Totally new and really confused.

I think you just need to know what you expect out of the relationship and what he expects out of it.

It would probably help you to have a heart to heart with him and establish where the relationship will be heading in the future.

Rio,

You can do what you choose, you know the choice is yours. However you came here seeking advice, stating that you were not happy, that you hate being someones option, and the you are not getting what you need. So how would we / should we respond ? If you are happier than you have ever been or ever want to be, why are you here ?

You can think age isn't a factor all you want. When we are talking adults to youth tho, age is a factor indeed. I'm not going to pretend it isn't. You might be 18 now, but you were only 16 when this older man appeared in your life. A 16 year old is not an adult, no matter how much they have been through. Experience does not equal a fully developed adult brain, some important brain processes are not even fully developed until we are around 25.

Not everyone is abusive. Because people do not always respond the way we want does not equal abusive. Not everyone acts in their own best interest with disregard for others interests. Abuse is defined as any action that intentionally harms or injures another person. Do you really believe that everyone intentionally chooses to hurt others.

Empathy has limits on understanding something fully. Empathy only gives us the capacity to understand to an extent. I really don't think you can understand what real love is, or healthy relationships are based on empathy alone.

Telling him you love him if you don't? I'm confused, you said 100% that you do. Again, no, trying to get emotional needs met, from someone you love, umm not abuse. Using manipulation, and your mental issues to try to control him ? YES abuse. Do you want to be like this?

Open eyes is not using your age against you, she is using it for what it is. And it is young. It is what it is. Not a bad thing either. His using your age is very much different than what Open Eyes is doing. That's pretty obvious.

Some people strive for truth. Not everyone is dishonest, or omits truths. While of coarse everyone is going to stumble with this, there are people out there who truly strive to live to their truth. You seem to have a very negative view of life and people, if you think everyone is dishonest and abusive.

Anyways, only you can decide what is right or wrong for you. I just have a feeling you would not be here at all if you really felt right with this. The fact that you needed to ask if him liking you hurting yourself was normal, shows that you lack an understanding of what healthy loving behavior is, and that you yourself were not comfortable with that.

I could not in good conscience tell you that all this is ok, even if it is what you want to hear. Some others might be able to, but I cannot, given all that you have said.

I do wish you good luck with this and your life, I do truly hope that happiness is what you achieve in the end.

Rio, I was not using your age against you, I was using your age FOR you. And, you didn't mention that you WERE attending college, working on yourself as well. If you are, that is great.

Ultimately the choice is yours Rio, you asked for advice and I gave you the advice I would give my own daughter (whom I love and care about very much).

None of us are therapists and pretty much all the members I know are interested in doing whatever they can to either recover from some kind of abuse, or to better deal with whatever they are experiencing as far as some kind of disorder etc. But the main goal is self improvement of some kind.

I just gave you advice based on my own life experiences as well as observing the paths that others have taken where they admitted, it could have been a better choice somehow.

However, the ultimate choice, is YOURS. You actually got a lot of feedback to ponder in your thread.

Open Eyes

"Can't anyone tell me how to just improve my relationship? How to stop my mental problems from screwing everything up all the time?"

Rio, I doubt any of us here can tell you how to improve your relationship. We aren't professionals and can only direct you towards finding a licensed counselor. They are trained to help you understand why you think your mental problems screw everything up.

"I'm not going to live my life worrying about whether or not something is right if it's something that makes me happy. "

That defiant phrase from someone your age is very familiar to me. Heard it plenty of times in my life (as I am old enough to be your mother). Someone I know well used it many times. That person is about 10 years older than you and is now in a place he/she never imagined she/he would be at your age. And it isn't a nice place.

I was once the other woman. The man kept saying he wasn't in love with his wife but yet he stayed with her.

Do you want children,a home, and be a family. You won't get this because the guy isn't going to leave his wife for you.

You will be alone during the holidays because he's going to spend it with his wife not you...

You always be the other woman. No rights to the guy because his wife will rule him.

Think about all of this. He's too old for you. He basically could go to prison for rape of a child.

That's going a bit far..He couldn't go to prison for statutory rape.

I don't expect or particularly want to spend the holidays with him or get married to him/have kids with him..I'm not going to stay with him forever, I never planned to. But I am in a relationship with him right now which means it's a big part of my life.

I may sound idealistic at times and I'm aware that I wont always be..However I will not allow time and percieved wisdom with age allow me to be realistic all the time. I'm trying to resist emotional death here.

It started as sex, we were just f*****g and having fun. The problems came when we started getting more emotionally involved.

I never tried to paint myself as a victim here, I was genuinely confused about some stuff..But I'm being talked to as a victim of...something. Which I think says more about what society thinks of women rather than what I think of myself. Everyone assumed I'm a victim of him being emotionally abusive.

I'm not defending anything he may or may not have done wrong. And the advice everyone has given has been genuine and caring. But I don't feel like you're really understanding what I'm saying. I don't think anyone is being abused here..Why hasn't anyone considered that I went into this relationship wanting to get MY sexual needs met? Because that's all it was, WE developed feelings. He mentioned it first actually and there's no need to because he was already getting what he wanted sexually. It's not like he said I love you to get me into bed because I was already screwing him.

I dont want him all to myself. I have other guys and girls I see sexually. But he's the only person I have STRONG romantic feelings for.

If I hadn't of met him I would've been dead either by own hand or by my ex boyfriend's...No, this doesn't make me feel obligated to do anything for him. He didn't know he was my lifeline out of that.

If you go back and read through your own posts here, you will see the inconsistencies in what you say. Then you might understand why you have been given the advice you have been given.

Be well.

Yes, there are inconsistencies..But I've spoken to him and I've realised I'm making it more of a problem than it actually is.

I'm speaking of inconsistencies such as ..

"Yes, this hurts because I wish I could have him all to myself. It makes me feel like I'm not enough to make him happy."

and

"I don't want him all to myself."

It's confusing for sure.

People here were truly trying to help you from the information given from yourself. This says nothing about what society thinks of women. Putting thought and making these posts takes time. Time that total strangers have been willing to give you freely. I don't think saying that about the posters here is fair. You were the one asking why everyone hates you, what's wrong with you that they are never happy with you ect. Seems to me that would imply something along the lines of being the victim of something.

Like you, I and others have said, the choice is yours. There is no reason to get upset with the posters, when you asked for genuine, logical advice. That is what you have been given. And much more than most threads here.

Thankyou everyone that took the time to help.

But itturns out I'm a lost cause, sorry to waste your time.

Rio, none of us here really know you, but what we do know it what we experienced and felt at your age, along with the mistakes that we ourselves made and what we all learned from our mistakes.

From the way you articulate here, it is clear that you are not stupid Rio, and there is a kind of maturity that you express that is not so typical for your age. So, the good part is that your smart.

Lost cause?, Oh, it is too early in your life to conclude that Rio. Gee, I remember when I was 18, I was not at all the person I am now. And your going to change and grow too. It is just too early to say that your a lost cause, because you honestly have the blessing of years ahead of you to develope a better sense of yourself.

I think that it is good that you found a way out of a time in your life where you had so little self worth and possible inner anger that you were hurting yourself and maybe even allowing others to hurt you in some ways. You say this man changed your direction and you began to have some hope and direction, some positive feelings. It is not this man alone that has done that for you, you did get away from abuse and you also gave yourself PERMISSION to feel better about yourself. So what you gained in all that is a knowing that you CAN develope a better feeling and opinion about yourself.

When I think about your initial question, what I like about it is that it shows that you are looking/considering the next level of establishing "self worth". That is Good Rio, your growing in a better direction. And when I read your replies here, what I see is that you are weighing and balancing this experience and what it really means to you and if it is allowing you to continue in a forward direction of establishing more sense of self worth, self empowerment and some freedom from your past experiences. And Rio, that is what we all do in life, we all try to somehow progress and move forward and learn from whatever we experience.

Actually Rio, I can see by reading in between the lines, that what your defending is something within this relationship adds to your sense of personal worth or well being. And that is a part of a learning process that takes place when young people date and experience different kinds of personal relationships. As you find certain things within a person that you actually like, then you can make a mental note of it and recognize that there is something valuable learned.

I am getting a picture of a young woman that IS trying to take steps to educate herself and also learn about relationships. But I don't think your truely ready to jump on the Marriage Wagon and have a family. And there is nothing wrong with that at all Rio. Your still young yet and there is plenty of time for that down the road, that is if you even want that path, because not everyone wants that.

Saying your a lost cause is just too premature Rio, because you have so much learning ahead of you yet. I think that right now your just debating this relationship for what it really means to you and your life and what you enjoy about it. What you need to consider it not that your some kind of lost cause, but that you have genuine questions, healthy questions and your actually intelligent enough to ask questions to allow yourself to possibly get a better bearing on your own decision making. That is not a lost cause Rio. All your really doing at this point is your stopping and evaluating, that is a good sign. If you were a lost cause, you would not be doing that at all.

The people that have come forward to give you their oppinion based on the information you have presented are only trying to help you GAIN A BETTER SENSE OF PERSONAL VALUE. No one here wants you to walk away feeling your a lost cause Rio. This thread of yours gives you a chance to simply further your own personal bearing on how your going to view this paticular relationship, that is all.

Personally what I have learned by coming to PC and posting and asking questions, is I think about how I respond to different questions or posts here. Sometimes I get upset, sometimes I post and feel better because I somehow validate my opinion on something. And if I get upset?, I have learned that what that does if give me an opportunity to comtemplate why I get upset. And this type of interacting has presented me a lot of ways to actually learn about myself. It is good because I can review how I respond and what that might mean to me about how I am looking at certain situations in my life. And I begin to question how I might improve or progress to a different, more productive way to look at things.

I know your a new member Rio, I want you to feel welcome and to understand that this question is just being given some different thoughts.
Your not being judged really. This thread can be an opportunity for you to simply consider where you are at the moment. And, your not a lost cause Rio. I hope you will continue to interact and learn. And that is what most of the members here are doing. We are all trying to support each other, and we all know we are not perfect.

Open Eyes

I'm sorry if this is harsh but he is a pig, an abuser and being as he got with you before you were an adult a pedophile . I myself have been in emotionally abusive relationships and he is up there at the top. No one should take please out of someone elses pain. My current boyfriend knows my secret places I cut sometimes and it's the first thing he checks to be sure I HAVENT hurt myself, also I'm anorexic and he tries to find positive ways to get me to eat without being negative or corrosive or rude. I was my fathers pride and joy and he just passed away and I'm crushed but I'm actually dating a guy 3 years younger. I've done the older thing and if they treat you the way they are your more mature than them!

Hi Rio,
You might find some help & advice here:
http://www.adultchildren.org/lit/Laundry_List.php
(can apply to alcohol, or other dysfunction like mental illness or emotional abuse etc)
I can relate to a lot of what you said.
Supportive thoughts.

Elana

I do have pretty severe abandonment issues..I also don't fully trust men. I figure if my father could just walk away from me why would any other man stick around?

When I first met him I said I was 19, so it isn't really his fault. People also forget that in terms of sexual desirability women are at the peak of it to men when they're 15. Ancient and uncontrollable instinct.

The cutting thing may not be right, but he recognises it as a genuine coping mechanism, some people have a glass of wine after a long day, I cut. I also recognise it as such and I dont think it's a bad thing to do.

I dont know how to handle this. Honestly at the moment I'd rather just bury my head in the sand.

((((Rio))))

It took courage to present the question, many members do realize that and that is why so many shared their toughts.

"I dont know how to handle this. Honestly at the moment I'd rather just bury my head in the sand. "quote Rio

I am sure there are many here that can say they felt the same at sometime in their lives too, I know I can. So your not alone, and you CAN get to a point where you will feel better in time.

I figure "if my father could just walk away from me why would any other man stick around?"

This is not because you were not worthy, this is because he didn't respect anyone enough to stick around. He was being selfish. You cannot base all men on just one man Rio. It was nothing wrong with you that your father abandoned, not your fault or that you were unworthy in any way.

((((Hugs)))))
Open Eyes

But my father is inevitably what I will ALWAYS base men on. As parents are for every child..He left when I was 16 so it was a long time of seeing men being a certain way.

I know it was nothing to do with me, but after he left he couldn't be bothered to maintain a relationship with me and still can't.

Rio,

I can totally understand that. My father left when I was 13, and never looked back, my mother kicked me out at 14 and she moved to Saudi Arabia, left me in Canada, alone, and on the streets, literally.

Basing men on what your father does is not inevitable, unless you want it to be. The good thing about perceptions is that we have the ability to change them.

I cannot base my perception of women or men on my parents, because these are only 2 people out of 7 billion. Scientifically this would not be an acceptable predictor.

I cannot do it also because if I did, I would be alone forever, I mean if the 2 people who were supposed to love me and care for me both did this to me. Why should I think I have any value at all ? To any one else ? It would be like a death sentence. It's distorted thinking, is it true? No it's not true.

Even harder when you have had not one man, but more treat you badly ( your ex ), now we are stacking up evidence, that proves our perception of men right. You and me both have experienced that. That trust in men is very hard to regain. And granted should not be given freely to any man. But you don't want it to control you either, you want to take control. You also don't want to self fulfill these prophesies.

I think the only way to get there is healing old wounds, working on our perceptions, and building a solid relationship with ourselves. The hard and scary part for most of us, because it requires that we ourselves must change, change is hard, hardest thing we ever have to do. Changing our perceptions, Whoa, mega hard! In the end sooo worth it tho, and all it takes is motivation, whatever that motivation might be. If you want to.

As for the human instinct thing, my bf would not want a 15 year old. Humans have lost a lot of our instincts, because we do not live in conditions or environments where we actually need to rely on them. We also have great self control. But this made me curious, and I am only posing this out of curiosity, if that instinct for 15 year olds still holds true, what would it mean for women then? Wouldn't the men be more desirable younger and not older? Say maybe in their 20's when they are fit, in their sexual prime and potent ?

I think it's because men can smell the pheromones of a woman newly entered into puberty, meaning she's probably a virgin and therefore is ''unowned'' I learnt about it in my A level psych class..The younger the woman, the more years you have to have more babies with her basically. Didn't Roman Polanski say 'everyone wants to **** 13 year old girls'? Most men probably wouldn't admit to finding a 15 or 16 year old sexually attractive, but they do. Not that they see them as relationship material, but on a purely sexual, animal level they do.

The issue with trusting men is confusing because I trust this man more than any others..

I understand that this isn't going to get better overnight, but the work it's going to take well, I just dont have it in me to do..Some days I can't even feed myself because I'm so depressed let alone work on seeing myself and others differently.

Roman Polanski a known pedophlie. Who openly appologized and said that for 33 years he regretted what he did. A film maker, not someone I would put a lot of stock into. Sorry not ALL men feel that way. I was asking about women and what would naturally be desirable to them when it comes to men?

Everyone has to start somewhere Rio, if you are that depressed that you are neglecting something vital to be alive, like eating... Then wouldn't it be time. I have Bipolar, I know depression well, it can eat you alive if you don't fight back. And you're worth fighting for, don't you think?

Oh, well to women older men mean protection and food, a young man doesn't have the enough hunting experience to bring home food, or enough social standing to have people not try to take your food/home.

I dont think I am..I cant be bothered to fight for my well being..I'm just really exhausted and I'm sick and tired of always being sick and tired.

A young man is vital, healthy, strong, potent to makes babies, procreating is not only an instinct of the male species. A 20 year old male would have been plenty of experienced to be a hunter and gatherer, he would have started learning skills very young. Life span would have been a lot shorter and a 40 year old man would have been near then end of the line. That's my opinion.

There is a really good saying... " If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you always got, and you'll always feel what you always felt "

At some point I guess, you will hopefully get sick and tired enough of being sick and tired of being sick and tired. See it's the same thing over and over, and until you do something that will just keep playing on repeat.

Depression speaks loudly and it lies to us. Is it you talking about yourself, or is it depression lying to you? Depression tells you lies about other people too “You’re so unimportant that no one cares.” And depression lies to us by using absolutes that are not "absolutely true." An absolute is a word like: always, never, nothing, nobody, everyone, everything…

You're smart, you know what we're saying, Just no one wants to see you continue to be depressed, not feeling any worth. Strangers on the internet can even see you have worth, I wish you could see it too. We can't make you see it though, trust me I would if I could. You are young, smart, you obviously have creativity, and I am sure a whole slew of other good qualities, you have your whole life ahead of you still.



Anyways just something to think about.

Okay well I dont claim to be an expert, I'm just saying what I've read and heard.

I feel 1,000,000 times better in terms of self esteem and self worth compared to even a year ago. He doesn't put me down, tell me I'm stupid or ugly or that I can't do things. Okay so he doesn't exactly say I'm NOT these things but he just presumes I'm confident enough to not need to hear it, which 8 out of 10 times is true.

I think it is depression and BPD that ''talk'' to me, yeah. But it's more stuff like 'no-one could possibly love you' or 'you're damaged goods'.

Makes much sense. BDP and depression are pretty good at that.

No one is damaged goods tho, we are not merchandise. No one escapes the process of life without some hurt, or being banged up a bit or a lot. I don't know if you or any of us will feel that we are cappibale of being, or feel like we will truly be loved until we love ourselves. I know that sounds cheesy. But I mean really love ourselves, not just confideance. Love ourselves, including acceptance of ones self, patience, caring, appreciation...

I'm not talking about the man anymore, just about you. And only about what you are saying. Cause either way, with him without him, what you are dealing with personally is important.

I think I should probably go back to therapy..But last time they tried to give me CBT and I don't really believe in it.

Thankyou everyone for your time and patience.