[SquirrellyBrain]

So I have been with this man for 12 years. We fell in love fast and hard. The passion was immense and I was so infatuated with him. He was everything I ever wanted. We had dreams. Dreams that were coming true 1 by 1. In 2009 we married. Today we have a 22 month old beautiful child whom we both adore. But last January, the love of my life slept with another woman.

This was a 1 time affair that I caught 3 days after it happened. He has had no contact with her, removed himself from social media, and allows me to look in his phone when I want. I have no suspicions that he has any intentions of doing this again. It was a one drunk night at the bar incident. He no longer goes out to bars without me. He has been doing anything I ask this whole last year. But still I feel like we are falling apart. Our intimacy is fading. He doesn't really openly communicate with me about things going on in his life, his work, his wants.. nothing. I don't think I'd know anything about him if I didn't always ask about his day, ect. ect.

I have been to therapy, I have been to church, I have talked to my man about my expectations of a marriage. I have talked about my hurt and anxiety. I just think he has nothing more to say than "I'm sorry. It meant nothing. I was in a bad place in my mind. It won't happen again."

I miss us! I miss having fun with him. I wonder if he's only trying to make it work because of our child, or if he truly is IN love with me. There is no doubt he loves me. I know that. He has been here holding my hand through surgery. He helped me through my very bad pregnancy and many other times I needed him the most. I just feel like a piece of us is missing now and SHE has it. I hate that I can't get the images of those text messages describing the details of his sexual encounter out of my head. I want it to go away so we an be back to us. Will it ever be better or am I trying to hold onto something that is completely lost? I feel like after a year I should be past this since I chose to come back home and forgive him. But I really don't know if he is even happy here with me. His child makes him happy. I see that in the way he cares for her. But for us, I feel like it's all fallen apart.

[CANDC]

Sorry cheatedon you are in distress about your situation. Sounds like a therapist might be needed to help sort things out even though you said you tried.

Maybe expectations are what makes this so painful. If we can find out what the expectations are and work at dropping them, a new perspective could emerge.

[hamster-bamster]

Ch,

I have observed this a lot by reading this board, almost every time I log on. The party that slept with another person outside of marriage offers the other party (you, in your case) what is dubbed "transparency". You are describing transparency when you say that he allows you to check his phone.

In what role does that transparency put you?

In the role of a school teacher. "Did you do your homework?"

At the same time you want the relationship as it was before the incident (you are incorrect in calling it "affair" since affairs have at least some duration - you can call it an incident of infidelity but not an affair).

So before the incident you did not play the role of a school teacher.

And the husband did not play the role of mischievous child who is trying to prove that he would not go into mischief again.

Before the incident you were lovers.

A strict school teacher who checks homework and reprimands and a child trying to prove that he would not be mischievous again (that is your H doing everything you ask for a year) cannot be lovers in the traditional sense of the word.

It is either or - mutually exclusive. That is why he does not open up to you about his life - it is no longer his role to do so. In his new role of a formerly mischievous child trying to prove his continuous innocence in the present time, he is not supposed to share his dreams and hardships with the teacher who micromanages him. It is just not his role. He has a new role and he plays it well. Until you tell him to stop playing this role, he won't change. Even your telling him not to play that role would be fairly ineffective. the only effective move is for you to stop playing the role of a stern teacher, and the rest will follow.

You said that you do not have any suspicions, so why haven't you told him so and said that you would no longer check his phone?

That he does not go to bars without you is rational, since the incident happened after a night at the bar.

That you still check his phone is not reasonable. This sentence is completely unreasonable: "I just feel like a piece of us is missing now and SHE has it."

How would she have that piece? you described the beginning of your relationship with this man very vividly and eloquently. In your words, " We fell in love fast and hard. The passion was immense".

OK, what do we know about her?
- that it was a drunken night
- that he did not have any trouble deleting her from social networks and staying out of touch.

OK, let us keep going. If a man feels immense passion for a woman, would he so easily drop her? Just like that?

So it was not immense passion or love hard and fast. Then why do you think that that woman has what you had? She does not. What happened was a very substantial shift in roles. That is why that piece is missing.

So I would keep only one of those new rules - no bar nights without you - because it is reasonable. If there is a problem that can be traced to a trigger - alcohol at a bar in this case - eliminating that trigger to prevent repeats of the problem is reasonable. Everything else that you have been doing needs to be gradually stopped. By that I mean:

- try to return to the pre-incident percentage of completed requests. You said that now, and for that whole year since the incident, he has been doing everything you ask. I got the impression that he is making a special effort. That before the incident he would sometimes do what you ask and sometimes wouldn't. This is how it is in run-of-the-mill couples where people behave normally without trying to be on their behavior because they feel guilty.

Obviously, you did not use project management software before the incident to record the tasks you asked him to complete, so you cannot whip up a graph of how his percentage of performance was before the incident, , but try going down the memory lane and determine, roughly, what the percentage was. Say, for the purposes of this exercise, that it was 80%. You won't tell him to complete 80% of the requests from now on, but you can, on your own, do him little favors. Say, you asked him to pick up dry cleaning but 10 minutes later you can say: "You know what, I have rearranged my schedule and I will pick up the dry cleaning. Why don't you just relax at home with the child who'll be so happy to see you come home early."

An even better example would not involve the child but involve something that you know he likes.

A small thoughtful and unexpected gift would be nice. Now is not the season for unexpected gifts, but maybe later. Playfulness, more laughter, etc. would be helpful. I do not know what words you used to refer to the incident when talking to him; as I said above, I would NOT NOT NOT call it an affair. Call it "incident" or "history".

As for the texts describing their sexual encounter, that is the most easily solvable problem since your child is not a reader yet. Print those texts in the largest font, make the letters bold, and plaster the printout sheets all over the walls of your bedroom. In a week you would not even care. When you are trying to forget those texts, you are only boosting how fresh the memory of them is in your mind. Trying to forget is counterproductive.

In a household with big children this method would not work, but in your household you do not have any need to protect the child from knowing too much.

You can print the texts in different colors on different days, mix them up, get creative. You can also later peel the printouts off the walls, place them in your biggest metal or glass bowl, take it outside and... use a lighted match. I recommend designating a bowl to serve as an urn for painful memories because you would not want to have several bowls with blackened marks that burned paper might leave.

I wish you luck and recommend that you move swiftly, without prolonging the agony.

[SquirrellyBrain]

Thanks for the responses. You bring up some good points for me to work on. I haven't looked at his messages in months or asked him about it. I do need to work on being more encouraging to him. His ego seems fragile. I try to tell him he looks great when he cleans himself up and thank him when he does stuff like cleaning the house. He seems unresponsive to me. Like my opinion does not matter to him anyway. He has no idea my mind still circles around all of this actually. We have not talked about the incident in a very long time. I just want him to love me like he did before, tell me I am beautiful, and have desire to be around me in and out of the bedroom. I often feel he is only here with me because of the child. We try date nights and neither of us really has much fun anymore. I want to have fun. I miss the days we could talk. I miss the days we would go out and laugh and play together. I have grown so much in the last 12 years. I am not that same 19 year old girl he met and fell in love with, and it worries me he doesn't like the 32 year old strong-willed, working mother that I have become. He says the cheating was solely about him and his selfish desires to boost his ego at a time when he was without work and I was supporting everything, but how am I to believe that. I would never go sleep with someone just because I didn't like myself. It's so complicated. Being married and staying in love after infidelity is one of the hardest things I have ever faced. I feel like while I have been and can work more on forgiveness, I will never really be able to forget. Especially when it seems he is not all that interested in me like he used to be. He refuses to go to couples therapy or even go on his own. He says he will talk to me, but doesn't. I don't really even know what I can say to him to get things back to the way they were before. I thought date nights and time would do the trick, but I don't think it's working out very well so far. Maybe more time is what I need to give it.

[hamster-bamster]

The child is 22 months old.

The incident happen 12 months ago.
So the child was then 10 months old.

The birth of a firstborn CAN be a big stressor and definitely is a life changing event, in a positive sense. So the H was without work and you were supporting everything even though you had a baby at home. Who stayed home with the baby when you worked?

The two stories disagree. A drunken night together is one story. Boosting ego at a low time is another story. The former story is a story of an impulse, triggered by alcohol. A momentary lapse of judgment. The latter story implies an ongoing process and deliberation. Of course, both might have been the case - maybe he went to that bar being very down on himself, since having a wife who is the sole breadwinner and a new mom depressed his mood. So both things might have happened, no question about that, but then he should be verbalizing the connection between them, and he seems to be switching from one account to the other.

If you reread your own post and notice how frequently you use the words "work", "working", it might be eye-opening for you. You seem to believe that everything is a matter of working (e.g. you say that you are working on forgiveness) yet wish for playful times, fun, and laughter. You might very well be onto something when you say that your present persona of a strong-willed working mother is not to his liking. Have you asked him? Talking about that and not the incident seems to be much more promising.

Date nights do not work because they are work for you, too. Date nights is a trite recommendation of your typical couples counselor. Because date nights are so structured/planned/calendared, they are just another TODO on the list, especially if one spouse at least (you in your case) have formed an expectation that these date nights will work. You need spontaneous moments that are not structured, calendared, or planned, nor are expected to yield value - you cannot expect anything of spontaneous moments.

Stop the date nights since they are not working. If he reads books, ask what he is reading and perhaps read the same book to have a shared topic for a conversation. There are other things - a myriad of them - that one can do, but that has to be discussed on a case-by-case basis. Just drop the date nights since you know they are not working - why spend time and money on something that is not helping.

Does the child attend the daycare? What are the schedules like for the three of you?

[SquirrellyBrain]

I fully believe the incident was due to both being drunk and needing to boost his ego.

The child was with a close friend from 6 weeks to 13 months before we put her in a daycare school. My husband is a self employed contractor. He would have a day here and there but nothing steady. Having the baby with a friend allowed us the flexibility to only pay for care when he did have work.

I get up at 4:30 am. I work 6- 3:30 and go pick up the child from daycare. He gets up around 7 and gets the child ready and himself and drops her off around 8:30 and works until somewhere between 6 and 7pm depending on the day's work and in the summer could work even later. So we have our evenings together after the child goes to bed, but usually by then he is on the couch watching TV and I am running around picking things up, packing lunches, setting the coffee pot, and getting things ready for the next day. By the time I shower and lay down, I am ready to pass out. For the longest time he wasn't even coming to bed to even try for intimacy or be close. We got in a fight about it because at that point I was fed up and like what is the point of us being married if we are basically just going to be co-parenting with no relationship or communication ourselves. He has been coming to bed most nights now, whether we just lay together or actually are going to have sex. Part of the fight was that he never initiates sex with me now. How do I know he's attracted to me and wants to get it on if he never initiates it? When we were younger he couldn't keep his hands off of me. Now I am lucky if he touches me without me jumping on him first. This is part of the reason I can't get those messages out of my mind. He was so willing to climb in her bed and the messages were explicitly describing details of what he did with her. Fast forward to today and it hurts that he doesn't still initiate sex with me.

I am going to figure out a way to bring up if he likes the woman I have become or if he would rather me be the naive and needy 19 year old I was when he met me. When we met he was the breadwinner. I was in college and he was building houses. Things were a lot simpler then. I graduated from college and built my career and started needing him less and less. Eventually he needed me. Now that we are both gainfully employed, neither of us really needs anything from the other except love and we're not doing very good at it.

[hamster-bamster]

You have a lot going on. You have a lot of stressors and life changes (say you identified that he was the breadwinner when you met and now you are both financially independent). You get up at different times. He does not see you in the evening. You are not eating breakfast together. You are tired. The routine is well organized, but grueling nonetheless. Yes, you are basically co-parenting. The distribution of household chores is inequitable: you get up earlier than he does, and yet in the evening you run around picking things up and packing lunches etc. for next morning while he is on the couch watching TV.

So the above is fully sufficient to explain lackluster love life.

It is impossible to say whether the one incident of infidelity has contributed to the lackluster love life or not. You will never be able to answer that question. Let me explain:

Let A, and B be possible stressors or triggers. Let X be a negative outcome. If A is sufficient to trigger X and A and B happened together and X ensued, we cannot say anything about the contribution of B or lack thereof. To test whether B by itself would trigger X, you would need to eliminate A and let B happen and observe what would follow.

You cannot set up this experiment in reality - that is self-evident. So truly, you will never be able to determine if the infidelity caused lackluster love life. This question cannot be answered with confidence. But you can run through the following hypothetical scenario in your mind to simulate the experiment that you cannot set up in reality:

Imagine that you are 23. And he is with you and cannot take his hands off you. You do not have a child yet and he is building houses successfully. Then something bad happens in his business and he starts losing clients. He is upset and demotivated, if not demoralized. In that low state, he happens to be in a bar with a woman and the incident happens. Then in 3 days you find out and he drops all contact with that woman. One year after the incident, he is back in business having many clients. How is your love life one year after that incident, when you are 24 and still not a career woman with a child? Think through it - reflect back on how you and he lived when you were 24 and try to picture what would have happened had that incident happened when you were 23.

I think this is the closest approximation you can get; the closest you can come to figuring out the cause and effect of various factors.

[SquirrellyBrain]

Thanks H-B. You have been more helpful than my own therapist. I have some reflecting to do. I sincerely appreciate you taking your time to talk to me.

[Open Eyes]

Usually the reason for cheating is because of low self esteem. Often a man will cheat even on a beautiful successful wife, and they usually cheat with a woman that is "less than" what their wife is because the man wants to feel superior. I doubt the woman he met in that bar was anything like you, someone he felt better than to build up "his" self esteem is all he wanted. See, when you were so "hot" for each other, he was "the man", somehow he doesn't feel that way right now. That is also why the conversation has gone a bit "flat" too.

Men were designed to go off and hunt while the woman stayed behind, men gained their prowess from a successful hunt to bring back to his family, that has really remained the same with most men.

With you needing him to behave and him being "sorry" and you being the main provider, that is hard on him. No, he isn't feeling "playful", he is probably low and lost and needs to find something that helps him feel like "the man" again.

I am not blaming you or saying your being able to work and carry things financially means you are bad in any way. All I am saying is that he is probably struggling with how he isn't doing well right now.

[hamster-bamster]

Cheatedon,

One thing has struck me as highly unusual about your story. It is your name.

Cheating is reported on this forum and the related divorce subforum every day, multiple times. Let me give you one example. A new poster, a young woman, 8 months pregnant, from another country, married to an American businessman, found out that he he had been having several affairs, ongoing - with a secretary at work, with this woman, that woman etc. So that poster chose the name of a big river in her country for her username (the name of the river plus a few numbers).

These usernames that we choose, they reflect on our identities. Sometimes they reflect on our identities in surprising ways. For me, my username was chosen because I used to - years ago - keep hamsters as pets. But now I see that it fits me to a tee because I like having extra food stored. I just came from Costco with 24 eggs, and I live alone, but I will store part of the eggs fresh in a special container I have for fresh eggs in the fridge, and boil the rest as hard-boiled eggs, and put today's date on the hard-boiled eggs with a sharpie, and store the hard-boiled eggs in a different container in the fridge, and after I finish all of that, I will feel happy . This is funny, but true. I now have cats, not hamsters, and I store Fancy Feast containers (wet cat food cans) in a big and fairly decorative blue tub made of durable but soft plastic, and when I pass that tub in the hallway and see how many cans there are there (different flavors come with different labels, so it is very colorful), I feel HAPPY. Not everybody would feel so happy just knowing that she has amassed 3 or 4 weeks' worth of wet cat food. So I am a true hamster.

You chose your username based on what you see as the central issue. Note that compared to what was happening in the life of that young woman who, being 8 months pregnant, discovered that her husband this and that and for a long time - basically, leading not just a double life, but triple or quadruple - and the young woman was without any relatives or friends and, I assume, marketable skills - compared to her situation yours is much less complicated. You are on your own turn, self-supporting, and it was a one time incident. And yet, that woman chose a geographic name as the basis of her username, and you chose Cheatedon. Since this is unusual, I did a search among usernames on this site. I used "cheat" to search. Only 3 usernames came up in search. Yours is one of them. Two others belong to posters who left soon after they registered and very little can be gleaned from their posts. It is not clear why they chose their usernames they way they did.

On this site there are 50728 members as of now.

Let us say that 5% of them have experienced infidelity, just as a guesstimate. So that would be 2536 folks, but only you chose infidelity as the basis for your identity on the site.

I do not know what to think in concrete terms, but that it is out of pattern is obvious. Your userid also screams "I am in pain"...very eloquently. I wonder if with this depth of painful feelings you can approach him to first tell him that you are not blaming him for anything and second, reveal how much you are hurting and ask him to hold you or caress your hair. No sex. Hopefully with this he would that he is the man and the protector again, and that might be good for him. I would find a moment when he is sitting on the couch, come sit on the floor by the couch and put your cheek on his lap. This way he would be taller than you. I am not sure your child is at that stage yet... if not now, then very soon you will learn that teachers at preschools do not talk to children walking or standing up; they lower themselves to be at the level of a child. This way they are talking to the child or with the child, but not AT the child. I do not know if all preschools do that, but when my son attended a NAYEC-accredited preschool (sort of a gold standard in child development), the teachers did that and taught us parents (it was a co-op daycare) to behave in exactly the same way. So for you, I am suggesting that you position yourself lower than him - using the same logic as NAYEC does, but in a different situation.

[Open Eyes]

"I just feel like a piece of us is missing now and SHE has it." quote Cheatedon

No, she has "nothing" that missing piece should be something you see better now. Think about how you have stepped above him in ways. He began to struggle "before" that SHE
ever came into the picture. I am not sure he himself understands this, often they don't.

[SquirrellyBrain]

So my username came from my first thought when I signed up because for that reason I was here and honestly I did not expect any responses that were beyond "I am sorry this happened to you" or "leave his cheating ***" or "once a cheater, always a cheater." Responses I have read on many many other forums. I didn't truly expect to have an account here very long. If I went with an animal, such as yourself, it would probably be a squirrel. I run around all day at work, I can't sit still when I am home, and I too like to store my nuts. I became a couponer when my husband was out of work. Seeing my pantry full and knowing I saved money makes me happy

So I wanted to give a little background on my husband. Last night again he did not come to bed. I did however come home from work and he was there, so I popped in a movie for the kid to distract her and snuck him off for a quickie which briefly made him smile, but overall he is just so unhappy (as am I, I suppose).

He was raised in a sort of country life. His parents never really put him first. The stories he tells me from his childhood kind of make me cringe with anger towards his parents. Because of his upbringing he has always said his family will come first. He was an only child. His parents were not alcoholics but did frequent the bar. He ran with a bad crowd in high school. He was careless with his sex life. He got into trouble. He did a little bit of time. He had a high school love with a love - hate relationship. They both cheated on each other often. They had a child when he was 23. They could not get along and separated ways. He has not seen that child for about a year now and it has been off and on like this since I met him. He met me a year after he seperated from her. Neither of us wanted anything serious at the time but we just fell into it. He had cheated on me before we married. I did then forgive and forget (well in a sense our passion returned and I didn't think about it as much as I am now). Then he was in a car accident 2 years after we met and became addicted to pain killers and eventually heroin. I stood by him "in sickness and health" and before we married he entered into a treatment program. He was in a methadone treatment for a few years and it did not work for him. He switched over to suboxone and has been weaning down from that, and should be completely drug free by February. We've had many highs and lows in our relationship. Right now feels like a deep low. I have been devastated by him before but not since we married and made those vows. This time feels different and I truly believe it's because of the fact I am more independent and less forgiving.

Today he was off of work due to rain. He has more energy since I've got home and has been cleaning up and giving the kid a bath, while I prep dinner. I can tell he is in a better mood. I have brought up depression back when the incident happened and a few other times this year. He refuses to seek a therapist. He tries anti-depressants, but did not like the way they made him feel.

So to say the least, our relationship is very complicated. It hasn't all been bad. There is a lot of love here and a history filled with some really great memories. But it's definitely not been all rainbows and butterflies!

[Open Eyes]

Cheatedon, what you added does make a difference. Unfortunately, often what is left out can make a big difference in how posters respond.

It really does sound to me like your husband has self esteem issues and even had an addiction as well. That is a big challenge to "him, you and the marriage".

I married a man that was a binge alcoholic, I did not know that alcoholism was not "just" a person that needed to drink everyday or hide it in a paper bag. My husband cheated on me too, twice and I did not find out for several years. What I did learn about him however, is that his alcoholism had prevented him from growing up, I was told by a counselor that his maturity level was around age 12/13 and not to mother him even when he pushed my buttons to.

My husband definitely had self esteem issues and two learning disabilities that frustrated him which led to his drinking. My relationship with him went from his binge drinking to him being all about AA and staying sober and finding himself. Needless to say I was often lonely and now that I look back I really did not have an "adult" as a partner for many years.

From what you are saying, your husband is struggling and he really does need to seek help. It isn't fair to you to have to do all the work in this relationship and be a therapist/adult/mother.

I think it is good that you have a good job and can take care of the bills, often if a relationship doesn't make it because of the challenges your husband has, the wife really struggles and ends up living almost if not at poverty level needing to find a way to learn skills to support herself. I am sorry Cheatedon, that you have this kind of challenge, I am sorry for your husband too. I cannot stress enough how he does need help, being drug free is not going to change his inner challenge and it might be even harder for him.
At least you know that the cheating is his effort to somehow ease his low self esteem. In a way it is a kind of "escape" too a "running away" from something, not you, but his own problems.

I hope you are not upset with the responses, keep in mind that posters did not have the information you just posted, it does make a difference and members here really do try to be "supportive" and are known to be kind and caring.

I will tell you that my husband found the AA program to be very helpful. He had to learn how to manage his stress better, how to live his life one day at a time and what to do when he was struggling and wanted to "run" to the alcohol. My husband has been sober for 24 years now. It did take him several years to grow up and sometimes I still have challenges with him because he should have also had therapy too.

I wish I could tell you about a "quick fix" for the challenge you are having with your husband, I cannot, he has to finally get help and grow up, he will feel better if he does that too, it will also help his depressive days which are likely to continue even once he is off the drugs.

Please keep yourself active as this site can really be very helpful.

(((Hugs)))
OE

[SquirrellyBrain]

I am not upset with the responses at all. It is helping me to be able to talk to people that seem to understand. The therapist I was seeing was more of a "I am sorry" followed by the standard advice most receive in a cheating situation.

I glad to see you are still with your spouse after all this time and the challenges you faced. Did you ever just feel like you were tired of trying? Like maybe who am I to force him to become a better person if he doesn't want to try to seek help on his own or face his own issues. I have begged for him to see a therapist. He does not believe in group sessions. He would never open up in one. He does not really speak about his struggles with anyone. He swears he loves me and isn't going anywhere and will not do it again. But how can I believe that when his self esteem is low again for whatever reason and he won't need that boost? And maybe I am having a hard time coping with all of this because maybe it is I that wants to leave but is afraid I am walking out on something that would be great once again with time. My heart literally aches thinking about this. I have times when it feels like an elephant sat on my chest and I can not breathe. When I was younger I thought I would never find anyone like him again. But I wouldn't want to. I wouldn't want the heart ache that I have gone through. I'd want it to be easier. My husband was my very first real love. I had a few boyfriends prior but nothing major. Never love. Now I realize that I deserve the best. So when I was asked at 23 what would I have felt a year after cheating. I would have been over it by now and moved on with him like it never happened. But at 32 I am wiser and feel like I deserve better and I know had I not forgave him before marriage, I might be with someone that I didn't have so many struggles with. I vowed to this man I would be with him forever through all good times and bad. I realize he took those same vows, but I took them very seriously. I can't just walk away from him as much as I feel that would be the easy way out for me.

[Open Eyes]

"I glad to see you are still with your spouse after all this time and the challenges you faced. Did you ever just feel like you were tired of trying? " quote Cheatedon

Yes, I had periods where I did get tired of trying. I was married 10 years when I put my foot down because a friend told me about binge alcoholism. I have been married for 34 years now and a lot of the answers I had needed years ago were not available to me as they are now. Often my husband had blamed me and insisted I was the one with the problem and "should go see someone". I did reach out for help but I did not get the help I really needed. I wish I had the kind of therapist I have now, wish I knew then what I know now too. With my husband having two learning disabilities, it did really affect his self esteem in ways I did not understand, in ways "he" did not understand either. I lived through so many of his cycles and I still do only I have finally learned the "whys", not something available to me even though I literally pounded the pavement for help.

I was like you are, thought about the oath and thought that as long as he was trying to be patient. Yes, I had moments where I wondered if it was me being somehow wrong too. It really is not so black and white and it is good that you added in the other challenges you have been having. Your having a therapist just saying "oh that's too bad" is not going to help you, I think you really do want to understand it better and you really do deserve that. And in all honesty, your husband deserves to understand his challenges better too.

It is not unusual for a young man struggling the way he is to say he doesn't want to join a group or see a therapist too. He has already told you about his childhood challenges, but I am sure there is more to it that even he doesn't realize. My husband was 34 when he finally went to his first AA meeting because I finally put my foot down and told him our marriage would be over because I just could not take it anymore. I got lucky because when he did go he realized that "yes" he did have a problem and I was lucky that he found a good group and a great sponser that mentored him in a better direction.
However, that still did not change the fact that he struggled with two learning disabilities, dyslexia and ADHD that have their own challenges. What I have come to learn is that many alcoholics/addicts have these learning disabilities or are running from ptsd symptoms, running to drug use to avoid the emotional and self esteem challenges that bring on stress.

When you mentioned that your H did not come to bed, that wasn't about you, he is struggling and restless and probably can't sleep. He is also probably struggling, even terrified of being "drug free" too. He has already been down the road of drug addiction and even using heroin which can happen when a person becomes addicted to pain medications. You are not the only person who has the challenges that you have discribed and some of the people who become addicted to pain meds that begin seeking out other forms of highs often change in behavior patterns and can even become mean.
It is not unusual for these individuals to resist getting help too. Often they just cannot picture life being "sober". Actually I did have a friend that I tried to help and she even went to get sober but she just could not see her way to living her life without numbing herself with alcohol and she ended up dying from alcoholism.

Getting help when a person is younger and has someone who loves them and wants to be supportive can make a huge difference in that person learning how to live their life better. Everyone that I have met that has reached out and gotten support and improved has said they wish they had done it much sooner.

I suffer from PTSD myself because I suffered a lot of loss because of a neighbor's negligence. I had spent "years" building a lifestyle that was productive and positive for both my husband and daughter, both of whom struggled with learning disabilities. I was completely overwhelmed by the amount of damage I faced, not only in the loss of the horses and ponies I had slowly put together to have what I had, but also seeing how it had affected my husband and daughter who were very lost and challenged. I broke down and I did not know how to explain "all" that had been so badly damaged, years and years of dealing with the challenges I had been faced with in my husband and his problems and my daughter with her challenges as well. I don't think you can appreciate that from where you are right now, but I have been there myself and it was a long road for me to "stay" and be supportive, to often be the "alone adult" trying to figure it all out. Oh, how I would have loved to have met someone like me who had been through the gamit and could have helped me understand it better and mentor me. I certainly did look, even went to the alanon meetings, but it was so elusive. It was elusive because statisically the woman leaves, she often waits until her husband is sober and getting help and then she leaves. Do you know why? Because she really loves him, but she just gets tired of the cycles where she loves him when he is bad and first wants to make sure he is ok, then she can get mad at what the challenge is doing to her. So, she just wants to know her husband is getting help so she can finally leave and be released of that incredible challenge. It's "hard" to stay, it is often heartbreaking and very lonely, I know I lived it.

What is going on with your husband is "not his fault" and you will struggle as long as he refuses to get help, and "now" there is better help for him out there. I will be happy to talk with him about how he needs to reach out for help, how he deserves to get help and how that will make a difference in the life of that little child you both have too. Being "the man" is about him reaching out for the help to finally give himself the right direction verses just "running away" when he really can do so much better because I am sure deep down that he is such a good person worthy of "being loved".

(((Caring Hugs)))
OE

[Fuzzybear]

[SquirrellyBrain]

So Friday my phone died and we were opening stockings with our child. I grabbed his phone to take pics. When we were done I opened his gallery to send myself the pics I took. He got nervous. And came and got his phone to send me the pics. I caught an image of someone that was naked in his gallery. I couldn't make out if it was him or a girl. I asked him to show me and he deleted it. He said it was a picture of someone's behind. I was sitting next to him and told him that he needed to be real honest with me about what that was. He said he got a random message with a naked girl on it. He says he accidentally saved the pic and it was just like porn to him and nothing more. He says that he didn't know who it was or who sent it. He did say he should have deleted it before I seen it. Which struck me from the earlier comments. Really he just shouldn't have any naked correspondences with anyone. He said he knows lots of provocative girls from his past and they hit him up all the time. I said I have lots of guys from my past too. The conversation usually goes "cute kid", "so you're married now", "how is everything"... NEVER naked photos. He agreed it was inappropriate. I told him I have been hurting a lot since his incident and my nerves are shot and I have been leaning on my lorazepam for anxiety attacks a lot lately because we are not ok. He didn't have anything to say really. He said he loved me and assured he wasn't doing anything (meaning sexual). He held me while I cried and stroked my hair. The rest of the weekend was very awkward but we didn't bring it back up. He knows I am hurt. He spent the rest of the weekend making sure he kept in contact with me as he worked Saturday. Sunday he didn't just run off to do his supply shopping. He asked if we wanted to go with him and made a point to keep mentioning it was a family date and how much he loves his girls.

He does not see how much I am hurting and will not admit he needs to see someone or change his number to rid his life of his past. His excuse about not changing his number is that work clients have that number and he might miss out on a job.

When he hugged me I just looked away. I didn't feel the closeness. I have put up a wall. His words don't have any merit with me anymore. I spend every moment I am with him weighing out whether I should leave or not. Will it get better? Maybe once he is completely off of the suboxone treatment he will change. I keep telling myself to wait it out. This is a phase, it will get better. But how much of my life do I give? And, it breaks my heart that I am even considering leaving. Not only for me but for our baby and even for him. This was supposed to be a lifetime of happiness, not questioning if he is being truthful or is being faithful. I hate this.

[Open Eyes]

Well, grabbing his phone away from you like that is suspicious IMHO. Girls should not be sending a married man naked photos of themselves either.

Remember what I said, "this is about "his" low self esteem, not anything you are doing wrong". See what happens when he is free of drugs, he may do them behind your back you may have to keep a closer eye on him.

[hamster-bamster]

Originally Posted by Cheatedon

So my username came from my first thought when I signed up because for that reason I was here and honestly I did not expect any responses that were beyond "I am sorry this happened to you" or "leave his cheating ***" or "once a cheater, always a cheater." Responses I have read on many many other forums. I didn't truly expect to have an account here very long. If I went with an animal, such as yourself, it would probably be a squirrel. I run around all day at work, I can't sit still when I am home, and I too like to store my nuts. I became a couponer when my husband was out of work. Seeing my pantry full and knowing I saved money makes me happy

I love that feeling, too, and, love squirrels.

"I am sorry this happened to you" and "once a cheater, always a cheater" are all noise. Such responses have no meaning and add no value, and are a waste of both your time and the time of people who write such platitudes. When a T speaks in platitudes, it is being self-serving - she gets money for doing no work and gets away with it. It is not cool and is not a noble way to make a living, but it is not a waste of time for the T, as she gets paid. But for you, why would you waste your time reading platitudes on multiple forums? As a squirrel, you have a well organized pantry and are rationally frugal with your money... so why are you not equally frugal and rational with your time?

I am glad that you came on here and that your conversations with Open Eyes have uncovered really deep issues. That is so much more useful than getting more... how should I say... "canned responses".

If you were having a problem with a product or service and wrote to the manufacturer or service provider, and they would respond with "we are so sorry this has happened to you and we have your best interest at heart and our customers mean so much for us and we are committed to the highest standards of customer care and always interested in hearing feedback and striving to be our best"...

... you'd be annoyed that they wasted your time and did not do anything to actually troubleshoot or problem-solve with you.

This analogy is not perfect, because forum members did not manufacture your husband, but it provides enough of a similarity. Problem-solving, different takes and angles, a more objective view of an outsider, or a more subjective account of somebody who has been in your shoes... those things are what is valuable; "so sorry this happened" is not a staple that belongs in your pantry.

[SquirrellyBrain]

Very valid point. I need to find a new T in my area. It's just hard for me to get away since I always have my kid when I'm not working. I work OT on Saturday's now too. I can't even find time to get an oil change, much less a baby free time to see a T.

I feel lonely. I am home alone again. Since Sunday, I haven't seen much of my husband. He was not feeling well yesterday and stayed home. When I got in I bet there were not more than 3 words between us all night. Tonight, I have no clue where he is. It's dark here. Surely he isn't still working. What's getting me right now is that in 12 years I never even looked at another guy with desire. And here I am lonely in a marriage trying to make it all work, and suddenly some cosmic change in the universe has presented me with a few men that flat out wish I were not married. Today I was told by a soon to be divorced male coworker that my greatest asset is that I am smart and able to carry on a conversation. Not that I am pretty or anything physical. He wasn't hitting on me, that I am aware of.He was just sincerely being nice. His statement struck me odd, because conversation is something that I am severly lacking in my marriage. So if this guy is able to open up to me about his divorce and new adventures with women in is new single life, why is it my husband and i cant speak? Is our relationship too hurt from the history we share to be able to even communicate? Have I scared my husband with the threat of leaving after the incident that he no longer wants to open up to me? I am being tested and it's making me think even harder about how much of my life I am going to give waiting for my man to get his act together. My mother seems to think he is living a double life with the fact he "disappears" for business and what not. She think he will always be the kind of guy that wants his cake and eat it too. She says he is a great family man when he is here and she sees him trying, but there is so much doubt about what he is up to when he is not with me.

My mind is constantly spinning right now. I wish there was an easy button that would tell me what to do. I don't know how much longer I can honor my vows of in sickness and health, in good and bad. And why in the heck do I even care about those vows when he broke them? *sigh*

[Open Eyes]

IMHO, his not talking to you is probably "guilt".

Keep in mind, he is not running from you either, he is running from "himself" and his own low self esteem issues. How old is he?

[SquirrellyBrain]

He is 39

[hamster-bamster]

CO, I am not at all familiar with the heroin users and the issues that arise of heroine use in the present or in the past, but just common sense tells me that the double life and disappearing might also be related to a potential resurgence in the use of drugs. Disappearing does not have to mean that he is seeing another woman. Heroin and other hard drugs that you mentioned later in the thread are serious drugs and the possibility of his resuming their use is at least a potentiality, especially if he is unhappy and seeks a flight away from his reality.

The divorced male worker might be seriously interested in you romantically, but to hide his interest from you and possibly even from himself, he makes a point of praising you for something that cannot be construed to mean that he has such romantic interest in you. This is by no means certain, but, like resumption of heroin use by your H, it is a potentially that cannot be dismissed. That the coworker's praise struck you as odd may not be due the fact that conversation is lacking inside your marriage; rather, your coworker might have been sounding unnatural in what he was saying (see above), and you picked up on non-verbal signals that manifested his being unnatural and that struck you as odd. It is impossible to say for sure - I am just offering different explanations as, again, mere potentialities.

[healingme4me]

Was just having a conversation earlier, about alcoholism and then, the vulnerable state those in an emotionally intimate devoid relationship find themselves in.

My advice, sort through your choices, devoid of any outside influence of the rl kind. Just keep in mind, there's clearly something lacking.

A recovering heroin addict, that still drinks?

He's got a long road ahead of him. These are choices he is making.

Sent from my LGMS323 using Tapatalk

[PennyD]

It definitely takes time. A lot of it. Everybody works at their own pace. Don't question why a year isn't enough- because it can take longer than that and normally does for many people. but just continue to stay strong and things will be okay.