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  #1  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 07:45 AM
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rainbow8 rainbow8 is offline
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I felt bad after my session yesterday and I cried in my car and had trouble leaving the parking lot. Therapy is always the same for me and I'm getting depressed about it.

We did meditation first, which calmed me. Then I told her about my week, in which I was very busy and felt good and happy! But when I started talking about last session, it didn't go so well. It seems that I began saying how I felt sad about T "shattering my dreams" but I switched to something else and we didn't get back to it. We ended up talking about my H, which is important, I know. It's just another huge subject with no answers.

Early in the session I asked to draw me in the heart with T and little me, so I did it. Of course she asked how I felt about doing that, and I said I didn't like it, but I couldn't say more. It seems like everything I started today I stopped myself!

I pushed her away a little, maybe because I feel like I don't "have her anymore" anyway. She said she's not going anywhere, but that didn't help. At the end, she wanted to do "breathing through my heart". I had to put my hand on my heart and breathe, thinking of something I was grateful for. I didn't want to do it. I wanted to hold her hand, so she sat next to me and held one hand while I did it with the other. I wanted to be grateful for her holding my hand, but she wanted something in RL so I said my grandchildren, though she said it could be "holding her hand" if I wanted to. I felt too pathetic about that so I changed it. Then she said we could walk out together. She had to go to the bathroom and so did I, but I said we couldn't go together. Later I felt like a failure because I just should have gone with her. There are 4 stalls. Well, sorry for TMI.

I don't know what is wrong with me. My T never said I couldn't be close to her anymore, or that I had to "give her up." We did talk about part of me who wanted to "stop the pattern" but I couldn't stay with that either. I talked about her shattering my dreams again.

I made it clear to her that it felt like I had nothing left when she talked about my being there for my parts last week. She then asked if my parts know that there is a Self? That I should ask them! I didn't want to go there either and said I don't know if they know, and I still don't know what my Self is.

So, what was I doing today? I don't know!! I was too tired for therapy. I didn't really "see" her today except when I first came in and I noticed she looked good so I didn't want to feel anything for her.

Therapy is too hard for me now!!!

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  #2  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 08:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainbow8 View Post


It seems like everything I started today I stopped myself!

I felt too pathetic about that so I changed it.

Later I felt like a failure because I just should have gone with her.

I don't know what is wrong with me.

I couldn't stay with that either.

I was too tired for therapy.

I didn't want to feel anything for her.

Therapy is too hard for me now!!!
((((((((Rainbow))))))))

I just pulled a few quotes out because it seems like you are being so judgmental of yourself and of your therapy!

I know that when I start judging my feelings, everything gets way way harder. Maybe I feel like I love T. So, I love T, and it's okay. If I think "I shouldn't love T, loving T is pathetic, I always love people I shouldn't love" (or whatever) it throws this whole layer of judgement and pain on top of what is really a totally acceptable and okay feeling (and all feelings are acceptable and okay!).

If something we're talking about in session is too hard and I can't do it, it's so much easier if I can be gentle with myself like T is. I can tell myself "I dipped my toe in it" or "I let myself start feeling the feelings a little bit". If I tell myself "this is too big, I'll never get better, I can't do this", I just end up feeling so hopeless and awful.

Can you let yourself feel your feelings without judging them? When I am having a really hard time with something, T has me try to do it one out of ten times. So, if you think "I love T" ten times, could you allow yourself ONE time to add "and that is totally okay!"?

Be gentle with you, rainbow. Therapy brings up lots and lots and lots of big feelings. You can get through them. Maybe you can start by just allowing them to be there, just as they are.
Thanks for this!
rainbow8, Sannah, sittingatwatersedge
  #3  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 10:38 AM
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(((((((((((((( Rainbow ))))))))))))))
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  #4  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 12:08 PM
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Thank you very much, tree. That's good advice you're giving me and I wish I could follow it. I need to say, for example: "It's okay to still need T," "I'm working on building a Self," or I could say " I'll never be able to give up my pattern" 10 times, but once say "it's okay that I can't give it up yet".

But they're just words. I am still judging myself.

I still feel crummy!

Thanks, fuzzybear!
Thanks for this!
granite1
  #5  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainbow8 View Post
Thank you very much, tree. That's good advice you're giving me and I wish I could follow it. I need to say, for example: "It's okay to still need T," "I'm working on building a Self," or I could say " I'll never be able to give up my pattern" 10 times, but once say "it's okay that I can't give it up yet".

But they're just words. I am still judging myself.

I still feel crummy!

Thanks, fuzzybear!
the are good words rainbow. maybe you should bring this in to T to talk about this .i think it would be so awsome for you to feel ok about needing T in isn't a bad thing at all.

i was just wondering what dreams do you feel T is shattering?
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  #6  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 12:49 PM
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granite, good question. Thank you. I need to talk about it. The dream that T will be who I want and will always be there for me. I'm not sure that it's one person. It's a mother,sister (I never had one) close friend, and lover, all tied up into one person. I think it's an "impossible dream". Do you know that song? My dream for unconditional love and to be the heroine of a romance novel all wrapped into one. My dream that T will hold me forever and tell me that she loves me. That she loves me like she loves her children. All of that, which I know is ridiculous. That our relationship is REAL. You know, how Pinnochio was loved when he was wooden, but he wanted to be a REAL boy. I want that. I want therapy to be real life. I want much more than any one person can give another, even in real life.
I know it's unreasonable, but I ache when I write this. It's a real dream to me, though it's a fantasy. It's like a drug, but my Ts have all "shattered this dream". Understandably so, but I still want it anyway. Thank you for getting me to write this, granite. Maybe I will show it to my T.
Thanks for this!
Sannah
  #7  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 02:23 PM
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Rainbow, do you think you can envision trying to grow past the personal T relationship? I mean, to begin to see her more as a guide, someone behind the curtain sort of, while you focus your gaze on Rainbow's present life?
IDK, it seems that all this discontent may be a sign that you are about to start that transition, and it's for your healing. hugs to you ((((((((((( rainbow )))))))))))
Thanks for this!
rainbow8
  #8  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 05:00 PM
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((((rainbow)))) I just want to send big

For the frustration, the crying in the car, all of it

I still think you are so courageous and honest and I still admire you hugely for that, for just being lovable you!!
Thanks for this!
rainbow8
  #9  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 06:13 PM
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I just want to send big hugs too, Rainbow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rainbow8
She then asked if my parts know that there is a Self? That I should ask them!
Could be a good direction! Is there a downside to asking? Maybe just ask and see if an answer is given.
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  #10  
Old Jun 16, 2011, 06:41 PM
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Rainbow, therapy can be soo hard. i admire your courage for going in and talking to t about your real feelings. T must believe in you. Give yourself a break, you are doing the best you can.
i haven't cried in therapy yet but my car has seen lots of tears.

sending safe hugs
Thanks for this!
rainbow8
  #11  
Old Jun 17, 2011, 10:45 AM
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SAWE: Thank you. It's hard for me to see T "only" as a guide for my RL. The needs/wants get in the way, and that's where the conflict is.

She sent me my email today. I had written that it feels like she's rejecting me, and she said she understands. She thinks doing EMDR with the hurt parts will reallly help so that it becomes "less and less about being rejected by me and more feelings of peace in your real life." Then she said it's a slow process and we'll keep working on it together. She also said that "our strong relationship is a good foundation to do the more difficult therapeutic work."

In another email I asked if she thought how hard therapy was lately means it's progress but she didn't answer that.

I don't know what to think. I have peace in my RL but not in my therapy life! Therapy triggers the fantasies but I know it's transference. I'm still confused about it all; my brain can't make sense of my problem.

ECHOES: Thank you!

sunrise: My parts sense there is a Self, but I'm still not quite sure what the Self is supposed to be. T says it's calm and can lead the parts. I have to ask her more about that.

jbmomg: thank you I'm trying but it's so slow....i've never cried in therapy either.
  #12  
Old Jun 17, 2011, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by rainbow8 View Post
sunrise: My parts sense there is a Self, but I'm still not quite sure what the Self is supposed to be. T says it's calm and can lead the parts. I have to ask her more about that.
rainbow, your Self is not "supposed to be" what you or someone else thinks it should be. The Self just is. Maybe just look for what is already there... Discover what your Self already is before thinking how it could change to be what you or your T judges it is "supposed to be." It's like if someday in the future you want a diamond, which is formed from coal. If you go looking on the trail today for a diamond, you won't see it. (Not to say your Self is a lump of coal! But go looking for what is there now so you can find it more easily.)

I'm a little worried that is a bad analogy, but I hope you understand what I mean.
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  #13  
Old Jun 17, 2011, 11:53 AM
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Hey Rainbow8 ***huge hugs***

I could be wrong but is it the pain of the feelings you have for your therapist, the closeness you fully want but can't have, that is becoming so overwhelming and hard to accept that it is leading therapy to become so difficult each week?
Perhaps each week you go to your session hoping that she will fulfill our needs and then when you realise she won't, everything else feels hopeless at times?

I could be completely wrong here, I am kind of going by having followed your posts a lot and having that need myself I can understand its a painful place to be.
Thanks for this!
rainbow8
  #14  
Old Jun 17, 2011, 12:49 PM
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Sunrise, I'm basing it on what my T tells me about my Self being able to lead the parts, which is the basis of the IFS model. I don't know if that's different from the Self you're talking about. I understand your diamond analogy; what I don't understand is the concept of Self that my T always talks about. How "she" is acting like my Self now, and has been, and how yoga and meditation are building up my Self. So what is the Self anyway?

Dizgirl: I think you're right. The pain is what happens with T after T for me. I want them to be what they can't, and I know they can't, but I keep going after it anyway! My brain knows that I can't be that close to my Ts, but my heart keeps getting broken each time! My current T was and is, being so "nice" to me that I believed in my fantasy more. Yet she hasn't changed. She's caring and compassionate within boundaries, but I overreact to it. I did that with all my Ts. It's not a bad thing, but I don't seem to be able to let it go. I realize I have to, though, so I feel like I'm losing my T. The reality is that I'm not losing HER, just the dream of how I want her. I know it's transference but that doesn't make it any easier.
  #15  
Old Jun 17, 2011, 05:16 PM
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you are doing hard work rainbow, coming to terms with your pattern and working on changing it......huge hugs to you!
Thanks for this!
rainbow8
  #16  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 12:43 AM
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thank you, poetgirl. It's so nice to see you here again, though I wish you felt better.

I feel frustrated in therapy because I don't know how to stay with that sad child part. I know I need to do that in my session but I go off on tangents. I have to tell my T not to let me do that, or to do EMDR next week for sure. I don't want it to go so slowly but T keeps saying it's going to take time......sigh.......
  #17  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 02:27 AM
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Originally Posted by rainbow8 View Post
Sunrise, I'm basing it on what my T tells me about my Self being able to lead the parts, which is the basis of the IFS model. I don't know if that's different from the Self you're talking about. I understand your diamond analogy; what I don't understand is the concept of Self that my T always talks about. How "she" is acting like my Self now, and has been, and how yoga and meditation are building up my Self. So what is the Self anyway?
One way to think of the Self is that it is the ego state or part that uses the first person. The others are third person. For example, when I say, "I went to the store today" or "I am upset" or "I am tired", it is my Self who is speaking. We have other ego states (or parts as the IFS model calls them) that we may think of in the third person. "This ego state is sad" or "this part wants you to give her a hug" or "she is..." or "he is...." But for your Self, you use "I." I have also heard the Self referred to as the "Executive." When my T and I did ego state therapy, we worked on my Self being able to comfort some of my other ego states. I liked this work and it gave me confidence I could manage my ego states and help us be whole. But my T did not say my Self had to do this work in order to qualify as my Self, he just suggested this comforting function was something I could learn to do for my ego states who needed that. (In my situation, I did not expect my T to fill my ego states' needs, so it's a little different.) Anyway, just think of who you refer to in the first person, and you will have found your Self. (Unless you have DID, where the executive self switches around as various alters take over.) Rainbow, I do not know what your T means about yoga and meditation building up your self, but it sounds interesting and worthwhile.
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  #18  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 05:36 AM
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My old T brought up doing IFS several times, but we never did it. New T has said we would do it, but he hasn't yet. I have no idea who my real self is either...which voice, which love, which fear...clueless.
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  #19  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 10:10 AM
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sunrise, thanks for explaining more about the Self. I use "I" for the parts but my T keeps saying "it's a part of you, not all of you." That's the problem. I say "I am sad and want T" not "a part wants her, for example." She has to keep reminding me that I have parts. She also tells me, or used to, that my parts are running the show, whereas my Self is who we're trying to get to "run" it. I'm not sure who I am in the first person!

Maybe yoga and meditation help lessen anxiety so I can find my Self, or get centered. I know it's something like that.

I think it was easier for you because you don't have BPD. I have to work hard to want my Self, whatever it is, to want to comfort my parts. That's why T says she will be there too.

Wiki: IFS is very powerful and helpful. I hope you do it. Please post or send me a message about it if you do it!
  #20  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by rainbow8 View Post
I think it was easier for you because you don't have BPD. I have to work hard to want my Self, whatever it is, to want to comfort my parts. That's why T says she will be there too.
I wouldn't want to say that my therapy has been easier than another person's, but I do agree that you and I have different challenges.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rainbow
I say "I am sad and want T" not "a part wants her, for example." She has to keep reminding me that I have parts.
I would suggest that not always is it a part who says these things. Sometimes our Self is sad and wants comfort, love, positive regard from T too. How can your T be sure it is a part and not your Self feeling this? (I think it can be both, not just one or another.) I sometimes wonder if too much emphasis can be placed on parts vs. Self. All of our parts together are our Self. If a person says "I want to be close to you", it could feel invalidating if someone responds, "no, you don't, that's just a part saying that." It reminds me of how some Ts are uncomfortable with their client's feelings of closeness and say, "oh, that's transference."
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  #21  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 01:19 PM
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Okay, it's not helping me to discuss this anymore. I get too mixed up, but I appreciate your feedback about it, sunrise!
  #22  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 02:38 PM
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I know how hard this is, Rainbow. I appreciate and admire the courage you show in therapy and in sharing here on PC. I also appreciate the fact that you have the awareness to say "this isn't helping", and I know that feeling too. Sometimes talking about these things on PC is so incredibly helpful, and other times it just gets us all mixed up inside. Good for you for noticing and listening to that.

Also, for what it's worth, I have a very hard time with the concept of self, as well.
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rainbow8
  #23  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 02:48 PM
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Thanks, zoo. Hey, do you feel like we're the only ones here right now, LOL?
I meant the talking about the Self was confusing, not that I'm tired of my thread about my therapy. I guess you understood that.

I process so much all the time from my sessions and it is very difficult right now. I wish I could have therapy every day so I could get somewhere quicker and get my questions answered. Some questions have no answers, though. I have the idea that if I write and write, I will find the answers, but it doesn't work that way. My heart and brain are so much in conflict with each other that I can't take it anymore. I want to get all these feelings out already, but then I go into therapy and avoid the issues when T asks me something. I hate that! I'm frustrated. I don't want to be my Self, or myself, or whatever.
Thanks for this!
ECHOES
  #24  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 02:52 PM
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hugs, rainbow!
Thanks for this!
rainbow8
  #25  
Old Jun 19, 2011, 02:53 PM
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sometimes I just have to bail out on my own threads, and it's not because I don't appreciate the people who are willing to engage with me on the topic, it's just because sometimes it gets to be too much. I mean, processing is so helpful, but then sometimes I get to a place where I can't move ahead any further without T. It's almost like I'm doing therapy with her once a week and then doing therapy here all the rest of the time, and she has to catch up to where I am, lol.

I do the same thing, rainbow. I will sometimes talk about things incessantly all week, think about them until I want to chop my head off to shut my brain up, worry about not having enough time to say everything I want to T, and then get into her office and not be able to think or speak. So frustrating!
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rainbow8
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