How Can We Handle These Conflicts Better?

My girlfriend and I are trying to fix a recurring issue that has been ongoing off and on for almost a year now (since we started dating). Bear with me, as there's a lot to cover, and I want it to be thorough so we can get feedback from an informed perspective.

The recurring issue we have is a breakdown in communication that leads to arguments. Generally, I say something or ask something, she takes it in a negative or critical way (when at least 85% of the time, I don't mean it that way), and before I can clarify the intent behind what I said, she is too angry to be receptive. The anger leads to her yelling, name calling, insults, hurtful comments, threatening the relationship, or altogether ending it. I try to do my best to remain calm at those times, but after she is upset, it's rare that I can ever do anything to fix it at the time. I just hate walking away and leaving it alone when she took something the wrong way while in my eyes, she is hurt, upset, and/or angry purely over a misunderstanding. It's also nerve-wracking walking away when she has ended the relationship. It freaks me out, as I love her in a way I've never loved anyone else before in my 44yrs of life. Every time, I wonder if this is the last time, if I may have lost her permanently, and it breaks my heart.

After she does calm down (hours, days, or sometimes weeks) and we're able to have a calm conversation about it, then she is receptive to clarification and can understand where the miscommunication happened. The problem is, by that time, the damage is already done. And even then, she will oftentimes still question my real intentions, like I am possibly lying to her in order to reconcile. I have tried to tell her that makes no sense, as if she can’t deal with my intentions and who I genuinely am, this wouldn’t work. But, she still usually has lingering doubts at that point, doubts that seem to be accumulatingcompiling with every argument.as time goes on.

Some of the problems on my end is I can tend to be very blunt, and since I'm scattered (ADHD), it can be very hard to read my body language accurately, which she also relies on to determine my intent (but as already stated, it's usually wrong). This ties into her reasoning behind getting upset. She says rather than what I say, she relies more on my tone, body language, and "past things" (which I feel is predominantly comparing it to other arguments, which of course makes this even harder). She also told me she believes "her feelings" over anyone's words. However, I strongly feel those feelings have been compromised by past traumas and subconscious fears. She also bases it off what she called "vibes and such." So, in that regard, I don't see any way at all to handle that. I can't do anything to change her "vibes" or her feelings when I talk. I've been working on approaching topics more sensitively, in a more round about way, and we've established some topics we just can't talk about altogether. I'm also now trying to pay attention to my tone and my body language, but that is entirely new to me since I haven't my entire life (44yrs old now). I have tried to explain to her that her vibes are wrong, where I believe they are coming from, but she doesn't believe me.

I do feel she at least has some doubt about them, or by now, she would believe I am a terrible human being. A part of what doesn't make sense is how I'm a giver. When with her, I regularly do things for her. Massages, washing her hair for her, asking where she wants to go or do, asking what she wants to watch when we watch TV, cleaning up around the house at times, feeding the cats, brew her coffee in the mornings (I'm almost always up first), make an effort to be a part of her children's lives, and so much more. My actions are in complete contradiction to someone who is critical, looking to hurt her emotionally, etc. But, she seems to dismiss the cognitive dissonance when she is believing I have ill-intent.

On her end, she has made a huge and very noticeable effort towards remaining calmer, and I know she is really trying hard like I am, but we still have these arguments at times.

We've tried a few different ways to resolve it to no avail. I've asked her to please ask me what my intent was, or let me know how she took something I said, before getting angry. It doesn't work though, as by the time she took something in a negative way, she's already too angry to talk rationally about it. My frustration of course is that I feel if she would just ask for clarification when she takes something the wrong way, it would avoid at least 85% of our arguments, would keep her from getting hurt, and we'll be amazing again.

The best we've done so far is like I said, I now avoid certain topics altogether, have to approach other topics VERY delicately, and she does her best to keep her calm when it happens. But even then, I will sometimes say something that I feel is completely harmless, and she gets upset with me before I even know why. So, we need more ideas of ways to work on this that can help more.

We know there is some core issue not being addressed here. Her last serious relationship was 7yrs ago, and she had the same off and on relationship conflicts we have. Different problems, but the same pattern. I do feel a lot of our conflict comes from negative assumptions on her part as a defense mechanism (but she views them as those vibes or feelings about what I'm saying). Another way to look at it is triggers based on past traumas. While she could take some of my comments multiple ways, I feel sometimes, she takes it the worst way possible and insists that was what my intent was. But, talking about negative assumptions hasn't helped.

We just recently started talking about figuring out the core issue, as whatever it is, it isn't going away on its own. In my opinion, I feel it is fear based triggers based on past trauma. My reasoning is the recurring pattern from her past traumatic relationship. Second is I have described the situation in detail to a psychologist I talk to, and she felt the root of the problem was unhealed traumas from her previous relationship (which is why it's a similar pattern). Third, she is not like this with anyone else I have seen her interact with. With everyone else, she is very patient, understanding, compassionate, loving, etc. Of course, that just makes it hurt that much more when you feel she treats others far better than you at times. She says it's because no one else hurts her like I do, but I don't know how to get her to understand I NEVER mean to.I don't hur

While my girlfriend feels it's a personality conflict (which to an extent in some circumstances, it is), I feel that has very little to do with it most the time, as even then, if negative assumptions didn't happen about my intent, or clarification was asked before she reacted to it, the arguments wouldn't happen at least 90% of the time. The reason I say this is when she is calm and collected after the fact and I clarify why I said what I said, she then sees that with that being the case, there wasn't a need to argue about it.

So, we need to figure out a way to handle these conflicts more effectively and prevent them from escalating. We have read some of a relationship book together and other resources, and it has helped to a small extent, but not enough yet. Also, while I have been seeing a psychologist for a while now due to past issues, she just started seeing one recently. Only one session so far, but I’m sure that will help us as well. Want to do couples counseling, but our finances are tough right now. It is something we want to do though.

Her main focus right now is fixing her depression. She’s going through some really bad depression, so her priority with her counseling right now is to work on that. She has always dealt with some depression to some extent, but our prior issues with arguments exacerbated it. She feels she regressed as far as progress that she has made over the years after her break up seven years ago with her last serious relationship. In my opinion though, I feel it is issues that were just never resolved, and she dodged them by not having a serious relationship. When she had a serious relationship again, those issues came right back to the surface. But, that’s just my best guess and my psychologists, but my psychologist has never talked directly to her. She’s just going by the feedback I gave her so far. I do my best to try to be objective, but of course she's still not hearing another perspective of it.

On a good note, for the first time ever, we were able to implement the speaker/listener technique a couple times recently. Yet another example that I know she is working with me on this, as I know it was VERY hard for her to do it when she was angry. But, while not perfect, we did it, and our conflict went FAR better than how it normally does.

And before you give any feedback, no, breaking up isn't an option. We are a family, have a connection neither of us have ever had before, and we are determined to fix this, know we can fix this, but just need help fixing it.

With that said, we'd love feedback from you guys about a few things. One, how to handle the conflicts more effectively while we fix the core issue. Two, how to dig into the core issue and make sure we know what it is (I've seen some online resources, but would love to hear feedback on what ones you guys feel are the most effective). Three, if you don't feel unhealed wounds from her past is contributing at all, then any idea what the root cause could be? Four, what is cit is assuming it is wounds from her past relationship that haven't fully healed, what we as a team can do about that to help the healing process (I do know with 100% certainty she is over him, it would just be remaining trauma)? We appreciate any help you guys can give us.

I just wanted to say that Im sorry youre having some difficulties but your post is too long for me to read just now (my concentration is terrible). But Im sending lots of hugs and positive thoughts your way.
I will read it when I feel a bit better later on!

I've thoroughly read all that so here's my input. Obviously it's my own perspective. However. It will be blunt. As you said you are a blunt person, I assume you can take it. Decide if you want to read on with that in mind.

That was the disclaimer.

She is like this with you and not with others, because you are close to her so she "lets go" in private and shows her bad side without restraint.

This is NOT your fault. It's simply part of who she is now. Do not let yourself get guilt tripped over this.

At the MINIMUM, she needs to learn management of her dysregulated emotions, no matter what the original reason is for the dysregulation. That's her responsibility, not yours. She has to work on that on her own/with professional help, not with you.

She may be able to change her hostile worldview to a more positive one, but you will NOT be able to fix it for her. AGAIN, it's HER responsibility, not yours.

I understand there were those initial intense emotions bonding you to her this strongly, but if this goes on like this, you may also develop abandonment trauma yourself. Perhaps worth looking up trauma bond, too.

I say that because, it must feel like a lot of stress and burden to have to keep feeling like your heart is being broken having lost her, that you constantly have the one person you really feel in love with getting angry at you, and that she doesn't seem to be this angry and annoyed with other people.

So because of that, I can understand why you have such a strong drive to try and fix all this. But you can't fix her or the relationship on your own. You shouldn't even try. You should not try and dig into her "core issue" whatever that may be. Not your responsibility, it is not appropriate for the relationship, and you do not have the qualifications and deep knowledge base or experience for it.

So, either therapy and/or some other kind of professional help for her, maybe some skills learning for you too, and/or couples counselling, probably of the kind where the partners first have to establish a foundation working on themselves (with help from the counselling) separately before working together on the relationship as a team.

As she is now, she's not ready for a working relationship. I don't know your relationship history, so I can only talk about her here.

And what causes the problems: I wouldn't know from this much information.

It could be any or all of these things, or any other things not mentioned here:

- trauma like you said
- too much stress in life
- incompatibility between you two
- or, it's simply who she is.

Finally, my advice: focus on YOURSELF, your own feelings, as it right now seems like, you keep focusing on her feelings a lot and that will just lead to a disaster too if it goes on like this. Your own feelings will end up being too much if you haven't managed to "fix the problem" in time with this "fix it" approach, if you continue like this, then unfortunately, I guarantee this disastrous ending for you.

I hope some of this helped.

PS: A book you might like on handling conflict in relationships that keep going bad: The Science of Trust: Emotional Attunement for Couples by Gottman.

I'm also sending hugs and I will reread this when I'm feeling a bit better (later)

It sounds as if she might be worried that there'll be another 15% of the time when you'll turn out to mean it that way after all.
Could it possibly be a two-way misunderstanding where she doesn't understand where you're coming from because she's too busy reacting to a perceived threat, while you don't understand what she's reacting to because you're too busy proving you aren't really that threat?

To me that suggests you're invested, at least a little, in proving something (to her, to yourself, or both): e.g., that you're safer to be with than she's willing to give you credit for, or that she's determined to blame you for something that isn't your fault.

What does the "damage" look like? How would you describe it and its impact on you? For instance, are there things you can't say or do post-damage that you could say or do just fine before?

I notice that when someone has told me that it made no sense for me to feel, let's say, suspicious or resentful in a certain situation, I've almost always interpreted it as one or more of the following:

-- I haven't made it clear enough yet how I feel and what I'm concerned about;

-- They're not able to get what I'm trying to tell them and I need to talk to someone else instead; or

-- It actually is appropriate for me to feel that way, but they don't want me to realize that because it would be inconvenient for them.
That sounds like something of an impasse. It seems to me that the way out, if there actually is one, would be for her to follow those feelings in all directions -- forward, back, up, down, sideways -- and see where they lead her and where she wants to go from there. The way in deeper, on the other hand, would be for you to convince her that her feelings aren't trustworthy and she should believe you instead.
She could always decide that you're just softening her up, putting yourself in a better bargaining position -- something like, "After all I've done for you, how can you still distrust me?" Conceivably, she could be concerned that after all the favors she's accepted from you, if you were to demand something that she wasn't prepared to give you, she'd be on the spot.
You're apparently looking here at her fear-based triggers based on her past trauma. Could you also imagine her wondering what about you might possibly reflect your fear-based triggers based on your past trauma?

It sounds as if (for whatever reason, or for none) she's been letting you, more than others, get to her. We may never know if she feels safer with others whom she has less of an investment in; or she wants to practice teaching people how not to trigger her and you're the most convenient one to practice with; or she sees you as trying to fix her while she's not sure she wants to be fixed; or you just happen to remind her of someone else she couldn't make it with, and she wants to prove she can make it with you (or else, she shouldn't try to make it with anyone)... or any number of other possibilities.

That you're comparing how she treats you with how she treats others, suggests that it's important to you to be treated in certain ways and not in others. Meanwhile, could she also be comparing how you treat her in certain respects, with how you treat others and/or with how others treat her?

If I happen to come across as the devil's advocate here, it's not because I think your girlfriend is the devil.

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This may not be directly relevant to anything we're discussing, but it did set me thinking about issues that come up in relationships: I just happened to come across a link to this Buzzfeed article: Couples Therapists Share Instant Red Flags In Relationships

It sounds like you are both willing to work on this relationship problem which is wonderful. No one can fix this but the 2 of you.

Something I learned in a conflict resolution and communication workshop at an old job is to set "conflict ground rules". At a time when everything is calm and ok, decide together what the boundries are for discussing the conflict. You have a good start in using the speaker and listener roles. Based on the change in how things went in your last talk, you can add other rules that you agree on. For example,, I have a conflict rule in my house that eye rolling and other judgemental type gestures aren't allowed.

Once you both know what causes the other person to react in a non productive way, work together to stop pushing each others buttons by accident(I hope neither one of you purposely pushes the others person's buttons) Only she can tell you when you've pushed too far and vice versa. Be patient with one another as you work through things.

Good luck to both of you.

Unless she works on her own trauma and insecurities, she will bring these into any relationship she enters. You walking on eggshells or trying to 'fix' it won't work because her core beliefs say otherwise.

I think it will take more than just the two of you communicating. Her issues seem to be too deeply embedded and you are the one 'triggering' her trauma (not because of anything you may have necessarily done but because her 'trauma' stems from previous intimate relationships). Like you said, you even have to avoid certain topics. This is not healthy communication and won't help resolve anything..

PS: And she treats others 'better' than you because you are the one who can cause her the most pain.

Relationships shouldn't be this hard. Take a break from the relationship. Let her work on her stuff, you work on yours. You date others while taking the break. I suspect that the two of you just might not be compatible no matter how much you work on things. It just sounds like you walk on eggshells all the time, who wants to live like that?

So mmuch to respond to...

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Etcetera1, thank you. I did address to her last night during a talk that one of the things I personally need from her is for her to gain control of those, as you put it so well, "dysregulated emotions." If she could do that, things would flow so much easier.

Yes, I am familiar with what a trauma bond is. I had one in the past, and it's why I currently do counseling myself. I considered the possibility this could be a trauma bond, but it's more than that.

I know I can't "fix" her. The best I can do is support her and provide her resources. Like I didn't walk her through core issues. I touched on it, gave her some resources for it, and let her choose how she wants to approach it (if at all).

I know she's not ready for a working at this time. That doesn't mean I will end the relationship though. Every couple goes through rough times. Ours is more than the norm, but our love and our happy times also blows anything we experienced prior right out the water. If everyone always gave up on a relationship because things get hard, no one would have lasting, long-term relationships. I KNOW we can fix this. We just need the resources to do so, which we are working towards.

I'm going to look into that book you mentioned. I really appreciate your feedback.

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FooZe, thank you as well. You are right, it is a two way misunderstanding. We have talked in length about it, and I'm going to have to approach certain topics in a much more gentle and cautious manner. Hoping in time, her counselor will bring her issues to surface and help her resolve them. And I in turn am working with mine to help this as well.

As far as the damage from breakups, it's multi-faceted. One of the biggest types of damage is me feeling like I have little to no value to her,
as she is so quick to throw me away. I feel expendable, replaceable (at least I feel she thinks that, I know I'm not), like she doesn't view me as family (as she wouldn't give up on family, but is so quick to do so with me), and more. The biggest problem from the damage now has been that I feel I have hardly any value to her. This in turned has caused my own feelings to change. I don't feel what I did for her anymore. I just keep going because I know we can get that back, it's just going to take time WITHOUT arguments.

I like your suggestion of her following those feelings in all directions. VERY insightful, and I'm going to mention that to her, if she doesn't see this herself (we were open about me posting - no secrets).

I know she lets me get to her more than others. Like she said one day "the people who you love most can hurt you most." I strongly feel a LOT of the assumptions are fear-based. She's so worried (on a subconscious level) of me hurting her that she puts up her defense any time she even thinks there is a possibility I could have ill-intent.

As far as her wondering about triggers from my past, I'm sure that could be contributing to it some. She knows how I dated a compulsive liar who ripped my life to shreds about 7yrs ago. So, she feels I have lingering trust issues, which is correct to an extent. I tend to be neutral when I first meet someone, then they either earn my trust with honesty, or they ruin it with lies. I don't just assume someone is lying, but sometimes I do question if they are being fully honest.

To clarify, I know it's not all her. I mean she has caught me in a few lies in the past, despite how important honesty is to me. There were some times where I was so afraid the truth was going to lead to an argument or breakup, that I was dishonest. She knows every single thing though, and I only recall three incidents off the top of my head.

As far as comparing how I treat others, that is something that I feel works greatly in my favor. I'm all about helping others, and she has said actions speak louder than words. All my actions outside of arguments have always shown good intent, care for others, etc. She knows my actions and what she feels my intention are at times doesn't add up, but that doesn't cause her to discredit entirely. Just doubt, which I at least have that going for me, lol.

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RollercoasterLover, thank you as well. We have done a lot of what you suggested, and we are getting better at actually implementing it during conflict.

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Rive., thank you as well. I kknow very well she will bring this into any relationship. I have tried to tell her tha countless times, but she continues to insist it is us (personality). I am hoping through her counseling, she will eventually realize that's not the case.

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Molinit, I appreciate your feedback. I agree, it shouldn't be this hard. But, after you've been through severe trauma, sometimes there is remaining damage. In our 40s, of course we are both going to have a modest amount of damage.

This relationship is harder than most, sure. But, people who suggest a breakup as a solution because things are hard, usually don't care about serious, long-term relationships. I don't just throw something away because it's broken. I fix it. There is no reason to throw away a relationship because you have things to work on. If everyone did that, there would be no long-term relationships in this world at all.

Let me put it this way... if your child is acting out, and you are having a real difficult time with them, do you just kick them to the curb and abandon them? Of course not! So, why should a relationship (family as well) be treated differently?

In addition, if she were to date anyone else, I would be 100% done with this. That is a boundary that if crossed, I couldn't accept. I deserve better than that.

As far as walking on egghshells, yes, it's nerve-wracking. But, I'm dealing with it under the notion that in time, it will be resolved. I know what topics I can cover currently, and the ones I need to avoid. I'm fine with that for now.

During a breakup we had that lasted a few weeks, we both tried to date others. It didn't work out for either of us. After having the chemistry and all the good with her, every other woman is now a joke. It only made me more depressed, knowing the odds of finding what we have (excluding the conflicts of course), are astronomical.

I’d say that if after only one year of dating you having that many fights and misunderstandings, you might be a bad match. When it starts rough, it has no where to go but downhill. Sometimes issues might arise later in a relationship, but if the very first year is that hard, it might be time to call quits. It sounds way too much work for a new relationship

No problem! I will add a little more.

I honestly think after reading your new post that this goes beyond the category of "things get hard" or a "modest amount of damage" or "relationships require work, we can't abandon a relationship so fast".

This is its own different category. Somewhere around, "toxic relationship with lots of bad drama and highs and lows". With illusory, unreal, no longer existing highs and very real lows.

What's real is your feeling that she doesn't value you, because if she did value you, she wouldn't treat you like this. She's not capable of truly valuing you, but that of course doesn't say anything about your real value.

So, I don't know how you measured and evaluated the necessary resources, but it requires more resources than "things get hard in relationships". It would be an infinite amount of resources absorbed in a deep bottomless hole while you get even more damaged and lose more time.

I wish you the best luck either way!

She is not your child. A relationship with your own child is completely different than a person you've been dating for 1 year, the majority of it in conflict.

If you are going to choose to walk on eggshells until the next blowup, so be it. But know that it's a choice you're making and the person you are actually compatible with can't find you because you're all wrapped up in this, and well that's how things go sometimes. She's sucked up a year of your life already and you should be out there looking for someone without all this baggage.

I am not sure you could or should compare raising a child to adults making a choice to date other adults.

People go into having children with a notion that they’ll be by child’s side, guide and raise them no matter how hard it might be or how the child turns out. People don’t go into dating world with a notion that they’ll date every person they meet even if it’s bad, volatile, confrontational simply etc By this logic you must date and stay in a relationship with every person you meet no matter if it’s good or bad. It doesn’t work this way and doesn’t really make sense. It’s a choice who you date and who you choose to stay with.

It’s quite unsettling that this woman’s children are in the picture. It’s alarming if they witness all this drama and conflict. So not healthy

In addition I am not sure why you say that people who suggest break up don’t care about long term relationship. That’s quite the opposite. I for example am married.

But I’d not marry my husband if when we’ve met he was confrontational and argumentative, and to quote you engaged in “name calling and yelling insults” in the very first year together.

I married him because he is kind and loving and fun and our life together is peaceful. I’ve met some confrontational, conflict and drama obsessed men, (not as extreme as this woman you described). Needless to say I didn’t continue on with them and sure didn’t marry them.

Also precisely because I am thinking about long term here, if after only a a year it’s that bad, will this be sustainable long term?

Relationship is a choice. You make it sound that relationship isn’t a choice but something that falls into your lap and you must put up with it no matter what. Why? You don’t think you have any power to choose in life? You don’t think you deserve better than being in constant drama?

You can choose life of conflict and confrontation or you can choose something else

I forgot to add one more thing. Going by the new post, she sounds controlling. Who knows what her real agenda is, she could have a hidden agenda of getting something out of you, she could be looking to deliberately exploit you. That was a possibility I got a fleeting sense of when reading the part that sounded like her being controlling rather than just randomly getting upset due to trauma.

This is where she sounded outright controlling to me:

"To clarify, I know it's not all her. I mean she has caught me in a few lies in the past, despite how important honesty is to me. There were some times where I was so afraid the truth was going to lead to an argument or breakup, that I was dishonest. She knows every single thing though, and I only recall three incidents off the top of my head."

I completely understand where you're coming from on this. I agree with pretty much all of it.

I know it seems ridiculous as to why I'd continue in something so toxic. It's because *if* she could just control her anger, we would be amazing together. We have tons in common, the same core values, conversation flows smoothly, and so much more. I've never had compatibility like that before. So, I kept clinging on to the hope that she would get her anger in check for the sake of the relationship. She tried, but she just can't.

At the start, she acknowledged she had to get her anger in check and acknowledged it was her. Over time, she gradually started blaming me more and more. Not sure if it was intentional manipulation, or if she truly started thinking it was me. Either way, while she admitted it was a problem, she never fixed it. Couldn't.

She just started working with a psychologist finally. Only 2 sessions in though, so I'm thinking it could be months before the psychologist brings her issues to her attention. I can't wait around and be abused in the hope that one day, she will be aware of her part in this and fix it.

Anyway, we broke up again yesterday. I wrote a new post covering the incident, as she has gotten me to a point where I truly question how much I'm to blame here. She has eroded my confidence and self-esteem, meanwhile claims that I do it to her with my questions and statements. All I've ever done is try to lift her up, tell her how amazing she is, show her all the time with being giving and such, and I KNOW I'm a good boyfriend to most women. I know I don't deserve this.

I just saw how sweet and loving she could be, and clung onto the hope she would fix it. But, I can't be with her while she does. So for now, we are done. Maybe after she becomes aware the problem was mostly her and stops blaming me for her triggers and abusive behaviors, maybe one day, we could try again. In the meantime, I'm moving on with my own life

According to her, it has nothing to do with control. But, I have my suspicions it is too. I feel she uses break ups as a form of punishment when I do things she doesn't like. She claims it's because she gets so emotionally overwhelmed that she can't handle it. But, time out or space is one thing. Breaking up is entirely different, and despite knowing how much it hurts me, she just keeps doing it. I can't help but feel it is intentional to at least some extent.

There is control on her end whether she realizes it or not. I had a list of things I wasn't allowed to ask her or talk about. I wasn't even allowed to express certain feelings (ex. doubts about her love for me because of breakups, arguments, etc.), without severe repercussions.

I know very well she had this issue with at least one other boyfriend, her last serious relationship (7yrs ago now). These are old wounds, but she blames it on me. She blames it on personality. But, with how many things upset her, there is no way in hell any man could be with her and NOT have the same issues happen with negative assumptions.

I mean to add, in Oct, there was 2 men she tried to date. After 2-3days of talking to one of them, he asked her measurements. She decided her "gut" was telling her that meant he only wanted sex, so she cut him off. The other one she talked to for a week. He never sent shirtless or other explicit pics to her, even shared photos of his daughter with her. Clear as day he wanted something serious. The day of their date, he says something about some women have a hard time with relationships with him, because he works a lot and doesn't have much time to put into a relationship. She then AGAIN assumes that means this guy only wants sex too! You don't talk a week and share pics of your family to someone you just want a fling with, but again her "gut" told her that was what he wanted, so she believed it and cut him off too. She doesn't see the pattern though!

I tried to use these things as examples to her before of how she will have negative assumptions about ANY man. But, it seemed to go in one ear and out the other. Sadly, it's most likely going to take her dating at least one or two other men and having the same issues to realize it's her. Or, maybe her psychologist will bring it to her attention. Not my problem anymore though.

Exactly, yeah.

Yeah, not your problem. As for the two examples, it sounds like she has strong gut feelings and is biased towards the negative in general about men. I would say she was probably right about both guys though. You don't ask a woman their measurements after 2 days of talking if it isn't sex that's primarily on your mind. And for the other guy, he was trying to manage down her expectations about the relationship really early on - BIG red flag, the fact that someone would even try to do that like that, as managing down expectations is a dishonest technique. Also, more issues with timing: why do that on the day of the date?! That's also manipulative to me. Like he made her invest a full week into it and a date before he'd be honest about the reality. That's a play on emotions, as well. He may have wanted more a tiny bit more than just sex, but it was made obvious that he wouldn't have been great relationship material. And his timing overall does sound like he may have just wanted sex, yes. Unwilling to give enough for a real relationship in any case. So, yeah, a lot of guys out there are bad material. Gut feelings like that are useful for filtering them out if you also understand rationally the "why" behind them. But her negativity is too strong and so it ruins actual relationships too.

Ok this woman is a pain in a neck but she is right about both guys.

Asking woman’s measurement is very inappropriate and yes he just wanted sex.

Second guy pretty much a textbook for “when people tell you who they are, believe them”, he tells her that he has no time for relationships and even other women had issues with that. So he clearly isn’t looking for relationships and by telling her that early on he pretty much covers his butt in case she expects something serious.

No he wasn’t looking for anything serious whatsoever. In addition talking to people for a week means nothing. No one asks for sex or cast encounter in the first phone talk, he has to build some trust first. Sending pictures of his daughter to a stranger is either neglectful and idiotic or a calculated move to gain woman’s trust. Who does that? Wise of her not to waste her time

She is very difficult but she does have good insight and intuition. Both men were not relationship material

Please dont think I am blaming you but I am curious if you take any meds for your adhd>?

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Originally Posted by Ascendant78 My girlfriend and I are trying to fix a recurring issue that has been ongoing off and on for almost a year now (since we started dating). Bear with me, as there's a lot to cover, and I want it to be thorough so we can get feedback from an informed perspective. The recurring issue we have is a breakdown in communication that leads to arguments. Generally, I say something or ask something, she takes it in a negative or critical way (when at least 85% of the time, I don't mean it that way), and before I can clarify the intent behind what I said, she is too angry to be receptive. The anger leads to her yelling, name calling, insults, hurtful comments, threatening the relationship, or altogether ending it. I try to do my best to remain calm at those times, but after she is upset, it's rare that I can ever do anything to fix it at the time. I just hate walking away and leaving it alone when she took something the wrong way while in my eyes, she is hurt, upset, and/or angry purely over a misunderstanding. It's also nerve-wracking walking away when she has ended the relationship. It freaks me out, as I love her in a way I've never loved anyone else before in my 44yrs of life. Every time, I wonder if this is the last time, if I may have lost her permanently, and it breaks my heart. After she does calm down (hours, days, or sometimes weeks) and we're able to have a calm conversation about it, then she is receptive to clarification and can understand where the miscommunication happened. The problem is, by that time, the damage is already done. And even then, she will oftentimes still question my real intentions, like I am possibly lying to her in order to reconcile. I have tried to tell her that makes no sense, as if she can’t deal with my intentions and who I genuinely am, this wouldn’t work. But, she still usually has lingering doubts at that point, doubts that seem to be accumulatingcompiling with every argument.as time goes on. Some of the problems on my end is I can tend to be very blunt, and since I'm scattered (ADHD), it can be very hard to read my body language accurately, which she also relies on to determine my intent (but as already stated, it's usually wrong). This ties into her reasoning behind getting upset. She says rather than what I say, she relies more on my tone, body language, and "past things" (which I feel is predominantly comparing it to other arguments, which of course makes this even harder). She also told me she believes "her feelings" over anyone's words. However, I strongly feel those feelings have been compromised by past traumas and subconscious fears. She also bases it off what she called "vibes and such." So, in that regard, I don't see any way at all to handle that. I can't do anything to change her "vibes" or her feelings when I talk. I've been working on approaching topics more sensitively, in a more round about way, and we've established some topics we just can't talk about altogether. I'm also now trying to pay attention to my tone and my body language, but that is entirely new to me since I haven't my entire life (44yrs old now). I have tried to explain to her that her vibes are wrong, where I believe they are coming from, but she doesn't believe me. I do feel she at least has some doubt about them, or by now, she would believe I am a terrible human being. A part of what doesn't make sense is how I'm a giver. When with her, I regularly do things for her. Massages, washing her hair for her, asking where she wants to go or do, asking what she wants to watch when we watch TV, cleaning up around the house at times, feeding the cats, brew her coffee in the mornings (I'm almost always up first), make an effort to be a part of her children's lives, and so much more. My actions are in complete contradiction to someone who is critical, looking to hurt her emotionally, etc. But, she seems to dismiss the cognitive dissonance when she is believing I have ill-intent. On her end, she has made a huge and very noticeable effort towards remaining calmer, and I know she is really trying hard like I am, but we still have these arguments at times. We've tried a few different ways to resolve it to no avail. I've asked her to please ask me what my intent was, or let me know how she took something I said, before getting angry. It doesn't work though, as by the time she took something in a negative way, she's already too angry to talk rationally about it. My frustration of course is that I feel if she would just ask for clarification when she takes something the wrong way, it would avoid at least 85% of our arguments, would keep her from getting hurt, and we'll be amazing again. The best we've done so far is like I said, I now avoid certain topics altogether, have to approach other topics VERY delicately, and she does her best to keep her calm when it happens. But even then, I will sometimes say something that I feel is completely harmless, and she gets upset with me before I even know why. So, we need more ideas of ways to work on this that can help more. We know there is some core issue not being addressed here. Her last serious relationship was 7yrs ago, and she had the same off and on relationship conflicts we have. Different problems, but the same pattern. I do feel a lot of our conflict comes from negative assumptions on her part as a defense mechanism (but she views them as those vibes or feelings about what I'm saying). Another way to look at it is triggers based on past traumas. While she could take some of my comments multiple ways, I feel sometimes, she takes it the worst way possible and insists that was what my intent was. But, talking about negative assumptions hasn't helped. We just recently started talking about figuring out the core issue, as whatever it is, it isn't going away on its own. In my opinion, I feel it is fear based triggers based on past trauma. My reasoning is the recurring pattern from her past traumatic relationship. Second is I have described the situation in detail to a psychologist I talk to, and she felt the root of the problem was unhealed traumas from her previous relationship (which is why it's a similar pattern). Third, she is not like this with anyone else I have seen her interact with. With everyone else, she is very patient, understanding, compassionate, loving, etc. Of course, that just makes it hurt that much more when you feel she treats others far better than you at times. She says it's because no one else hurts her like I do, but I don't know how to get her to understand I NEVER mean to.I don't hur While my girlfriend feels it's a personality conflict (which to an extent in some circumstances, it is), I feel that has very little to do with it most the time, as even then, if negative assumptions didn't happen about my intent, or clarification was asked before she reacted to it, the arguments wouldn't happen at least 90% of the time. The reason I say this is when she is calm and collected after the fact and I clarify why I said what I said, she then sees that with that being the case, there wasn't a need to argue about it. So, we need to figure out a way to handle these conflicts more effectively and prevent them from escalating. We have read some of a relationship book together and other resources, and it has helped to a small extent, but not enough yet. Also, while I have been seeing a psychologist for a while now due to past issues, she just started seeing one recently. Only one session so far, but I’m sure that will help us as well. Want to do couples counseling, but our finances are tough right now. It is something we want to do though. Her main focus right now is fixing her depression. She’s going through some really bad depression, so her priority with her counseling right now is to work on that. She has always dealt with some depression to some extent, but our prior issues with arguments exacerbated it. She feels she regressed as far as progress that she has made over the years after her break up seven years ago with her last serious relationship. In my opinion though, I feel it is issues that were just never resolved, and she dodged them by not having a serious relationship. When she had a serious relationship again, those issues came right back to the surface. But, that’s just my best guess and my psychologists, but my psychologist has never talked directly to her. She’s just going by the feedback I gave her so far. I do my best to try to be objective, but of course she's still not hearing another perspective of it. On a good note, for the first time ever, we were able to implement the speaker/listener technique a couple times recently. Yet another example that I know she is working with me on this, as I know it was VERY hard for her to do it when she was angry. But, while not perfect, we did it, and our conflict went FAR better than how it normally does. And before you give any feedback, no, breaking up isn't an option. We are a family, have a connection neither of us have ever had before, and we are determined to fix this, know we can fix this, but just need help fixing it. With that said, we'd love feedback from you guys about a few things. One, how to handle the conflicts more effectively while we fix the core issue. Two, how to dig into the core issue and make sure we know what it is (I've seen some online resources, but would love to hear feedback on what ones you guys feel are the most effective). Three, if you don't feel unhealed wounds from her past is contributing at all, then any idea what the root cause could be? Four, what is cit is assuming it is wounds from her past relationship that haven't fully healed, what we as a team can do about that to help the healing process (I do know with 100% certainty she is over him, it would just be remaining trauma)? We appreciate any help you guys can give us.

I get what you're saying and see your point as far as the other guys. I mean she was also looking on Tinder of all places, and expecting something serious from it. No idea what she is thinking sometimes.

Personally, if I was in the situation she was with in regards to the 2nd guy, I would've lost interest because I'd feel like the person couldn't give me what I need as far as a relationship. But, jumping to the conclusion he only wanted sex I still do not feel was a reasonable deduction. A possibility? Sure. But, she could've asked him more details about it to try to figure out for sure what it was. She just automatically dismissed him as just wanting sex and ghosted him.

But yea, she has WAY too much negativity when it comes to a relationship. She is determined to analyze every single thing you do, and *if* her emotional IQ is as high as she claims, she'd realize the patterns with me that are different, or realize that her assessments are unreliable and she needs to rely on improved verbal communication. But, she refused to work on communication. Always justified why "she was right and I have bad intentions" every time.

No matter how good I was to her, no matter how much I'd do for her, no matter how I focused on trying to make her happy, it was never enough. All it took was even one single thing she could take the wrong way, and suddenly, I'm a horrible person out to judge her, insult her, etc. No other woman ever did this to me, but she has done this to at least one other man before. But, she can't connect the dots.

Her father is bi-polar, and my psychologist thinks (based on what I have told her over the last 11mos) either she is bi-polar herself, or possibly borderline personality disorder. She would go for weeks at a time where we didn't argue at all. Everything is easy, the relationship is amazing, and we have no conflicts. But then, it was like something in her changed like a light switch. Sometimes she would flat out say she was "in a bad mood" or was being overly emotional (especially prior to her periods). Other times, I got no forewarning of her change until she'd pick a fight. So, I never knew when it would happen.

I just wished she took on accountability for her own actions and stopped making negative assumptions about mine. From how she acts, I truly think she believes her verbal abuse is justified and acceptable behavior. She never once flat out admitted she was abusive and that the behavior needed to change.

Completely inappropriate to ask for a woman's measurements. She was right to cut it off asap.

As for the other guy - sending pics of his kid after a week?! Red flag again. Can't fault her for either of these 'gut' decisions. Her self-preservation instincts in both instances were spot on.

I agree with you that what the 2nd guy wanted is not 100% unambiguous, but it definitely was not him wanting a serious relationship. At that point I would not want to waste my time anymore with clarifying more, and would politely excuse myself from further communications....ghosting is actually okay too because the person was likely manipulative anyway with that play on emotions. I don't like ghosting, but in that case it would've been fair enough

Agreed, that high EQ was botched in intimate relationships due to her issues. Personality disorders - not saying whether she's personality disordered or not - do have this feature, problems in intimate relations.

I think she won't ever connect the dots unless maybe in therapy, but it would take a LOT for her even to try and look that deep.

Biggest red flag of all of it there, that she never admitted to these extreme behaviours being a serious problem and saw it as reasonable behaviours

The pattern too that you describe there, good for some weeks then unpredictably turning bad with extreme words and actions. That's very typical of serious problems like that.

Sorry if this is off topic - Do you mind me asking how you see the kid pics as a red flag?

I would see it in retrospect, after him trying to manage down the woman's expectations about a good, committed, serious relationship. I would then instantly see it all as a bad play on trust and emotions, yeah

But I would not see it before that, so I'm curious, if you don't mind.

I am sorry, I know you aren’t asking me but In general sensible people and good parents wouldn’t share pictures of their children with strangers. Not safe and irresponsible. Also moving too fast and sharing too much smells of love bombing/manipulation. Sensible people build relationship slowly and naturally

The person either lacks common sense or isn’t a responsible parent or is manipulative: some men know what women like to hear, so he thinks if he projects the image of involved daddy and a family man, she’d be more trusting right away.

Sure sadly some women fall for this behavior.

Hi Etcetera1,

basically, what divine said.. Too many red signals. It is not appropriate to send pictures of children over the internet. A responsible parent would protect their child and not send pictures of their child to random strangers. You don't know who is on the other side of the screen (predator?). What that guy is doing is dangerous.

Not to mention sending pictures of one's (if the child is even the guy's kid!?) child after *one* week? It sends the wrong signals: overly eager... possibly wanting to show 'I am serious and want a serious relationship' when that might not be the case... wanting to 'trap' the woman on the other side of the screen by saying what she would want to hear.

Much too fast, inappropriate and definitely not the sign of a good parent.