What does resolution of paternal/maternal transference mean?

So what I said in the last post would probably make more sense if I actually included my recent e-mails to MC (both sent Monday, no response yet, but that's not unusual--he sometimes takes a couple days):
"Hi MC,

Just going to jump right in here with a few post-session thoughts. I'm thinking I have some issues with object permanence regarding you. One random thing I liked about the old office is that, when I had sessions with T, we walked past your office, and if you had the door closed or open with the light on, I knew you were in that day and it was like, "Good, he still exists." Or if I saw your [color make of car] in the parking lot (I think you must be driving something different now because I haven't noticed it--God, now I probably sound like a stalker or something!) I had a similar reaction when H said he saw you Saturday, like this voice in my head going, "Yay, he still exists!" (Now I'm thinking of that commercial with Santa and the M&M guys...)

I wonder if that's part of the e-mailing thing, too? Not so much to get reassurance about our relationship or anything, but just to find out whether you're still breathing. For whatever reason, knowing you still exist in the world makes me feel more safe and secure.

I assume this all comes from a very young part of me. Like the part with separation anxiety (though I had issues with that at 12, too). To tie this back into today's session, this may be why I feel the need, if [daughter] is in her room upset, to let her know I'm still here, whether by calling up to her or actually going into her room. Which I guess is actually filling my need...

Stepping back a moment...why do I have so much trouble trusting that you exist if I don't get any hard evidence of it? I assume this goes back to unmet childhood needs, maybe? Or does it mean something bad happened to me way back when object permanence was supposed to become a thing, and I was so young that I don't remember it? So that part of my development went haywire?

And OK, I'm still kind of paranoid because of a comment you made a few months ago, when I talked about how you understood me. And I didn't want to lose that feeling of being understood, of feeling less alone in the world. And you made a comment about how, "Even if I die 3 months after you stop seeing me, that sense of being understood doesn't go away" (or something that). So I guess since you said that, this little part of my brain is like, "What if you have some terminal illness and that's why you worded it like that? Instead of just saying after we stop seeing you, that feeling will still be there?" (Please don't say, "Things are OK," because I now realize that's your general answer when things are very much NOT OK, but you don't want to go into it.)

So, there you go. Feel free to share any thoughts...Or at least to let me know you still exist!

Thanks,
LT"

Sent a few hours later:
"So, OK, there's all the object permanence stuff. But on a more basic level, it's that I often struggle with missing you between sessions. I sometimes start feeling sad when I see it's almost time to go because I know I won't see you for another week. Like today, I felt that way. And sometimes it's like I'm trying to squeeze in as much connection as I can in those last few minutes to hold me over to the next week. And then sometimes (not today) I end up crying on the way home because it's like I already miss you...

I feel like this sounds really pathetic, but there it is..."

Hi LT
I think this can be a tricky thing to navigate. I went through a long period of needing to know T was there.. Alive.. And okay. So i would text. And he would reassure me.. 99% of the time he would let men know, whether by joking he's a zombie or just simply telling me he's alive.. The problem was i needed it more and more.. Because i knew he would let me know.. I did need to know he was still there. But the need grew,, i think, in part because i got such an instant gratification that alleviated my obsessions and paranoia

I only communicate with my T in sessions now.. 2 hours out of every week.. It's a HUGE change but i do feel way less obsessed with him,, missing him. Wondering about him... Etc...

Just my own narrative

LT i must say you've done some really good work in this thread...

Lt--You are SO BRAVE!!! I applaud you.

So it seems that tapping into the emotions of my inner child regarding MC might be a good sign that I am in fact in the process of working through the transference? So I should keep exploring that instead of shying away?

I assume this all comes from a very young part of me. Like the part with separation anxiety (though I had issues with that at 12, too).

I'm thinking from some stuff I read on that site linked above, this is all inner child stuff coming out. And of course, what do I want to do?

But I think it's a pretty big step that I AM admitting that, right? That I'm showing that vulnerability? Because maybe that means I'm ready to move forward with working on my attachment/transference.

I think it's progress, too, and working through transference feelings. And vulnerability coinciding with that young part of you emerging. Not from a judgment perspective, but as a pattern person, I noticed a change from adult expressions of yourself to expressions from a really young place.

The adult more intellectualized; child parts raw. I remember when my child feelings emerged in session, it felt like I was unfrozen. Aside from the awful dissociative stuff, only thinking of the positive stuff here, I felt like it was like experiencing myself for the first time. It felt beautiful as it was unfolding, the love feelings in the relationship from my child parts. This was long ago.

Agree you're doing really good work and were brave.

ps maybe he's not responding right away to give you time to explore all this stuff, to give you space. If he responds right away, the exploration doesn't happen the same way. When he interjects, your focus changes from you to him. If he gives you space, you can work at processing and understanding feelings. Speaking of inner child, kind of like a parent who doesn't rush to interject each time so the child learns and grows.

Pps sorry, im scatterbrained. He said he wouldnt intentionally not answer.

I really respect the work you are doing.
I have a few thoughts.
One is that the relationship with your MC is not happening in a vacuum. Your husband is right there, yes, as it is marriage counseling?
Sometimes transference can operate as a distraction. Like, we obsess about the therapist so we don't think about other things....and in this context I wonder if you are making as much effort on understanding your dynamics with your husband as with your marriage counselor, and focusing as much on the inner life of your husband as your therapist.
The other thing....the "maybe I love her more than you"--that is very difficult and I am sorry for that.
But could your husband be getting a similar message, from you, about your marriage counselor?
If any off this seems off base, I apologize and mean no offense. I just know that I can get caught up in thinking about my relationship with my therapist and, while I do learn from that, I sometimes think I dwell on it instead of concentrating on the people in my life that I need to do relationship worth with.

I am a big advocate of working with the transference. It certainly has helped me understand a lot of "irrational" feelings and actions of mine.

But transference operates throughout our life, not just in the therapy room towards therapists. I'm guessing you may have strong transference reactions to your husband. Who is he, in the transference? If you have "snippy" feelings towards your spouse, what could be the origin of those feelings, if you looked at it from a transference perspective? And what if you were as interested in thinking about and analyzing reactions to your husband, from a transference perspective, as you are the transference with your marriage counselor?

I know, personally, that in my own marriage counseling, I had moments of conflict where I was reacting in a transference way, strongly, to both my husband and the marriage counselor. Both of them, in my mind, were replicating transference roles from the past, ones that had been linked together in the past and now were once again, in my mind, coming to life in the here-and-now of the therapy room.

I don't know you, obviously, and there's so much about your life and relationships I don't know. But what sticks out to me is that, in your early life, there was a triad (you, mother, dad) and you felt excluded (secrets, etc., your dad's hurtful comment).

Now there's another triad. What role could you be playing now? What role could your husband be playing?

Transference can be so tricky. As we re-enact the past there can be what someone called a dizzying constellation of transference reactions, where people take on this role and that one as we try to exert control over what were once uncontrollable events. I know, from my own therapy, it is relatively easy to understand when I am playing the child-like victim in the transference, the one who feels abandoned and needs love and care. It's a whole lot harder for me to see when I can be taking on the persecutor role in the transference and treating other people in the same way that people once treated me. Nobody likes to see themselves that way.

I'm not saying that's the case for you--I don't know you! And I hope you don't take any offense. I know you from all your posts to be very thoughtful and so I hope you can take this in the spirit that it's meant, just some thoughts on transference in therapy and relationships from someone who has struggled (and is struggling) with all that herself.

I guess I wasn't clear. I was thinking that in the triad, MC would be in your father's role, you would be your mother's role, and H would be in the role that *you* were as a child.

In other words, this time around, H would be the excluded one. And this time, you'd have the satisfaction of being the one with the special relationship with your "dad."

But, you know, I think everyone we know can play myriad transference roles in our minds....

Oh, I see...though, I could also still put H in my mom's role, only in this case, my "dad" loves me more than he does my "mom." Which would also leave H left out, but would fit better with my childhood stuff. Plus the typical Freudian stuff about little girls vying with their mom for their dad's affections and such.

Yes, but in this configuration that you suggest, it would be MC, and not you, would be the one telling H (aka childhood you) "maybe I love her more than you." This is what I meant when I said it can be hard for us to see, often, when we take on the role of someone who hurt us.

Resurrecting this thread because two different definitions of "resolving transference" turned up in T and then MC sessions this week. On Monday, I was talking to T about what I thought it meant to resolve transference. What I came up with was, "Resolving it would mean I just saw MC as a "nice man who cares about me and is helping/has helped me." T seemed to agree with that one. So basically, seeing him as just a T/my marriage counselor, nothing more, not as the person who holds the power to "fix me." And not being so incredibly attached to him.

So then I mentioned that to MC in session, and he disagreed with that definition.
He said he thought resolving transference was more about understanding what schemas (i.e., messages in my head about certain categories of people, like male authority figures) play into my reaction to him. That it's not necessarily going to make those schemas go away. But it's about being aware of them and accepting them rather than avoiding them. He said there can be fear and shame in facing them, and I agreed with that. He then said they were like "emotional warts."

With T agreeing with my initial assessment and MC having his own definition, it's a little confusing. Because what he said makes sense, too. He was also emphasizing that I may not be able to get rid of all those attachment feelings, but it's more learning to accept them and seeing them for what they are. I guess that's more feasible than expecting to just see MC as a regular person and letting go of all my attachment to him.

Though I can see how his explanation works with some of the fears about him, like fear of abandonment, etc. But I'm not sure how it works with the more positive things I associate with him. Because in many ways, he's countering my schemas from childhood--by accepting me as I am, for example. And for not rejecting me or acting frustrated or angry with me for asking for too much or doing something like Googling him/his wife.

So I think next session I'll ask him how that aspect fits into his explanation of what it means to "resolve" transference/attachment.