Disengaging

I was wrong. I had the idea that there were more communication problems with your husband than the intimacy thing. I’n not diminishing this problem, only that I thought you didn’t understand each other at any level.

Have you guys talked about going to couple therapy?

What was the psychiatrist was referring to when (s)he says it will happen the same to you with any partner?

We are in couples therapy.

The psychiatrist was referring to my having unstable interpersonal relationships.

It’s been too hard for me to get to the truth about what is ‘wrong’ with me, how much of it is coming from me vs. how much comes from the other person. I’m too obsessed with trying to figure this out, and the answers are elusive.

Again, best to disengage.

Glad if I could help.

What you say here makes sense, yes!



Hmm. If you mean initiation of physical intimacy, I'm not going to pry about that of course. But if it is about emotional intimacy, if you don't mind saying more on it I'd be interested. Maybe it would help. And media distractions, do you mean he spends time with online stuff rather than with you?



Ah that makes sense, yes. Yeah, that actually explains everything lol!! Thank you. That was a great description really. So I didn't understand these articles/books before because I don't experience my emotions in this way. What I do have with the emotions, it's more like, my brain puts that block on them so I do not feel the emotion flood like you described it but they do get in the way in this manner and then that takes forever to get past. I don't remember if I said this in this thread (I'm tired) but frankly, if I'm past the block and I have the strong emotions, I'm already good or will be good soon. I will deal with them OK. But it's just, takes time to get there.

Tbh, another way to put it.... my brain just stonewalls on the emotions to avoid the flood. I can see it sometimes that I do actually have some very bad negative emotion, I get a glimpse of it and then my brain stonewalls on it instantly. Because um, I don't have thoughts to fix the emotions in those moments. That is what I am trying to work on too, to have thoughts from more emotional* and psychological processing.

*: When the emotions do finally come up then I'm forced to deal with them by finding thoughts, solutions to not drown in the stuff. The psychological (mental) processing I am able to do while the emotions are blocked. That helps too, as preparation, and I can use that preparation whenever I eventually get to them .....



Like with your husband? Did he like overgeneralise from that quickly? It sounds like that to me because this psychiatrist was specifically referring to romantic relationships, right? He could use some CBT therapy himself To learn about his own thinking distortions, such as overgeneralising.



Are you taking blame from others / from your husband? Even if subconsciously? Because in my experience, this obsession comes from having taken up the blame subconsciously when others find it too comfortable to accuse you of stuff. Or maybe it was the psychiatrist, he also sounds like he was too comfortable with accusing you instead of a constructive and professional approach.

And yeah if it's blame like that then yep, disengaging is the right response for it. Lol your thread helped me do it too!!

I just need to make myself happy. I am diligently working on my attitude to help myself grow and be more well-rounded as a person. I tend to be too dependent on others (also a trait of a disorder).

Oh no, typical guy stuff.

Sorry I'm not trying to minimise the issue. I've just seen enough guys doing that too around me LOL



I think that's also probably not something "wrong" with you. Often there can be these issues. There are some counsellors specialised in this too.



Sorry, what is "MI"?

I frankly think not a lot of relationships are that quality/truly close. (Maybe I said this before in my thread on it lol) I think that's understandable really, it's hard to do really good relationships. It takes a lot more psychoeducation. It's not taught in school!!



I can only agree about how sh** that is. I think what I can suggest here is to reflect on how she's not actually right, and become firm in seeing it, and have true clarity about it. And then it is eventually going to just sound like some absurd bull****. Which is what it is anyway



Maybe drop the idea of "this is a disorder", "that's dysfunctional", "that's from trauma".... I mean technically maybe it's true, but maybe it doesn't matter at all? I've thought about this recently, how there are few people who are 100% healthy and fit, and everything, and not simply not ill/sick, but truly healthy and fit with vitality. It requires maintenance, exercise, good diet, etc etc. Same for our psychological well-being. A lot of people have psychological issues, maybe not outright "sick", but not really fit either or have vitality all that much. So why would you be worse off than all those people. It really doesn't matter then. So then maybe just focus on the well-being and doing what you need to to get there, instead of endless self-criticism, like "this is ALSO a trait of a disorder".

My point is: You don't need to "correct" yourself. You just want to feel better, do things that are to your benefit, to be happy.


I hope you'll get there.

MI is mental illness. It was a tragic situation with my dad.

I did not think anything of past trauma or my mental health until the relationship got so unstable I had to see psychiatrists/psychologists. I have been obsessed with trying to figure it all out.

Thanks for the advice to disengage!

I am sorry about your dad. And with this marriage, maybe you two really just don't fit together well, if you never had to think about trauma and mental health in other relationships before this one. Like it's definitely not about you, it's either about him or the particular way you two fit/don't fit together in a close relationship. I think I mentioned that before, that I think this is the most likely. Just my opinion of course, as an outsider on a forum

I'll try and make this opinion really all-encompassing.... So it's like.

It's very possible that it's neither of you. And that it's not solely the way you fit or don't fit. That would be one part of it, like I said that thing about some people handling the worst side of us better than others. Or there is the factor of good chemistry and all that. But it could be that you two were a moderately good fit, or even a very good fit and then life stresses would be wearing down the relationship without enough support. Like.... no psychoeducation in school about how to do marriage with a person very different from you (of the opposite sex), or any other support, from a good support network, both for you and for him. Or enough financial support, with economic difficulties or covid lockdowns now. And so on.

So, all that together could be it. Sorry if this sounds trivial. I just think that looking inside ourselves does not solve everything, it is of course needed but we have to look outside too, around us to see what factors are at play beyond our own internals. You seem stuck at examining your insides looking at your own role, not getting anywhere and this may be (part of) the reason for it. I hope this helps a little.

The reasons you mentioned in your last two posts are all correct. I did not have good role models coming from a dysfunctional family. I certainly did not learn anything in school. It is a basic communication, compatibility issues.

You mentioned in a friendship you show each other your worst qualities. I haven’t found that to be true in my friendships. With a friend, I keep more boundaries, so my worst does not show as we don’t get that close. It’s always on a more polite level. But in a marriage, yes, our worst qualities can’t be contained!

I am trying very hard to contain my worst by walking away and disengaging.

You accidentally mentioned something here that I found really helpful. You said that you don't get that close with friends. And yeah, I think I didn't have an actually quality friendship so I don't really know when these "friends" would get too close to me. Especially the "best friend". Like they would ask for too much help and stuff. And then would eventually show their worst sides and stuff like that, yeah.

I don't understand how that happened. I do know when it was when she pulled me into her issues with drama. But I don't understand how it could even happen in the first place. I always explained it away to myself with "she was in a really really bad place so she just tried to find help wherever she could". But with your note, it just doesn't seem to make sense anymore, this explanation. Yeah, I don't know what this was.



As for your disengaging: yeah it sounds like a good direction ...maybe the problem with marriage is seeing each other too much so it's hard to hide the worst sides, especially with lockdown lol

But I hope your husband is also trying to do the disengaging. Or it would be pretty imbalanced eventually.

Yes, I think a friend relationship is less intimate than a committed romantic one. I keep more boundaries with friends, so I don’t overstep and lose the friendship. Friends like you because you have something in common, like to do things together, give each other moral support but not to the point of it becoming overbearing, friends don’t want to get too caught up in your drama, friends will be generous but do not want to feel taken advantage of like they are being used. There is a give and take with friendship- each much make effort to maintain the connection.

Romantic relationships go farther. This may be my own faulty thinking, where I am overstepping boundaries and becoming codependent. Maybe I shouldn’t think of them as much more than I do of platonic friends and we’d get along better.

Thank you for this thread. Negative interactions bother me long after the fact, and that's because I cannot properly separate and "disengage". Like right now. I had a negative interaction with someone at work, and it rocked me for the entire day. I wish I knew how to disentangle myself from the emotional aftermath, but I got seriously triggered by this interaction and it's stuck with me for hours. ARGH. It's frustrating. I am frustrated with myself mostly, but also with this person for pissing me off.

Yes. This is what I did not understand back then, when she pulled me into that relationship too deep. I understood only later that with friendship, it's like, you want to protect the good feelings, the connection and that does require boundaries. ...On BOTH sides. That is what I did not understand. Because I protected the good feelings on my part, but I completely missed the idea about what it feels like receiving the same back. That is what I did not understand or know about at all.



And here too....I want to protect the good feelings in a romantic relationship too. I do think it must be harder once you are married (or just living together long-term). I don't think it's just you.

I read (part of, didn't finish it yet) this pretty good book on marriage....I don't remember if I mentioned it on here. The New Rules of Marriage by Terrence Real. It talks about boundaries and a lot more. Trust me I've looked through a lot of these books on marriage already but I liked this one the most so far because of the idea that a 21st century marriage is just not the same as before.

Yeah, this is what my life became in a sense for a while. So I understand you.


I originally - years ago - just detached, detached so strongly I lost energy for some things and started having less and less of a life.

It was disengagement but too extreme.

Because I did not deal with the feelings, they just went away buried somewhere deep down


Anyway... once I stopped being so detached, it all came out. A mess.... Then I would be like, pulled down for days after each negative interaction with people. Even people I don't know much at all.

(This was already after cPTSD which didn't help either)

And yes, this idea of disengaging, this thread, and some talk on the emotional support chat on the chat of this forum helped, etc.



The idea I took up from all the talks on the chat and this forum thread was that I really just have to recognise fast enough that an interaction is too negative, not constructive, perhaps even toxic or heading towards toxic too much. Too much "bad drama" overall. If the interaction was to continue, it would just lead NOWHERE. Just looking at it like, not worth it. Keeping my person out of it with that.

And then upon the recognition of that, instantly stop engaging, not discuss/argue/engage with the person, and then you internally disengage too. You don't have to physically walk away if you are able to control it internally but that can be an option too yeah.


It truly did help. Now I'm not pulled down for days. Or not so strongly that I can't keep doing other stuff.... Like it may be there in the background until I fully processed it. Sometimes I can instantly process it even.

I haven't been completely freed from taking in the negative yet, but I have been able to process & push it away faster. Not getting pulled into the "bubble" of the thing.


The processing entails understanding what actually happened, with all the facts, a realistic enough assessment, not too biased towards too positive/hopeful or too negative/paranoid either.

And then I see how it doesn't say anything about me, whatever negative thing happened. Even the idea of that becomes absurd.

So it's easy to disengage from it at that point. A very objective view like I am viewing it as an outsider/3rd party from the outside.


I do sometimes also push back without going overboard with the anger, this is to avoid internalising too much of the negative. Again, not being too angry or too nice either. And that pushback is the line drawn in the sand. After that, the interaction does not continue. I.e. I walk away (physically or not but I disengage).

Yah I think it all requires practice and I am still practicing mself too. Lol, years of work!!

I think to take it to the ultimate level it would be aiming to be constructive always with the disengaging. If you say you are done with the convo, and why you are done, and then you disengage, you can say this in a constructive way, which can just be like, paying attention to what works best for everyone. For that tho you really have to accept humans as they are lol. I don't know if I can always do this advanced level lol. But at least not getting into the bad drama, that's already good in my eyes

It feels like every time I get into the bad drama, I wish I had just accepted that person’s behavior in the first place and not reacted negatively. For now, I need to walk away because my emotions are too intense with one person’s consistent triggers. But, I’d like to work myself up to not removing myself and simply accepting them as they are and learning to react positively instead of negatively (which triggers PTSD in me…so this is no easy feat!)

I’d have saved myself so much pain if I could have only just done this in the first place.

I think I’ll pretend I’m the super easy-going hippie girl muppet, lol. It’s all cool, man!

Well I did it , I broke up with my alcoholic addict boyfriend. I don’t ever want to go through another break up again. This is the third one in sixteen years. I mean that’s not bad , I guess. Well fourth if you count that I broke up with my ex fiancé twice. Is that a lot?

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No, it’s not a lot. Think of it as you ended three bad relationships instead of staying in them and being unhappy. Wishing you the best moving forward!

Thanks I wouldn’t say the last was a bad relationship however the alcohol and drugs came first for my ex boyfriend, so I had to leave.

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Really nice and ambitious goal. If you can react in a neutral way (rather than negative), I think that's already a big goal. Maybe try to start with that first. And yes....PTSD is a b**ch, it's trivial for you probably, but yeah, it takes practice to separate the past (emotion) from the present (situation). I wish you good luck with all this.

I’m practicing exercises from the DBT Handbook. It is to not have negative judgments and to respond with “I feel” statements. It says ‘DBT is not to help you endure an abusive relationship. If you are in one, get out.’ But I am using these techniques to try to make the best of an incompatible relationship.

He triggers me to PTSD. I am being incredibly strong to have to be the bigger person and make the best of a bad situation. My situation is not that of a disordered person whose concerned family has to try to get along with them and I need to learn skills to maintain relationships. It is I am showing signs of a disorder after severe stress from ongoing having to deal with extremely dysfunctional people closest to me (mainly only my h over intimacy).

I have an opportunity to leave next week for a couple weeks without him, just my son and I again in another state where my other two sons live. I think I don’t want him to come (he wants to come). We’ve been talking about me getting a break with the therapist who says it’s a good idea and I really want to make that happen. It is with much resistance from him because he doesn’t want it. I hope I can find the strength to get away. It will, at least, give me some peace for two weeks.

I am wishy washy and go back and forth by the hour. I can’t get away or stay and be happy.

I bet I just wrote a lot of judgmental comments here right now (sorry DBT)

Ohh I didn't notice any judgmental comments. I do agree, if you feel the need to get the break, then do get one.

I’m trying to follow the DBT book. It says to write down all the judgmental thoughts and comments we make good and bad and then to not be judgmental about them, let them disappear. Oh boy do I have far to go!

I had another bad night and day today in spite of trying with this new book. I think it triggered me worse, but Rome wasn’t built in a day. I’ll keep at it.

My h triggers me. He can’t stop. I am coping with it in unhealthy ways. I am trying my hardest to stop, but fell into it yet again.

Now the depression has lifted as it usually does.

I want to make a disparaging remark about myself here now, but I won’t because the book says I shouldn’t.

‘tools to overcome habitual, negative judgments about yourself and others.
3. Emotion regulation skills help you to recognize more clearly what you feel and then to observe each emotion without getting overwhelmed by it. The goal is to modulate your feelings without behaving in reactive, destructive ways.“

I disengaged from my boyfriend’s drinking and smoking and drugging which then allowed me to disengage from him although I miss the physical closeness as he was very affectionate . We were together a year and he would give me flowers every month. He had previous girlfriends who he could just keep his drug and alcohol use away from and I have my own substance abuse issues so I had to leave the relationship as it triggered a relapse. I’m really trying to live and let live. He told me he has no desire to get sober. I did flee . He lives with his mom which also triggers me and I would fight with him about that. I am free of all that stress now. He was very loving and caring and nurturing.

Good move for you in the right direction. Isn’t one of the 12 steps to break ties with people who partake in the addiction? You now know you can’t be with someone who uses or you will fall back in. If you want to find a new relationship, look for someone who can lift you up instead of pull you down.