Couch 179: Even-numbered days in a year

In my case I really think it is the more I think about it.

Agree with manatee. I think "I don't care" and "whatever" are rather hostile. It doesn't mean that the husbands are necessarily irritated at you going to do something, but that they are irritable seems quite obvious. And what's wrong with just saying "ok" or "alright" unless you are consciously or subconsciously trying to communicate your unhappiness? I understand that it's tempting to want to believe that your perception was the issue, but from the outside looking in, an exchange where one partner responds to the other with "I don't care" or "whatever" feels hostile and disrespectful. Please don't allow your Hs to gaslight you into thinking they weren't being unpleasant, because they were.

I agree that “I don’t care” is rude. (My parents forbade the phrase when we were growing up.) But I don’t think it necessarily means “I don’t care *about you*,” which I thought was what art was identifying as projection.

Yes, that I was.

But what are you saying when you say you are going to do something for yourself? If you say, im going grocery shopping, then its for the both of you - us meaning him, so he has an interest. But unless it is established beforehand that he has as large an interest in you doing stuff for yourself as he has in you doing stuff for him or us, then you are trying to glean that information from these little hints, these little breadcrumbs, and thats not the way to do it.

If by the breadcrumbs he PROVES he acts one way but SAYS he supports you, then okay, its meaningful to reopen a dialogue, but breadcrumbs arent a dialogue.

Omg the city inspector came by this morning and the apartment was a complete disaster. The Titanic looked better before it went down. Not even kidding.

But geez i work so hard then i feel like im gonna collapse. But i feel like im getting stronger. I am doing more every day. My favorite maintenance guy accompanied the inspector, so i was like, "gee i gambled on you guys not being here today, i guess i gambled and lost."

The bathroom looked great, the kitchen was pretty good, just the rest was a disaster. Im so tired. And hungry. I need my refrigerator to start working. Woman does not live by canned food alone.

Yes, exactly, this is what I would have wanted him to say. Like, "I've got [daughter], you have fun and relax for a bit!" Especially as I had D by myself for a big chunk of Saturday.

Thanks, that helps to hear. When I was like, "are you sure it's OK?" he even put it on two lines:
"What
Ever."
Which seemed more hostile to me in a way. And then I was irritated with him, which made me more determined to do my own thing. Which I suppose is actually progress for me, as in the past maybe I'd have just been like, "OK, I'm sorry, I'll just come home..." But this was just like, "You said 'whatever' so I'm taking you at your word and doing 'whatever.'" Which is something T has been trying to get across to me. Like, for example, if I think H might be mad at me, and I ask him once, and he says no--if he is actually mad at me, then that's on him, not me. Because I gave him the chance to say it, and he didn't.


I meant to bring this up with T today, but we had plenty of other stuff to discuss (and it was quite productive, I think).

Wow I feel like a terrible human. I say I don't care and whatever often. I never mean them with any kind of anger or annoyance. It's just me being very indecisive for one and also, growing up, my parents and siblings etc always said these things to each other, to me, its normal.

My former best friend and I used to do that all the time "What movie do you wanna see?" "I don't know, whatever" Then we would kinda do that back and forth a bit and eventually are on it. I've never thought that much into those two phrases to see them as so negative.

Wow, I missed a lot of the couch since I wasn't online really for three days. Went to an amusement park and then just was really busy this weekend. I think I'm caught up though. I wish it would be more "autumn-like" here. It's still hot. It won't get cold until Halloween--which as a holiday I don't like either. I do like Groundhog day, probably because I like the movie. I bought some expensive (to me) tea online for a tea party I'm having in October. It's a french company and I can't wait to try it. I bought some Kusmi Tea online on Amazon already and it was amazing, but this looks pretty good too. I'm totally blowing my budget on tea but that's okay. Hugs all around to whomever wants one.

I say I don't care a lot too. I'm on the Autism spectrum so when someone asks me something it's really hard for me to think of something else besides I don't care because I usually don't have an opinion. But I've been told numerous times that its rude. I try not to say it. Its just hard.

I think it depends on context. If you can't decide what movie to see "I don't care" isn't aimed at anyone, it's just an expression that you don't mind either way. When someone says "I don't care" in response to something someone has decided to do, it says "I'm not interested in what you are saying" as opposed to "I can't decide".

That's a good point.

Agreed--I was trying to figure out how to explain the difference, but you managed it quite well! Like if I say, "Is it OK if I do x?" it's different from "What do you want for dinner?" Like if I ask H what he wants for dinner, and he says "I don't care" or "whatever," that's fine. If I said, "My T offered me an extra session this week, OK if I go?" and he said "Whatever," that would feel very different. (not the case this week, incidentally, just trying to think of a different example.)

You aren't a terrible human! And fwiw, I probably wouldn't have been bothered by an "I don't care" or "whatever" in the example you gave, depending on the tone. The Artie and LT examples are quite different. The alternative responses manatee and I mentioned demonstrate that these are different situations. You couldn't have said "sure," "ok," or "sounds good." You could maybe have said "I don't know," but I don't think it's a big deal. In your situation, you are talking about a fun activity you and a friend are going to do, so there is an implicit assumption that you are not negatively inclined. If your tone is disinterested and irritated, it might appear that you are passive aggressively trying to say you don't want to go, but otherwise, I see nothing wrong with what you said. On the other hand, if you and your friend were roommates, and she told you she was going to the store, and you responded with, "I don't care," or "whatever," I would consider that rude.

Could you say, "I don't have an opinion/preference" instead?

I just totally screwed up at work on this high-visibility project. Went deer in the headlights. Ugh. Now I'm at lunch.

That's a good idea. I will have to practice that.

(((ArtieSwimsOn)))

I guess this is one area my new-found sense of self is not helping. I am not used to screwing up that glaringly at work. Although I didn't actually cry, there is that. I stuck with it and did the best I could do instead of crying and completely blowing it.

That happens constantly in my family. Like I said, it's all I've been raised to know, I've never thought of it as bad or rude, just normal to me. The problem too is in texts and such you can't really read tone or intent.... (one reason my T and I don't email anymore)

The thing is, In most cases I truly don't care what someone else is doing. if they are old enough to make their own choices, then do what you want. You don't need my permission or to run it by me. Maybe this is why I never keep friends, I'm rude when I think I'm just normal or kind... so hard to keep up with whats right or wrong in the world

That is what you should have done. I don’t see the problem.

Also I have no idea what you personally mean by “sense of self,” but the way I think of it, it doesn’t prevent mistakes. It might help one learn from them, depending on the sense of self.

I love October because it's my birthday and Halloween in the same month.

Well, yeah, I mean I don't really care, either, but people don't generally say every thought that's in their head. I guess I probably watch too many true crime tv shows, but when I tell someone where I'm going, it's not me running it by them or asking permission. I'm telling them so if I go missing or worse, end up dead in a ditch, they know where I was heading and have a better idea of when to become alarmed if I don't return and they can't get in contact with me. With a partner, I would tell them because that's just a considerate thing to do for someone you share your life with.

OMG, OMG, OMG!!!!!! My ex-Pdoc just called me!!!!!! I wrote a letter to her and gave it to my Pdoc to send to her. I was worried she wouldn't send it, and that ex-Pdoc wouldn't respond even if she got it. But she did respond! I am so so happy right now. Over the moon!!!!!