SHAME

how do you guys cope with feelings of immense shame over things you've done and/or things that have happened to you and your body?



i look back on the things i did with horror and total embarrassment. like i deserve to be quarantined from others. i cant even look at myself in the mirror without feeling extreme self hatred. i feel so disgusted with myself... i

fear my therapist is disgusted with me. i feel like he probably doesn't want to be in the same room as me. he probably doesnt want me to touch his stuff or sit on his couch because i am so nasty. it feels contagious like i will infect others with how disgusting i am.

what are some ways you guys have found to cope with these feelings? or am i the only one that feels this way? i guess i just feel alone and stupid... just gross.

We all feel shame differently. I feel so ashamed about my sexuality that I keep my head down and avoid contact with others. For years I have punished myself and displaced that shame and internalised it. It's not my fault I am gay and it's not your fault you did the things you did, it takes two to tango and you were the vulnerable one in the therapeutic relationship. You were violated and that in itself brings up feelings of shame. Is there a way that you can see that this shame doesn't belong to you? Not all of it anyway!
I don't think you are stupid or gross, you were the victim of a master manipulator who abused his power

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Obviously I'm no master at dealing with shame as I've been trying to starve myself to death on and off for 28 years.
But..

One thing I do is kind of flip it....instead of viewing it as "I'm disgusting I let x happen" I try to tell myself " no. Despite all you've been through, you weren't gross or stupid. You were open hearted and trusting and loving.and those are GOOD things. Someone cruel took advantage of your goodness. That's not something to be ashamed of. Its like you painted a masterpiece and someone else decided to destroy it. You would obviously grieve the loss but you wouldn't blame yourself because someone was mean or crazy enough to destroy the painting.

I also view time as a river. The only moment that truly exist is where I am at this second. Everything else is already swept away somewhere I can't follow it, or is ahead where I can't see it. So when the shame is bad I.imagine those events receding down the river til they are put of sight.

I've also realized as I've gotten older that EVERY ONE has dark secrets. It helps to remember you are no better or worse than anyone else.

I don't think you're alone and you're definitely not stupid.

I've personally found academic, information-heavy texts invaluable for normalizing issues around shame and sexuality. It's something I can do at home without having to talk dirty details with my T (something I sometimes find too threatening). The reading is rational and measured--all intellectual so it doesn't overwhelm me with strong emotions--either my own or the author's. I can just read and say, "Oh, X is common and a normal response, and here's the rationality behind it. That makes sense."

I hope you find some way to work through these issues for yourself

Shame can be paralyzing and isolating. I'm sorry that happened to you, and you feel this way.

Speaking for myself, I look at it, at least in part, as a temptation. Shame makes me look at the worst parts of me, or at things I've done, and makes me ignore everything else. Then it drives me to do those things again because I don't care about myself. I don't care about myself because I only focus on the bad. I try to think that even though I did or do those things, and I am responsibe, I am not those things, and am better than that. It helps to remember that you are not always 100% responsible. In your case you were vulnerable and taken advantage of. You were abused.

I have a problem with Pornography and Masturbation. I really truly hate it, and I feel like such a pervert. For the most part I'm trying to escape from reality, pump myself full of endorphins, and trying to make up for the affection I've never had and feel like I never will have. It makes everything worse. I'm so ashamed I wish I could disappear. What I do is my fault, but the unfulfilled emotional needs, lonliness, and pain aren't.

With my therapist it's REALLY hard to talk about. I avoid it too much, but it helps a lot when you reveal your shame to someone and they still accept you and don't judge you. In the real world, when I'm with other people everyday I try to push it out of my mind and remember I am not those things.

It's one of the reasons hugs are so important to me in therapy and is an actual requirement. I feel so ashamed about a lot of things. Especially my T knowing my secret. But if she's willing to hug me, then on some level she still accepts me. Like imagine hugging the most disgusting person you can think of. Then imagine hugging the person you love the most. Two different types of hugs, right? You can tell by how they hug you. That's why my T and I always hug after each session. It tells each other that everything is okay btwn us.

My gosh, it's like I wrote what you said myself. When I first considered talking to my T about the CSA I experienced, I was so incredibly ashamed and scared that he would never look at me the same, that he would think I was disgusting and dirty, and that he would never want to hug me or even touch my hand or anything. I also was scared that he would disinfect the chair I sat in after I left. It took me months before I could even tell him that I was abused, and still haven't explicitly told him what all actually happened. It's still too much for me to even type or write out much less speak. But little by little, he is helping me to feel safe to explore things and talk about more and more. I've asked him so many different times and different ways if he will think I'm filthy and disgusting and can't be touched. I've asked him if he will always think of what happened whenever he looks at me. Thankfully, he is an expert shame-buster and has been able to make me feel safe enough when I used to never ever think I could ever tell anyone. I don't know how he does it except that he must be gifted. Now it's just getting over the final hurdle of saying it out loud.

You're NOT alone... and you're not gross and you're not stupid. I promise. I still battle with those feelings of being dirty and disgusting, but it helps to replay over and over in my mind what my T has told me over and over and OVER again. That I am not to blame, that I had no control over what happened, that if I felt pleasure when it happened that it didn't mean I liked it or wanted it to happen, that it was a natural physical reaction and I had no control over it. And that he could never associate what happened to me as a representation of who I am as a person.

Sending hugs to you if you'd like.

thank you for the responses. i texted my T some of what i wrote here. about him thinking im gross, probably never hug me again, etc. he said oh my goshhhhhh stop! that is not true. i told him i feel like telling him every little disgusting detail so he will finally tell me im gross and then i can . he said it will be ok and just breathe and tell myself its temporary. i told him Ok. but honestly, i dunno...i wanna go to sleep for a very long time

I'm sorry you were abused like that by someone you went to for help. I'm glad you have found the therapist you're seeing now, he seems like a wonderful human being who really cares about you, which you definitely deserve.

I've only ever been abused verbally, but I understand shame. I was told for nearly three years in school, when I was a teenager, by almost every boy in my class (the girls bullied me as well, but they said other things). I hate looking at myself in the mirror, and at 27 I'm still a virgin because I feel so hideous I can't stand the idea of putting it out into the universe that I think anyone would ever find me attractive. I really don't want guys to look at me. I'm bisexual, and the idea of going out with another woman seems less frightening, though not enough to actively seek out dates or whatever, but a man? No way. Please don't even look at me. I know I'm unattractive. Just pretend I'm not here.

I understand wanting to sleep for a very long time. I have started doing this thing of rejecting days if I don't want them. If I wake up, and the very idea of existing seems unbearable, I just decide to reject that day. I declare it a non-day and go back to sleep. It's probably not the healthiest coping mechanism, but it seems better than many other alternatives.

Take care of yourself.

What articles. Can you link some? I learn/cope best with reason and rationale too.

I wish I had some saved, but I usually just google-scholared for a specific issue and read articles without saving anything.

The one exception is this textbook for counselors on adult clients with CSA histories. There's an entire chapter on shame, and an entire chapter on sexuality. I found it absolutely invaluable. The kindle edition is moderately expensive at $25.

Robot Check

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sorry. i know im gross. i wont post about it anymore

You are NOT gross. I think sometimes people just don't know what to say. I can't speak for everyone, but I know I chose not to comment immediately because I became so overwhelmed by anger at your ex-T I didn't know what to say that was about supporting YOU instead of expressing MY anger. I still don't really know what to say.

I think you should continue to share your story if you find it helpful. Everybody copes in their own way, and some people don't feel much of a need to talk, but I've personally found that shame has a tendency to fester in the dark; that unless exposed to light, to air, and to reason, it grows large and monstrous.

I don't think you're gross. I don't think you're to blame. As a matter of fact, I've always enjoyed your posts; you strike me as kind and good despite having endured what strikes me as one of the most cruel and evil betrayals imaginable.

I'm so sorry your T did this to you. It's terrible that he would abuse his power like that. You're not gross at all. Did your former T get in trouble after you told your pdoc about it?

i guess thats what bother me is that people dont know what to say. i knwo im being unreasonable about it. i wouldnt know what to say either honestly. also i fear that people dont believe me like im making it up or something. because thats what everyone said in my town when the news paper wrote an article about it. they didnt know my name i was patient X, but in the comments they all defended my former T saying i seduced him and wanted his money, he is such a good guy he would never do that., etc. maybe i am just making it seem worse than it was.

@ilikecats- yes after i told i was made to file a complaint and was investigated for 2 or 3 months. i had evidence of what went on bc of over 200 emails between me and former T.. they tried to investigate him but he wouldnt cooperate and he settled with them for revoking his therapy license forever

I have this book too and I have to say it's one of the best I have read and she also write one about shame which could help you too Junkdna

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JunkDNA,

As you know, something very similar happened to me.
I relate to just about all of your posts...I'm having the same feelings and reactions.
No, people don't know what to say. When my family found out about it an elder aunt asked me,



My mom said,



They just don't get it...they don't know what to say... Not only do I feel my own shame for allowing him to take advantage of me....I also have my family flinging shame on me. Even the police...I had to give my statement to the police and I could hear them guffawing in the next room. Even my attorney! My attorney's partner spoke to me a few times and said things like,


No one can understand....just those of us who are going through it...and few others.

I'm sorry you were taken advantage...and exploited. I really am. I wish I knew how to tell you to make it better. I'll just follow along on your thread and read other's advice.

my family never talks about it. my mom knows about the basics of what happened but doesnt know about the other people my former therapist took me to. we never talk about any of it which is pretty much expected. ive never talked about it to anyone but my T and recently i mentioned some things to my trauma group members. i am actually not allowed to talk about it unless its with a mental health professional because of some contract i signed. i wishi could post his name and everything.. i wish i could make a website warning everyone about him. stuff like that..but i cant.

theres so many things i keep inside me for so long, now that i have disclosed some of them to my T i cant turn off all the memories and emotions. i am trying to use my coping skills as best i can... one of my skills is posting on here. im sorry if i get hurt when people dont respond... maybe it is just that people dont knwo what to say.. i can understand that.

precaryous, yes i do know about your story and i am so sorry you went through the same thing. i feel like this kind of stuff is hidden from others and the dangers of this happened are not talked about enough. when i see people post about wanting to have sexual relations with their therapist it triggers me so much, but i also know its natural and theres nothing wrong with it. whats wrong is if the therapist reciprocates these feelings and desires. when my former T first told me about his feelings for me it felt awesome to be honest. finally someone loved me even though they knew every dark thing about me... it felt so relieving... i had wanted love from an older male for a long time since my dad died when right after my 10th birthday. but thats just it, i wanted love... i didnt want kinky sex. and when it quickly became more and mroe about that i didnt know how to leave. i needed this man so much, he fulfilled so many needs i had that i was deprived from and suppressed. i had no one else in my life at that time. it was just him who i talked to. i often found myself thinking how it would end. my former T said he wante dto be a part of my life forever. he said he hoped i never regretted it or resented him for it. he said he feared that this was because of my dad. um, duh

another part i am extremely ashamed of is that i knew he was married. i knew he had 2 kids. i knew he had a family and wife and kids that love dhim and here i am being a homewrecker. he got divorced after everything came to light. thats hard to deal with. with the thoughts that i ruined his life.

sometimes i am angry, i hate him and i hope he dies some slow tortuous death. i can acknowledge that he took advantage of me, groomed me for years starting at a young age, and exploited me.

sometimes i am angry at myself, that ruined his life. that i did seduce him in some way, brought it on myself. one night we were sitting on his couch in his office on opposite ends and our legs were intertwined. i asked him, "do you wish you never met me?" he said yes. ill always remember that. because it mad eme feel like it was me , it wa smy fault.

sorry im writing so much i dont have an outlet right now and i dotn wnat to do something unsafe

You didn't ruin his life. He ruined it himself, as well as hurting you. And it's not your fault at all. Don't blame yourself for what he did to you. And you don't have to apologize for writing so much. I'm glad you're getting support here instead of doing something unsafe.

Oh Junk, this is so sad. I'm so sorry that you went through that.
And, know that HE is the home wrecker, HE hurt his wife and children. He chose to groom, coerce and abuse a vulnerable patient.
I do understand that you feel guilty, but you have nothing to be guilty for. And, as you said above, lots of people actually do have feelings for their therapists, and come on to them etc. even if someone directly did that the therapist STILL has a moral obligation to keep the professional boundaries. I know you didn't come on to your T, but even if you had, he would still be the one at fault.
I hope that your new T will help you slowly work this through.
Hugs if you want them xxx

You're not gross. My impression of you is that you are a kind, funny, compassionate, and very strong person. Something horrible happened to you, and as a result of that you are carrying around a burden of shame that doesn't belong to you at all. My uni therapist is always telling me that, and constantly encourages me to be kind to myself. That's easier said than done, though.

I like to think of it as this really stupid metaphor: People always try to tell you to just let things go, but unfortunately you can't just abandon the burden and walk away. You have to take it to the same rubbish site you've taken everything else and dump it there, but because it's so heavy it's going to take a long time, and you are going to want to give up so many times you'll lose count. When you feel so worn out you don't think you can continue, you'll probably have to sit down until you can find the strength to stand back up and keep going. But however long it takes, you will get there eventually. If these were definite, concrete objects we could just destroy them, but they're not, and we'll only be able to see them for what they are when we reach our destination; until then they are disguised as something else, something that feels like the truth but isn't. Only by carrying the heavy burden all the way there, can we call its bluff and get rid of it.

Sometimes I just have to come up with stupid ***** like that to make myself feel better. Although it still sometimes makes me feel worse, go figure.

I'm glad he had his license revoked so he can't do this to someone else, but I think he should be behind bars for what he did to you. However, at least he didn't get away with it. You had to be very brave and strong to do what you did, it must have been so hard. I know this all sounds like waffle, but I really mean it: you have a lot to be proud of.

junkDNA,

You write as much as you want to or need to! PC is part of your support.
I hope that writing helps you work through some of the feelings.

I'm so sorry. Why are people like that to their own family members? Or ANYONE? My mother once told me that I must have done SOMETHING to deserve being bullied the way I was. I never felt like they were trying to understand what I'd had to suffer through. I never felt validated by them. It was like they were trying to find some "reasonable explanation" as to why I had been treated so badly by other people.

Why do people feel the need to shame and blame the victim? What do they get out of doing that? Does it serve a purpose? Does it help anyone? I will never understand.

My mum once told me it was my fault my sister was so vile to me- because I expected it.

The thing is - I really didn't! I always had hope my sister would change.

Why do people feel the need to shame and blame the victim? I think its because if they didn't, they would have to face up to their own failures and inadequacies.

And JunkDNA - You are not even vaguely gross, and please keep posting x