the dissonance.

Sex is amazing with this woman. I'm 51 and still very sexually active. Primal sex is intense and incredible. But to be honest, I'm not that into it anymore. We have been informally practicing Tantra, Karezza and Taoist sexual practices.

When we are both present during sex there have been times where I didn't know where I ended and she began. Time and space suspends and we connect on this very deep, spiritual level. I've never experienced anything remotely like it. I know, I know, great sex does not make a great partnership.

She has been going through her own awakening. She admits she was a total ***** in the past. Shared some intimate things about herself, perhaps over sharing. And is on her own spiritual journey and seeks enlightenment. There is no doubt she has the desire to change, to grow.

In the meantime, she still tries to control me. If I'm present, again, no problem. I see right through it.

I'm in love with her "true self" which comes out from time to time. Well, I really love all of her. Just wondering if it will always be like this? Or is there a possibility of her letting go of her egoic N ways and evening out a little?

Please folks, comment away. Admittedly, I'm a little lost and need guidance and good advice.

Thank you for you time. Much appreciated.

[divine1966]

When things are bad in
the very beginning they have no where to go but downhill. I would not worry about enlightenment and awakenings. Relationship is either good or bad.

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[Trippin2.0]

Have you asked her why she enjoys playing these mind games with you and what she's getting out of it?


I would...


Idk, it just seems so juvenile, I mean I'm 31 and I wouldn't be able to deal with dating someone that behaved liked a teenager...

It's very off putting to me.

[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by divine1966

When things are bad in
the very beginning they have no where to go but downhill. I would not worry about enlightenment and awakenings. Relationship is either good or bad.

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Thank you for your reply! I know exactly what you mean. But, it isn't all that bad to me. I still want to give it a go. Besides sexually, we connect on many other levels too. But there is no doubt a disconnect going on. At this point making a break seems a little premature. Hey, everyone has their challenges and I am ok with that. But indeed, something just doesn't seem quite right and it makes me uneasy.

There is no doubt I have a co-dependant past. So, I'm a little worried

Any other takes on this?

[s4ndm4n2006]

you say in one moment in a way she's a great spiritual teacher, but yet nothing in your post implies any of the spiritual maturity or wisdom she has. Only her immaturity.

In all honesty in your writing, and in passing phrases you seem to be trying to make her out to be something more than she is. From what I gather in the post you have great sex that is deep and seems intimate but then everything else... she's just a spoiled princess in my mind that wants what she wants and lashes out or ignores you when she doesn't have it her way.

Of course you haven't elaborated on what you did to get the deep freeze but that kind of response, I would think should only be brought on by the worst offenses I could imagine. From your writing, I don't seem to see that you would be one to offend her in scale to how she is behaving.

I would listen to Trippin and ask her why she does this.

sorry but she seems very immature.

[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by Trippin2.0

Have you asked her why she enjoys playing these mind games with you and what she's getting out of it?


I would...


Idk, it just seems so juvenile, I mean I'm 31 and I wouldn't be able to deal with dating someone that behaved liked a teenager...

It's very off putting to me.

I totally hear you. Yes I asked why she behaves this way. Her reply, "I am human."

There's is no doubt she is juvenile at times. In some ways I find it attractive. I think with the answer she gave me above that I don't feel validated. Perhaps that is why I feel something is missing?

[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by s4ndm4n2006

you say in one moment in a way she's a great spiritual teacher, but yet nothing in your post implies any of the spiritual maturity or wisdom she has. Only her immaturity.

In all honesty in your writing, and in passing phrases you seem to be trying to make her out to be something more than she is. From what I gather in the post you have great sex that is deep and seems intimate but then everything else... she's just a spoiled princess in my mind that wants what she wants and lashes out or ignores you when she doesn't have it her way.

Of course you haven't elaborated on what you did to get the deep freeze but that kind of response, I would think should only be brought on by the worst offenses I could imagine. From your writing, I don't seem to see that you would be one to offend her in scale to how she is behaving.

I would listen to Trippin and ask her why she does this.

sorry but she seems very immature.

I just made a change in plans. And she gave me a hard time for not consulting with her first. It's a control thing. Agree, her reaction was way over the top.

As a spiritual teacher goes. Not so much in the traditional sense of the word "teacher." It's more like when I am calm I can see that she is having an egoic episode. In many ways I see myself in her. Or rather how I used to be. Typically my reaction is nothing. I just observe her suffering and feel compassion. I think this is why I am having such a hard time letting her go.

[metalchick]

Why waste your time and energy on someone who treats you bad. Cut your losses now...It will only get worse.

[Artchic528]

I agree with what has been said, cut your losses and leave this chick. Good sex does not a relationship make. It's just good sex.

[divine1966]

She is 41 and you find her immaturity attractive? I'd focus on why you find it attractive rather than why she dues what she does. We can only control ourselves

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[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by divine1966

She is 41 and you find her immaturity attractive? I'd focus on why you find it attractive rather than why she dues what she does. We can only control ourselves

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Perhaps because I am immature? I prefer "youthful." I guess that's the thing here. I see a lot of myself in her. It's like if I hate on her. I hate on myself.

I agree, we can only control ourselves. And if I choose not to judge her or demand she act a certain way. I'm ok. But when I go outward to blame her for how I feel. There lies the challenge. Does that make sense?

[unaluna]

What if you guys have kids? These attributes wont be so attractive in your childrens mother.

[divine1966]

There is no need to judge or demand but she sounds like a rude person. Unless you enjoy rudeness what's the point? Does she have kids?

To answer if it's always gonna be like this. If she is this way at 41, that's pretty much how it's going to be.

One can be youthful and behave well. I am youthful at 50 but dont act like this



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[Trippin2.0]

Youthful is not the same as rude or immature.


And it does seem like she will always play mind games with you, especially since its her version of being "human".


So either accept this woman likes to destroy and toy with your ego, without a care for how it affect you and accept her as is.


Or accept that this is how she is and move on.


Either way you have to accept that she wont change, people don't just magically do so, especially not at her age.

[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by unaluna

What if you guys have kids? These attributes wont be so attractive in your childrens mother.

I have 4 already! Had 2, didn't plan on a 3rd, well ok what the heck and had twins!

Did someone say something about a box of chocolates? Lol

[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by divine1966

There is no need to judge or demand but she sounds like a rude person. Unless you enjoy rudeness what's the point? Does she have kids?

To answer if it's always gonna be like this. If she is this way at 41, that's pretty much how it's going to be.

One can be youthful and behave well. I am youthful at 50 but dont act like this



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I agree. Choosing not to judge, so to me she just "is". Trying not to label her, it just limits the experience. (edit: truth be told I came her to do exactly that. To judge her and "label" her as an N. I'm trying to let go of this type of reality. I don't want to limit myself, us.)

I saw her last night. I felt good, present. Indeed, she said a few things that sort of rattled me a little. Perhaps to get a rise out of me. Instead of reacting. I more or less observed my thoughts of fear (jealousy, possessiveness, anger, abandonment) and surrendered to them, let them go.
I just sort of let my fears run wild till the thoughts get so absurd I have to laugh at myself and flip the thought from fear to love.

Once I let go of my fear it was easy to see she was in fear too and was projecting it on me. Perhaps she tries to make me jealous because it will make her feel more wanted and desired? In short, a call for love. I guess I've made a choice to answer calls for love with a gift of love.

Does that make any sense?

[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by Trippin2.0

Youthful is not the same as rude or immature.


And it does seem like she will always play mind games with you, especially since its her version of being "human".


So either accept this woman likes to destroy and toy with your ego, without a care for how it affect you and accept her as is.


Or accept that this is how she is and move on.


Either way you have to accept that she wont change, people don't just magically do so, especially not at her age.

Agree with acceptance and I guess it's a choice on how I want to perceive her. As i said before, I see a lot of myself in her. And furthermore the things she triggers in me, in an unusual way, help me grow as a person. As long as i own my feelings and don't blame her. I learn from the experience. In a sense, she pushes me to look inward at myself. And in an odd way I am grateful for that.

Respectfully disagree about people changing at this point in life. From personal experience I feel I have changed a lot in the last 4 years. I hit a low and sort of "woke up." In a sense, I got myself in a situation which of forced me to surrender, to let go, to accept all that "is." As a result I approach things more compassionately than I have in the past.

But I hear you and appreciate you sending advice to protect me. Thank you for your kindness.

I am scratching my head at all this...

I am not a simpleton by any means, and I don't want to trivialize what you feel. But.

You're really over analyzing yourself, her, and your relationship. Just my own opinion.

Why not let go of all of that and simply love her and don't question why she's doing what she's doing and what effect it has on you?

When you fall in love with someone, you fall in love with all of them, not parts of them.

I don't think that what you're doing is good for you or your relationship. And frankly it shouldn't be this much work.

[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by sophiesmom

I am scratching my head at all this...

I am not a simpleton by any means, and I don't want to trivialize what you feel. But.

You're really over analyzing yourself, her, and your relationship. Just my own opinion.

Why not let go of all of that and simply love her and don't question why she's doing what she's doing and what effect it has on you?

When you fall in love with someone, you fall in love with all of them, not parts of them.

I don't think that what you're doing is good for you or your relationship. And frankly it shouldn't be this much work.

Totally agree with you. I am over analyzing. You are right, I need to let go and simply love.

Like I said I've been inside my head a lot lately and thusly over indulging my fears which turn into projections. Which turns into judgement. As I surrender to all this, my pain and suffering melts away.

I feel like I am presently breaking an old co-dependent story. I came on this forum to complain to judge and label her. My ego was bruised and I wanted to prove I was "right." I got wonderful support from everyone here. I felt protected. Thank you all so much for helping me!

This created a space for me and allowed me to see things in a different perspective. Basically I see a lot of my old self in this woman AND I am learning about myself and growing. What's not to like? As long as i do not play the blame game. I continue to grow.

Simply put, I choose to love her.

[Trippin2.0]

Originally Posted by zeninfinity

Respectfully disagree about people changing at this point in life. From personal experience I feel I have changed a lot in the last 4 years. I hit a low and sort of "woke up." In a sense, I got myself in a situation which of forced me to surrender, to let go, to accept all that "is." As a result I approach things more compassionately than I have in the past.

If you re-read my post, you'll see I used the term "magically change"...


I didn't say people never change, or cease to change after a certain age.


My apologies if I was unclear, but what I meant is without provocation.


Nothing you've said or done has inspired or provoked her to change her behaviour, she describes her behaviour as simply being human, thus I don't see her changing of her own volition.


You said it yourself when describing your own changes, you were provoked. Even I myself, I was drastically provoked into changing my maladaptive behaviors into healthier ones.

[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by Trippin2.0

If you re-read my post, you'll see I used the term "magically change"...


I didn't say people never change, or cease to change after a certain age.


My apologies if I was unclear, but what I meant is without provocation.


Nothing you've said or done has inspired or provoked her to change her behaviour, she describes her behaviour as simply being human, thus I don't see her changing of her own volition.


You said it yourself when describing your own changes, you were provoked. Even I myself, I was drastically provoked into changing my maladaptive behaviors into healthier ones.

That's the thing. i think she is in the midst of a transformation. The co in me wants to be like. "I will help to fix her! Then all will be good." Lol, old ways sometimes die a long death. That type of thinking brought me here in the first place. Deep breath, wanting to save people has been a huge part of my life story. When I was down in the dumps as an adolescent I had always wished someone would have just guided me or clued me in. So I tried to save people in an effort to save myself. Lol, no one wants to be saved or can be for that matter. Oops! Bottom line an old story I played over and over again. At 51 I am done with it. it no longer serves me.

I do see effort in other areas. And an overall transformation. So there is no doubt in my mind that she grows spiritually. I guess it's her process and I simply don't want to be demanding and require her to deal with my issues. Sure I could cut bait and dump her, blame her and heck, maybe I would even be "right."

Instead I've chosen to look inward. And let's face it. I've got work to do! So for now. I choose to work on myself.

We've agreed to make our partnership a spiritual practice. In this moment, I feel very good about it.

ps. No need to say you are sorry. "I'm sorry" Lol if I came off combative.

[divine1966]

To the life of me I don't see anything in her behavior or overall in this interaction as spiritual practice or spiritual growth or any kind of transformation. I see rude woman who acts as a girl and you are justifying this bad relationship and sex is good. By no means I am not saying dump her but why call it spiritual? It all sounds very immature to me. I have hard time relating to it.

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[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by divine1966

To the life of me I don't see anything in her behavior or overall in this interaction as spiritual practice or spiritual growth or any kind of transformation. I see rude woman who acts as a girl and you are justifying this bad relationship and sex is good. By no means I am not saying dump her but why call it spiritual? It all sounds very immature to me. I have hard time relating to it.

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Agree, it's sort of a paradox or duality.

No doubt she has very egoic ways (judgement). And if I were to say that to her it would be a projection (maybe it already is just by saying it?). What you say about others is a projection of yourself. "You are this, you are that." I came on here wanting to label her. So in my mind I could say, "oh, she's a narcissist" or bpd or whatever label of the day we have for it. But once I started to do research on narcissism.... I basically saw a lot of myself. It just made me laugh. It was like I was judging myself.

At the end of the day. I guess I would rather be with her than be "right." Not because I like being a punching bag. It's because I don't view myself as a punching bag, or for that matter feel like one, my choice. I just "am." I yam what I yam. Lol

I used to feel separate from everyone and everything. This is "good", that is "bad." This is the "right" way and that is the "wrong" way. This person is this way, that person is that way and of course I am perfect. Etc etc. I think I've come to a place where everything just "is", no right or wrong. From this place of non judgement all the drama simply doesn't exist. I consciously choose not to give the negativity any thought or power by reacting to it. INstead compassion and love is born. I surrender, let it go and an inner peace comes over me. Simply put, as I calm down and let go, my acceptance of what "is" comes with ease and I no linger feel the need to judge.

It goes along with the train of thought that, we are all connected, we are all the same, we are one.

No doubt a new way for me. It feels really good no longer having to take a mental position of being "right."

Did that make any sense?

edit - I guess at the end of the day I am turning inward and looking for answers vs outward. It's working for me. Me complaining on this forum about her is an old way (outward), old story for me. Now I write a new one.

[divine1966]

Well if you are happy with the person and your relationship is satisfying, what does it matter who is right and what strangers think?

We can only do what's right for us. I personally wouldn't waste my time on this, when I was younger I'd probably be justifying persons rudeness and talk about how I have to accept it etc at age 50 I have no energy or time for this. I want to be with someone who is kind and comfortable to be around. Not someone who treats me like crap, and I have no interest in treating anyone badly.

But it really doesn't matter what we think. If it is working for you then it's all good and good luck!

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[zeninfinity]

Originally Posted by divine1966

Well if you are happy with the person and your relationship is satisfying, what does it matter who is right and what strangers think?

We can only do what's right for us. I personally wouldn't waste my time on this, when I was younger I'd probably be justifying persons rudeness and talk about how I have to accept it etc at age 50 I have no energy or time for this. I want to be with someone who is kind and comfortable to be around. Not someone who treats me like crap, and I have no interest in treating anyone badly.

But it really doesn't matter what we think. If it is working for you then it's all good and good luck!

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I'm with you on a lot of what you have said. It's this cool new weird thing. It seems as though I have a lot of compassion! Furthermore it sort of seems I am shedding my "victim" ways and truly taking responsibility for my emotions and actions. Whatever the case I feel very good!

Thank you so much for taking the time to write. Much appreciated!