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  #201  
Old Mar 03, 2018, 07:04 PM
Elio Elio is offline
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Member Since: Sep 2006
Location: in my head
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelly yallop View Post
I get what you're trying to convey in your replies to OP
The constant turmoil over texting/emailing/phone calls/extra appointments/how long a wait is reasonable to expect a response/quality and length and tone of response is exhausting just reading about it
In uk this level/flexibility of outside contact is extremely rare and for me is restricted to scheduling and twice in 4 years when I felt that a rupture needed describing from my perspective so that my therapist had an idea of how the following session might go where I was coming from etc like preparation for many other situations in life
I do feel it would be good to be able to contact outside session often but I know that I would either receive no response(for days if it was a Friday)or a formulaic unicorn fart of a response or a sorry to hear that we can talk about it next session -he just wouldn't engage with me-but I know that if I really needed help he would offer to call me (once in 4 years) as I don't ask or expect anything outside of session
It seems that therapists who encourage /foster the degree and variety of outside contact that is discussed on the forum are causing untold misery dependence and unrealistic expectations from their clients and I may get shot down for this but the extreme cases might be borderline abuse

My outside contact has been invaluable. The frequency has fluctuated over the months. The overall stress of getting a response and my feelings about T's response has improved significantly.
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  #202  
Old Mar 03, 2018, 10:06 PM
Elio Elio is offline
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It has been 2 weeks since I posted my in session notes. A work project has kept me very busy. Also, my sessions have been so random, almost incoherent. Thursday 2-22, I basically threw a tantrum (my type of tantrum), sitting on the floor wedged between the couch and the cabinet that holds her printer, barely fitting. I had the picture of the filing cabinet [supportive/bound object from clinic before T moved to private practice] and told her I was mad at her about it and about lots of other things. I told her I didn't want her to look at me. I have been struggling a lot with not feeling like I (Elio). I'm just me - whoever me is. I've had to remind myself that I am Elio even though in my head I'm saying to people not to call me that. It's moved to... ok, I'm supposed to be Elio, I can be Elio... how would Elio handle this, what does Elio like. A funny thing happened when I tried to tell T about not connecting to the name Elio... I said that I am not "birth name". As part of my gender, I legally changed my name about 20 yrs ago. That was weird moment.

I have isolated significantly. So, here is me forcing myself to reengage.

Last edited by Elio; Mar 03, 2018 at 10:52 PM.
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  #203  
Old Mar 03, 2018, 10:17 PM
Elio Elio is offline
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Member Since: Sep 2006
Location: in my head
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3-1 session:
I got to the office with 7 mins to spare - around back, through the doors, down the stairs, push the button, and into the waiting room. I am the only one in the waiting room. I sit down in the chair I usually use. I pulled up the stone language song on my MP3 player. It wasn't very loud and I thought it wouldn't be easy to share it with you. I checked my phone and it was a different copy and was louder. I thought that would work. I got up and took off my coat and pulled out my notebook and ! book. I sit and wait. I am the only one around and it seems like no one else is in the suite as well. I think about pulling out my blanket. I unzip my backpack and I hear your door open. I zip my backpack up. You came out and said hi, pushed the button and headed back to your office. I followed.

I came in and thought about taking my shoes off and putting my feet up on the couch. I sit my coat on the north side of me, leaving most the couch available so that if we want to put our feet up, it would not be in the way. I sit down and put my note book down. I moved the pillow. I look down and see you are in brown boots; well-worn boots.

I say Hi, you say Hi. Minor pause, then I ask you how you are doing. You think and say you are doing good. You comment on how I don't always ask. I agree I don't. You wonder what it means that I asked this time. I'm thinking that I asked today because I have nothing to talk about. Pause. More said. I say that I didn't want to come today. Not sure if you asked or if I just continued with that I didn't know why. I was thinking that I wanted to leave and felt like I was rocking a little in that impulse. I thought I needed to leave. What would you think if I did leave? More said. I said that earlier in the day I had a moment that I was angry with you; just out of the blue. I said that there had not been much feeling, that sadness would come in for a moment and then back to nothing. Then this anger towards you. I said that there was no reason for the anger. I continued saying that it's not an 'I don't know' why I was mad, there was no reason, I just felt anger. You wonder if the not wanting to come, the sadness, and anger towards you are linked.

I'm looking about the room. Pause. Ok not much going on. I actually think about getting up and going to look at the books on your bookshelf. I ask you if you have anything you want to talk about. You say that you do not want to rob me of my time to bring up anything I want. I say that I don't have anything and that it's been a while since I last asked you if you had anything you wanted to talk about. Pause. Then you said that you did want to ask about the insurances stuff. I said that oh, yeah I heard back from my work insurance and having them cover T was denied. I told you that they used some weird code that was like other medical reasons for why I wanted to see you. I told you that I had wanted to bring you the letter and that I had called to try to get more information regarding the reason for the denial. I said that we could appeal it, though I wasn't sure of the point. You said that you thought my work insurance was my primary because of it being where I worked verse being the dependent on my wife's insurance. I shrugged, I don't know but probably. You said it didn't really matter just that you'd have to bill through mine first then go to my wife's. You said something about my wife's paying the 2 x a week without audit. Last time we talked on this you said something about slowly increasing sessions. I'm in such a weird place - increase to see if that helps bring things back or give up, accept that this is life.

As the topic wound down you said stole a few moments of my time. I shrugged it off and mumbled something about there being lots of time today. Pause. Now what. Hmm I had wanted to play the stone language song again for a little while, so I pull out the phone and start the song. I said, remember this. You said yeah 2 yrs ago. I said almost 2 yrs ago. It was in May/June when I shared it right after your first vacation and then the emergency missed session. We listened to the song, all 5 mins of it. There, another 5 mins spent. Silence, now what?

We talked about a discussion that I had had with a friend a few weeks ago. You asked me what was on my mind about it. I paused then said that I wanted to know why one negative thing can get in so deep and get stuck. You said maybe this, maybe that. You said that maybe it was a way to put up a wall to keep me from having to look at things, an excuse; something we have to navigate around. You pondered if I thought if I could convince my friend, I could convince myself. I told you that I wasn't trying to convince her anymore. You brought up the older boy and talked about him using things like this as a way to create rules, protect, and defend. I think you said something about the net here. You said that you are just guessing, that you don't know, brainstorming. I must have been giving you some type of non-verbal communication of disbelief or something for you to have said that. I think I was yeah yeah'ing you. Not really listening. You asked me what I thought. I said that I think it was because those statements fed into my fears; played into them.

I said the "always asking for stuff from you" and the "drama, that there is always drama and if there isn't something, then I come up with something", that has made it hard for me to talk about anything because what if all this is just life, the human condition. You asked me something. I said that at first, I was able to say that hey, this is therapy. It's about unpacking your drama. You said snapshots, you agreed with my statement about unpacking your drama. You asked about now. I said that what if none of it is real, what if I'm making stuff out of nothing. I teared up when I was saying that. You commented on my tearing up and asked me if I knew where the tears were coming from.

Long pause…. I looked at the floor for a long time. How do I tell you that I don't want to live this life? I look up at you and then down again. I was not grinding my teeth. This was not something that wanted out and I was holding in. This was something that I wanted to say but couldn't get the words out. I looked at you again and again back to the floor. I wanted to be looking in your eyes when I said this. I think I wanted you to see how dead I feel inside, I'm not sure. Maybe I wanted you to see the truth of my statement. Finally you said that this is hard for me to say. I nod. I look up again and start to speak and stop. You laugh and comment on my start, I laugh and say almost. Another short pause. I looked up at you and said that if this is life, I don't want to live it. You wanted to know what the 'this' was. Yep, I felt this was the indirect risk assessment portion of the session. How do you answer this question… 'this'… everything, what you see before you. I made some statement. You asked me to clarify to be specific on the 'this' and something from this new statement I don't remember. How do I explain to you what's going on inside when it's just so dead in there. I tried to explain that I didn't want the human experience anymore, I followed that up with my human experience. You asked me what living was. I didn't have words. Pause.

You were talking, I don't know what you were saying. I went back to my phone and got the song again. I started the song and jumped to the middle. I actually went past where I wanted to be, I found a good spot. You said that is living. I said yes. It I let the song play out until it got really quiet and turns deeper/darker. I said that this is my life. More was said, then you asked if I saw images when I listened to the song. I said yes. You wanted me to describe them. Again words failed me. How do one describe what it is I sense. I said that they are pictures but not pictures. So, I went back to the beginning of the song and started it again. I hummed to it and moved my hand the way the sound moves… a type of conducting in a way, I guess. I stopped humming after the first intro, and continued doing the hand movements for a bit longer. You had a smile on your face - delight(?). I was some embarrassed to show you (show anyone). I think I stopped humming because of being embarrassed. I continued the hand movements because you looked happy. [Afterwards of course I come up with words. I see the sheet music, I see the orchestra/the players and the instruments that make the noise, and I see the movement of the sound.]

When I was done, you said something about it being movement. You pondered what it would be like to draw it. I said I don't draw. I'm thinking - you can't draw what I just did. And yeah what a psychology thing to do, draw and analyze, I don't think so. I did not like this idea at all. I am pretty darn certain that is not what you were getting at, still that is where my head went. You seemed really excited about that idea. You talked about even if it was just scribbles, what colors would I pick… and… yeah, no… I don't like this idea… hmmm colors would I pick?

Somehow, I moved us back to talking about the discussion with friend. You asked me if I was exhausted after that discussion. I pondered that, trying to remember, I think I answered not really. I'm not sure. Thinking about it after, no I was pretty rev'ed from it. I was frustrated and mad. I was also worried and sad. I told you that I'd been talking with her some and she had realized that I was holding back with her. You asked me if I was still talking with another friend. I said that I was but not much last few days. I said that I had not posted on the forum in a long time, that I had not even gone to look at it in several days before today. I said some stuff about nothing I had to say was important, had value, was it really what I was experiencing.

We got back to talking about living and not wanting to feel dead inside. You said that you thought I knew there was more to things; that you thought I experienced them. I remember last year after I was past the worst of it with my arms/chest surgery, there was a period of time (short) where everything felt really good - the end of last April/beginning of May. You said "you go away and you come back". (I don't know where this statement was in this part of the conversation.) I thought about that for a moment, it was an interesting statement, one I think I want to come back to. I said that was a very long time ago. I started crying again during this talk; just a few tears and snobbery.

At one point I also talked about how I wasn't sure about what was in my head was real, if any of it was really important or meant anything. I recalled how hard it had been for me to get to accepting that in therapy all of it is important. And now I'm back to doubting.

I asked please can I have some tissue. You said something about me asking (thanked me?)You got me the tissue and I took one, you said to take as many as I needed. You sat the box on the floor in front of me. That irritated me a little and then I had an inner laugh about me and the battle with the tissue. It didn't bother me to ask this time, I was grateful that you provided, that you gave me some. [FYI PC: based on where I sit, I am unable to reach the tissue and I always have to ask for it. I have ranted to her about always having to ask in my journal but not brought it up in person. This is the first time she's left it within my reach.]

Then you said that you had a question. You asked about when we'd do the puzzle from Christmas. I was thinking that it was your puzzle, you decide when and where you put it together. I said that I had thought that we might do it today because of not having anything to talk about. I shrugged about when we'd do it. Did I say it was up to you? It is, it is your puzzle, not mine. You don't have to wait for us to put it together.

Our time was up. I fumbled some at gathering my stuff and I wasn't sure about telling you I love you. I did not put my stuff in my bag.

me: (tears) I want to come home.

you: you will

me: I want to feel again

you: you will

me: thank you

you: you are welcome… …my joy

me: I love you

you: I know

As I was packing up, I was packing up to leave, I commented about needing to get a bigger backpack if I was going to keep carrying my blanket around. You said maybe it brings comfort. I said something about not pulling it out. You said something about get comfort just from being able to see it, because the zipper was slightly open. That was not intentional; however, I did see it at one of the times I was looking down and couldn't find words. It did bring some comfort seeing it as well as some embarrassment of not getting the zipper all the way closed. I wondered if you thought that was on purpose.

I picked up my bag and went to get up. I noticed it was 6pm on your clocks (which I also know they have ran fast in the past so I wasn't too upset about it). As we were moving to the door, you told me to take care of myself the best I can. See you…. And I said Monday. Out the door, I turned and closed it. I thought about, oh yeah, I had wanted to ask you how late you see people on Tuesdays. I know you sometimes see someone after me on Thursdays. I get done with personal training at 5pm. I thought about opening the door and asking and I remembered how late it was. And I'm still not sure about it.

I was a little lost in my head as I left. I had to think hard about what my next steps were, go down the hallway… oh look someone is here in the waiting area…. Up the stairs.. Keep walking… I worried that I might not have left you enough time between sessions. At the top of the stairs, through the door. I put my coat on and looked for my badge. This took me a while cuz things just weren't working right in my head. When I finally made it to the other door, someone had been sitting on that side of the hallway. I was a bit embarrassed by me taking so long to get sorted. I headed out and walked to the train… to home.
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  #204  
Old Mar 04, 2018, 08:42 AM
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SalingerEsme SalingerEsme is offline
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[QUOTE

I have isolated significantly. So, here is me forcing myself to reengage.[/QUOTE]

Elio, I have missed you very much. So glad you are here.
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  #205  
Old Mar 04, 2018, 11:05 AM
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Lemoncake Lemoncake is offline
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Re email contact. R acknowledges my emails and we discuss in person during the next session.

The other psychiatrist I saw briefly offered out of session contact three days a week 6-10pm.

For me I like the idea of having a safety net in the background. That he's "there" if I need him.
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  #206  
Old Mar 04, 2018, 02:43 PM
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junkDNA junkDNA is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonesomeTonight View Post
T again today. I'm not including the whole session today, just one particularly important exchange. After exchanging some small talk, I said I had something I wanted to share with him and pulled out my printout. He asked if I wanted to read it to him or have him read it. I said either way was fine. He opted to read it while I stared out the window at the tree branches blowing in the wind. I was scared of what he'd say, that he would say he couldn't say or do what I wanted. That it just wasn't him.

Here's what I handed him:
"So, with the attachment stuff: I need you to understand that this is going to be a difficult process for me that's going to necessitate a lot of talk about and focus on my relationship with you, as part and parcel with the other work.
Here's a quote from a therapy book my friend shared with me that seemed to ring true: 'Rather than feeling comforted by the therapeutic relationship or by the growing closeness that usually occurs as a natural, healthy outgrowth of psychotherapy, the attach parts can often have the opposite reaction. As they feel “closeness” at long last, it is both a relief and a trigger. Their fears of abandonment and sensitivity to empathic failure typically intensify, often leading to increasing demands on the therapist’s time and energy.'

I think that also helps explain why I keep shifting back and forth between feeling more secure with you and then more doubtful. I'm sure the December rupture with [MC] contributed to those feelings of insecurity, too. The whole authority figure/nurturer thing.

Part of me wants reassurance, but I get the sense that's not your style, and I know it also doesn't tend to be as helpful in the long-term. But it's like I want validation that I want that. Does that make sense? Like: 'I understand what you're looking for here, that you want reassurance. I'm not going to give you that. But I do understand where the want/need is coming from.'

I know this isn't your intention. But when you talk about things like my attachment to you compared to other clients--even with you saying it's just an observation, not a judgment--it brings up feelings of shame in me. Like I'm feeling/doing something inappropriate. Like I'm being "bad" almost. I assume those feelings are coming from some other place, likely childhood. But that's part of why I react so strongly to certain things you say and why they keep flying around in my head. I don't think we've talked about this much--it will definitely come out more as we delve into parents/childhood stuff--but shame and guilt are big issues for me. This is something that [ex-T] pointed out multiple times, and she felt badly about it, but it's like she didn't know how to address it. Or maybe I wasn't ready to address it then?

I feel like I'm looking for you to say some magic words to make me feel secure and OK about the attachment stuff. Because I think I need to feel fairly secure to delve into other stuff (childhood, etc.). But I don't know what those words are (which doesn't seem very fair to you...). I think it's something to the effect of, 'I feel confident in my abilities to handle this and work through this with you. I can't promise I'll always understand or that I'll say and do the right thing, and of course I can't promise not to hurt you, but I'll do my best. I want to work with and help you.'"
He finished reading it and said it all sounded reasonable and made sense. I said OK, that was good to hear. He said he felt comfortable with the last sentence, like he felt he could say it to me. I wasn't sure if he meant just last actual sentence or last part. But I said OK. Then he said that he wanted to say it to me. I said OK, still unsure of what he meant. He went on to say: "I feel confident in my abilities to handle this and work through this with you. I can't promise I'll always understand or that I'll say and do the right thing, and of course I can't promise not to hurt you, but I'll do my best. I want to work with and help you." He made lots of eye contact in the last part.

Then he said again that he wanted to work with me. I said how in the past, he'd said that he couldn't ethically abandon me. He said, "I said that, really?" I said yes, in one of our first sessions. And that it made me feel like he was saying, "Well, I started with you, I'm stuck with you now!" He said he felt bad about that impression. And how if it was a case where he didn't think he could help me, he would have said that and referred me elsewhere.

Rest of session was about various stuff, but that's what stuck with me. That he read what i said I needed and...said he could give me that. Which...I was just expecting him to say he either wouldn't or couldn't. So in a way I'm confused, and in another way I'm really comforted. I'm just having trouble processing it all, I think. Like, wait, maybe he is ready and willing to deal with this stuff? Maybe he is in it for the long haul? (However long that is...) I just...in some ways I feel I should be doing backflips. But it's like I'm equal parts comforted and terrified...The joys of insecure attachment, I guess?
My t said kinda the same thing you wish to hear. He said he understood where my need for his attention comes from and he wishes he could give it to me. It helped explain what was going on with it. He knows I have this deep yearning, and he's weaning me off of it. It is so painful. We talk about the process at times. It's definitely helpful to discuss it
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  #207  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 07:31 AM
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captgut captgut is offline
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So I told T about how he has hurt me. He said "You're right, I'm tired and irritated lately... My second baby was born at the end of January".

Ooops. I felt like I was slapped.

I mean, I'm glad for him... And I glad he has two boys, because if he had a daughter it would literally kill me. But... I feel like devastated. Now I'm even less important. And I hate myself even more. I should stop seeing him in such a difficult time I guess. He should take care of his wife and babies.

I can't stand it. He's happy, loved, beautiful, with a great job and so on. And I'm a piece of ****.
Possible trigger:


My jealousy is killing me. I know I'm wrong here. But I just can't. Just can't.
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  #208  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 08:10 AM
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LonesomeTonight LonesomeTonight is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captgut View Post
So I told T about how he has hurt me. He said "You're right, I'm tired and irritated lately... My second baby was born at the end of January".

Ooops. I felt like I was slapped.

I mean, I'm glad for him... And I glad he has two boys, because if he had a daughter it would literally kill me. But... I feel like devastated. Now I'm even less important. And I hate myself even more. I should stop seeing him in such a difficult time I guess. He should take care of his wife and babies.

I can't stand it. He's happy, loved, beautiful, with a great job and so on. And I'm a piece of ****.
Possible trigger:


My jealousy is killing me. I know I'm wrong here. But I just can't. Just can't.
I'm sorry you're feeling this way. I can understand the jealousy. Please don't feel like you should stop seeing him though. It's his choice to come to work and still do his job, despite having a young baby. Talk to him about your feelings of jealousy and also that you shouldn't bother him during this time. And stay safe.
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  #209  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 08:14 AM
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SalingerEsme SalingerEsme is offline
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Capgut, I relate to what you say very much. Your T having a second baby DOES impact you, and does suck his attention - it is a stage of life that is often fraught with exhaustion and conflict inside a marriage. It isn't aways( usually) romantic and happily-ever-after; He probably wants to get out of that house and get to work! Even though I know all this too well, I am still jealous of my T's wife. What makes me fee better, is reflecting on how difficult marriage is- long ones- and how much kids vampire energy even while giving joy. I think your T's time with you he will often prefer to the long struggle of meeting babies and wife's needs.I truly do.
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  #210  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 09:02 AM
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ElectricManatee ElectricManatee is offline
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Argh, Captgut. That was not a particularly kind or helpful way for him to drop that huge piece of information on you. I have had something similar happen with my T, and I was devastated. I hope you can talk to your T about how you feel about what he said. I have a sense of the intense feelings you're going through right now, and I think it's totally normal that you're reacting this way. I'm guessing your T was trying to validate you feeling upset with him by telling you why he has seemed preoccupied, and I'm sorry that his response was so incredibly destabilizing for you.
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  #211  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 10:32 AM
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junkDNA junkDNA is offline
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My t had his first child this year. I was majorly jealous and I told him. I said it's not fair his baby has great parents and is set up with a good loving family. I was very excited for him though , I know he loves being a dad. But i still want him as MY dad. My dad only
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  #212  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 06:50 PM
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ruh roh ruh roh is offline
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After leaving my keys on the car seat while I went in to a mall in a sketchy area (amazingly, it was not stolen), I went to session and forgot to turn on the recorder. So I don't remember a whole lot, except that my therapist seemed completely normal and warm, like her old self. I think the big difference, to be honest, was my frame of mind.

We worked through a lot of things that have been happening with me. She also cleared up that she would totally visit me in the hospital if that ever happened, that she does do that for people. I had thought, after the incident with the cold last week, that she would not go to a hospital, but she said that's different. So I feel better about that.

Except for being so spacey and forgetful, I was feeling better going in to session as well as leaving. When we wrapped up and I saw that the recorder was off, I said today would have to be a rehearsal for next week, when I bring up the same things again.
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  #213  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 09:23 PM
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As soon as I walked into her office, T immediately apologized for the e-mail issue we had last week and explained that it was totally her misunderstanding and that I had done nothing wrong. That was a huge relief for me and a weight off my shoulders! We talked about a lot of things that I mentioned in my e-mail to her, similar topics to last week–– except this time I got much more emotional. I could feel myself getting angry, and sad, and letting those emotions out vocally instead of just laughing and pushing them aside like I usually do. And probably 2/3rds of the way through the session, my brain just... shut down. I totally couldn't form words or speak in coherent sentences for a good five minutes. T said it was probably because I had such an intense wave of emotion that my amygdala reacted and cut access to the prefrontal cortex. It was so strange to feel so much and have such a physical reaction, because when I'm not in therapy I'm stuck in such an emotionally stunted environment... it was nice to feel, though. T asked me what was going on in my body when my mind turned off, and I said I felt like I might cry but that I didn't want to talk about it or sit with it, and she understood. And I am so grateful for that. It's a process to learn how to feel and let myself be emotional again. Rough day, but I felt good leaving.
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  #214  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 10:28 PM
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Went back, sat down. He commented on how I had my usual sparkling water. I said he had his usual coffee. He asked what I wanted to talk about, and I gave brief update on H's shoulder injury. T seemed concerned and compassionate. I said I had brought the homework from a few weeks ago with the Imago exercise (about stuff from childhood and my caregivers), so maybe we could work on that today? He said OK and went to his filing cabinet to look for the materials.

He got them, went back to his seat. He said the way this worked was he was going to have me read out my responses, then he'd fill them in, sort of "Mad Libs" style (something we both know since we're about the same generation). We went to start, and he said, joking, "OK, give me an adjective." I laughed, and he explained how to do the first part. Basically, I'd listed positive and negative traits of my mother and father and had to pick 2-4 most positive and 2-4 most negative. I read them to him, he wrote some stuff down, said OK.
Then on to next part. In that one, I had a statement of what I wanted most from my parents, about acceptance for who I am, mentioning stuff about mental illness (OCD and anxiety as a kid). He said, "Can I say something like, 'wanted to be accepted as I am, warts and all?' I mean, I know you don't have any warts, but..." I said that was fine.

Next part was sharing childhood memories and the emotions associated with them. I listed various things. When I got to one about my grandmother, I got a bit emotional, saying how we'd been close and she'd passed a few years ago. He said he was sorry. Talked about her a bit. Back to list. For one of them near the end, an emotion I listed was "feeling special."

I forget how this came up, but I mentioned something about generally being a teacher's pet. He said, "Wow, that's really interesting--the last person I did this with, she also mentioned being a teacher's pet, and one of her emotions was 'feeling special.'" I said I thought that was interesting, too. Talked some about how it's like teachers appreciated certain parts of me, that maybe my parents didn't? He seemed to think that made sense.

Then frustrations of childhood and how I dealt with them (an option could be "I didn't react"). Went through all those. Then it was time for him to read stuff back to me. First he did more explanation about the whole Imago thing, how the idea is that we subconsciously look for a mate to figure out childhood stuff. But then we're doing this subconsciously, and our mate has no idea what we're doing, so they don't give us what we're looking for.

So what he read to me was, for example, the stuff I said was negative about my parents, were things I was attracted to or perceived about my partner. It mostly seemed to fit the latter, like I perceived my H to be critical...but maybe he actually isn't? Next part was saying what I try to get them to be (positive traits of parents), like playful/silly, a good confidante. I said that seemed to fit.

Then it said I wanted that "So that I can be accepted and understood for who I am, 'warts and all.'" That part made me pause--it really resonated with me. I asked if this is just about my H, or other relationships in my life. He said could be about anyone. I said it made sense. He said how that seemed to fit why I connected so much with MC, how it seemed he gave me that. I started crying and said yes, many times, and how that's why it was so hard when it felt like he rejected me for my feelings.

He continued on, saying how what I wanted was to feel, "happy, connected, loved, accepted, and special." I said yes... Then it was ways I stop myself from getting that, such as "shutting down" (won't include them all here).

It all really seemed to fit. And it just...I don't know, it was kind of overwhelming how it seemed to go together. Like so much made sense. I said how I assumed this would be a starting point for other discussions, and he agreed. I said I'd have to process it over the next few days.

I knew it was about time to stop and mentioned that. He asked how I was feeling, and I said generally OK but a bit overwhelmed because it was a lot of stuff. He said he was sorry for taking us right to the end like that, how he generally tries to have more time to wrap up. I said it was OK. That it wasn't like I was an emotional wreck (I actually wasn't at all!), those would be more the times when it would be a problem. He said OK.

Got out phones to schedule. He said, "I'm really sorry, I forgot to mention before that I'm out Friday." I said actually he'd mentioned it a couple weeks ago, and it was OK. He said he could offer me Thursday morning. I asked if I could think about it, and he said to just let him know 24 hours ahead, that he wasn't putting anyone else in that spot. (Spoiler alert--I already accepted Thursday session). We scheduled for next Tuesday.

He said he'd make me a copy of what he'd written, did that, and gave it to me. I've looked at it a few times since then--it feels different seeing my feelings in someone else's handwriting. I paid, while discussing the weather, we shook hands (he stood up this time), he said, "Take good care," I said, "You too" and headed out.
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  #215  
Old Mar 06, 2018, 10:33 PM
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Last session before he leaves, sorta. My next session is next week, a few days later than usual, so its on the day he flies out, I thought it was a great idea then but now I am hating it, too long before I can see him again and when I do, he leaves. ugh

Anyway, it was ok, he still was recovering so on meds and not completely with it. sucked but I also understood. Kept it light, I didn't get into any of the deeper stuff I've been emotional about, I usually change my mind when I get there, I just hate emotional stuff so I avoid it as much as I can.

He mentioned how we seem to be at a part of my life where things seem good and I just nodded even though it's not the case.

I'm depressed and I miss him already. Regret not making the most of tonight.

LT-- glad your session went well.
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  #216  
Old Mar 07, 2018, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DP_2017 View Post
Last session before he leaves, sorta. My next session is next week, a few days later than usual, so its on the day he flies out, I thought it was a great idea then but now I am hating it, too long before I can see him again and when I do, he leaves. ugh

Anyway, it was ok, he still was recovering so on meds and not completely with it. sucked but I also understood. Kept it light, I didn't get into any of the deeper stuff I've been emotional about, I usually change my mind when I get there, I just hate emotional stuff so I avoid it as much as I can.

He mentioned how we seem to be at a part of my life where things seem good and I just nodded even though it's not the case.

I'm depressed and I miss him already. Regret not making the most of tonight.

LT-- glad your session went well.
I'm sorry, DP. From reading posts on here, seems like T's don't tend to do so well in sessions when they're sick. Is there any chance of changing your session to your usual day instead of the day he's leaving?
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  #217  
Old Mar 07, 2018, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by LonesomeTonight View Post
I'm sorry, DP. From reading posts on here, seems like T's don't tend to do so well in sessions when they're sick. Is there any chance of changing your session to your usual day instead of the day he's leaving?
I probably could but I think it would be better for me on that actual day. I have weird issues with jealousy and such so knowing I am the last one he sees before he flies out, is comforting. No one else ever really takes that spot so I'm sure come Monday if I decide I need it instead he could get me in

He did say I can call him for a bit Tues if I need to. I may but idk. I already feel annoying and needy and I hate it.
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  #218  
Old Mar 07, 2018, 06:43 PM
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Today, I basically talked to T about my social anxiety and told him what was going on. I talked about how my H gets stressed when I get "crazy". I take days off because it becomes way too much for me and I need a break to slow my system down. I don't want to feel ashamed of myself or humiliated, but I feel that way. I don't want to stress out H, but it happens. I want to be normal. I feel like I am so angry at all of this. I feel out of control, like how do I handle this expertly?

I felt disconnected from T today for some reason. The session went quickly and almost seems like a blur. I asked for an extra session to help me through all of this. So I see him next Tues. and Wed.

Until then, I am going to employ some kind of strategy to help me through. What? I dont' know. 1) The stay in my room at work strategy.

I don't know if T or anyone knows how painful and terrifying this is because words don't do it justice. I am so angry at this that I am going to get through this just out of spite. I don't care how it is done, even if I have to learn not to care what others think of me. I have some research to do on not caring I guess.
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  #219  
Old Mar 08, 2018, 08:07 AM
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I was worried she'd (1) forget about the emails I sent or (2) be mad about the emails I sent. But neither was true. I started by reporting in what ways I had "pushed my boundaries" over the past week, where here it is good to push myself - so examples include walking the dog. And I reported the ways I had not done this - e.g. not gone with the family to watch movies in a crowded cinema.

Then she asked if I was ready to talk about my emails - talking about the time before or after the attempt or the actual attempt. So I did a bit. I appreciated that she gave me feedback and told me I seemed depressed. I knew I was moving super slowly. I had asked her a while back to tell me when she thinks I am depressed so this helped. On the way out she made sure I was safe. She asked, 'is there anything else I can do?' I said no. Of course the answer is no. She cannot see me more than 1x a week. I can write emails and she responds - I'm still here and not going away. But she doesn't offer phone calls. I am basically stuck with the ickiness of emotions until next Wednesday.

I know I was overwhelmed by negative thoughts from Wed last week through this past weekend. I was taking all my meds then. I got my emotions in control by relying on my ED to get other things in control. By Tuesday I was feeling strong. But I knew I wanted to discuss the attempt in t, so I stopped some of my meds so that I could access those deeper emotions. When she asked in session if I had been taking all my meds, I said yes. I lied because how else can I access those deeper feelings if my meds make them inaccessible?
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  #220  
Old Mar 08, 2018, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Anastasia~ View Post
Until then, I am going to employ some kind of strategy to help me through. What? I dont' know. 1) The stay in my room at work strategy.

I don't know if T or anyone knows how painful and terrifying this is because words don't do it justice. I am so angry at this that I am going to get through this just out of spite. I don't care how it is done, even if I have to learn not to care what others think of me. I have some research to do on not caring I guess.
Just wanted to say that I understand. I feel your words and they resonate. I get the trap that is social anxiety.
  #221  
Old Mar 08, 2018, 09:39 AM
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‘Am I glad to see you!’
‘That was a nice greeting, I think?’
R came in and sat down, and said:
‘You’ve either had a good week, or it has been really tough.’
‘Frankly, I have been a bit of a mess since last session.’
‘A bit of a mess? What do you mean?’
‘With where we ended up last week –I think you know how hard that was for me to talk about… I knew it, but I underestimated the impact of actually saying it out loud. And then I dragged it out and waited until the end of the session before saying what I needed to say.’
‘Is there something there about when it came up? Is there anything we can put into place to help you feel more grounded?’
‘I think it’s about having 10 minutes at the end to make sure that I’m back in the room.’
‘Do you feel it left you more open than usual?’
‘Absolutely –I dealt with Friday’s pottery class by being very quiet. I was there and I was participating, but I wasn’t really there.’
‘What came up for me then as you said that is that it sounds like a very lonely place to be.’

‘Yes – I got through that and was sitting with a support worker on Friday night making my dinner when I glanced at the calendar. 25th of February, 25th of February…what’s important about the 25th of February? It came to me like treacle, the way things always do now when I have to work for them. 12 years since I met Chris.’

‘And is that something you feel that you should have remembered?’

‘It’s a happy date that I want to remember rather than all of the other dates.’

‘I am remembering your timeline in the early sessions. You had it all laid out in – not numerical – what’s the word for when it’s in date order?’

‘Chronological.’

‘Thank you.’

‘I failed to realise that I had been talking about the 25th out loud – so I said ‘It’s the twelfth anniversary of meeting my best friend.’ No sooner had I said that than I felt I had to explain.

‘You felt you had to?’
‘She asked ‘Are you going to meet up?’ I gave a surface level explanation, and was still feeling funny on Saturday, so I sat down to make a collage, and for the first time I couldn’t even start. I put a piece of paper down and last week’s TV guide, and nothing. I feel like I am past the point where I can make this pretty.’

‘Make this pretty? Is that what you feel you’ve been trying to do?’

‘Yes…and it’s getting scary again. I say that as if it magically stopped being scary at some point.’

‘Intensifying?’

‘Yes, that’s it.’

‘You sound lost, Lost. “I can’t make a collage, I can’t write…”’

‘Yes – full body bristling, shoulders hurting…and come the night I am back in the ****ing bathroom.’

‘It sounds as though you are angry about that.’

‘I don’t want to be subjected to it again and again. I don’t ****ing understand why my brain takes me to that place.’

‘It’s as if you want to say “Just **** off!”’

‘I have. I have been talking to my Chilean psychoanalyst friend about this, and he tells me it is like quicksand: “How do you get out of quicksand?” Somewhere in the back of my mind – ‘Stop struggling.’’

‘And that makes sense to you?’

‘Yes – but when I stop struggling and allow myself to feel it, things come up that I am not always comfortable with.’

‘When you talk about allowing yourself to feel it, are you talking about here in this space, or at night?’
‘I am talking about at night. I am aware that it is not the safest way.’

I continued: ‘I hate using the two experiences as a comparison, but the night I heard that Chris was going to die, it was very different. I read the news I didn’t want to hear, and then I put a specific song on – which is why I have a complex relationship with ‘Here Comes the Sun’. Mum was on the phone at the time, so I couldn’t share the news, but within ten minutes I sat down with a cup of tea, and I couldn’t stop shaking. There was nothing I could have done about that, but it felt like something moved through. Nothing got stuck. My actual emotional reaction…Oh, God…I am a robot.’

‘What do you mean? You were talking, and then it was ‘I’m a robot.’’

‘That is a euphemism for crying. My actual emotional reaction. It took me five days to cry, and then it wasn’t my own grief. Jonathan, whoever they were, had posted a message wishing Chris’ son a happy 12th birthday, five days after his mother’s death, and that was what…and that was what set me off. It was controlled, though.’
‘Controlled? That jumped out at me…I’ll own it. For me, crying is an emotional release amongst other things…not something you can control.’

R then mentioned that she notices the difference when I talk about Chris:

‘There is no confusion or frustration. There is sadness – ‘I miss my friend, and it’s really sad she’s gone.’’

R and I spoke a little about how she didn’t feel that I was speaking freely from my feelings.

‘I can sense that there’s a process going on, where you filter what you want to say – a kind of holding back.’

‘I know I am safe right here, right now, but when I am in that between space, the sense of safety disappears.’

R then mentioned that she had spent most of the session leaning over the arm of the sofa trying to see my face.

‘When you are in that space, I can’t see your face at all…your hair goes forward, your head goes down…’

She gave the ten minute warning I had requested as a safety measure, and I then said:

‘I feel profoundly disconnected from everything at the moment.’

‘As you say that, I feel a sadness.’

‘So, I feel that reconnecting with the emotions I squashed back then is key…but I think it would help, as we’ve discussed before, if I could hold your hand whilst I’m talking, so that I am still ‘connected’ to you.’

‘Connected physically.’

‘Next week, I want to cut the rubbish and get straight to it.’

‘I don’t feel like you are talking to me.’
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Where the sky is wide, and the clouds are few
A man can see his way clear to the light
Just hold on tight, that's all you gotta do...'

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'You have all the grace you need for today, and today is all that matters.' - Steve Austin
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  #222  
Old Mar 08, 2018, 10:19 AM
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Saw t yesterday . It went very well. He is proud of my progress . He said I'm taking care of myself and seem to be doing a lot better . He asked me a question about my CSA. It hit me like a brick wall. I grimaced and turned away . T said what happened, did the voices come back? I said no, that just hit me like a brick wall, I was not ready for that. He said yes it seemed like it. He got me some coloring books and markers, saying we can use distraction. I was affected by it the rest of the day, but am doing okay today. I see him again in a week
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  #223  
Old Mar 10, 2018, 09:01 AM
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This is long. I'm sorry.

Yesterday I started talking about something that had just happened at work. I was really upset, but said I didn't want to spend a lot of time on it. That led to a brief conversation about agency and the things that I can do that help to restore a balance. I talked about how my trainer at the gym has been helpful. I enjoy when I throw the slam balls. Something about the kinetic energy. He said, "what's the substitute's name?" I told him and he said, "wow, that'd be a great name to yell when you do the ball slams." It really is. I may have to try when I'm in the gym this weekend.

Then he said there was something he wanted to talk about, and I instantly felt a pit in my stomach. I waffled and said that I didn't want to know, but anticipation, so he was like, well let's just cut through it? He handed me a thick stack of paperwork. An advanced directive in the event of a mental health crisis that he wants me to fill out. I mused about shredding the whole thing, but I'll fill it out before the next appointment. He said no rush, we did a lot of it in last session verbally.

Then he asked how I was when I left the last session. I said I don't remember most of it. That I was in the room in body, but not in spirit. He said he had gotten that vibe last time. I said I remembered talking about puppies, and he said he liked that conversation a lot because it was a good example of me exerting my boundaries. I said he made it sound more cognitive than it was. I said I didn't want to talk about something anymore, he asked me what I did want to talk about, and I blurted out an answer. He said my brain took over in a moment of hyperarousal. That I was overloaded and it was protecting me. That it seems like my brain is very, very good at trying to protect me.

I went back to the question. I said more of last week was coming back to me. I'd gone out with a friend for dinner where we discussed mental health, and I'd become really activated. That I'd said I thought I was doing better than I am, and her response, or at least the way I interpreted it, was that I'm not doing well at all. That I was a broken mess. He thanked me for sharing that.

I sighed and started to shut down. I felt like his response was hollow. I said something along the lines of how stupid this all was. How stupid therapy was. He asked point blank, "do you want to be here?" I said yes and no. He asked why I did. I said that deep down there was some part of me that is hopeful that I can be happy for more than 45 seconds at a time. That someday I could live an actualized life.

He said that it was obvious that I was working hard. I said how so? He replied that something we'd discussed quite a bit was how hard H and I are trying to have a child. How it is evidence of future thinking, and that he thought from the way I discuss my students that I'd likely be a caring and compassionate mom.

That gave me pause. I sat silently for a moment, sad. I thought about how hard the infertility journey has been, how badly I want a child, etc. I got misty, but then I shut down pretty quickly. I threw up my hands and groaned. "What's wrong, Daisy?" I said that it was stupid how I can't cry in therapy anymore. That I'm a natural crier, and it's usually cathartic for me.

He said that what I'd shared about my therapy history made the fact that I can't cry now make sense. That my brain was trying to protect me from more trauma. That he believed that the time after RoboT's vacation was very traumatic and that he didn't handle it well at all. That it was probably going to take me a long time to develop trust in another clinician, be that him or someone else. How Valentine's Day was likely not a trust building exercise.

I disagreed, which caught him off guard. I said that it was difficult because I didn't like anything that happened about that night, but that I respected that he did exactly what he said he would do should a situation like that arise. That I hoped it was the first in a line of many things that would build trust. Yet at the same time, it was annoying that trust was so difficult. That I didn't want to waste my time on something so unimportant.

"Do you really think that trust is going to be a small part of your work?" That question set me on my heels instantly. It was so obvious. No, of course trust was going to be integral.

We had a conversation about psychodynamic object relations. How he'd hoped that our relationship could serve as a microcosm for the other relationships in my life. That it could serve as a series of corrective experiences for me, and that sometimes we'd have feelings about things, but that trust in the therapeutic relationship would hopefully be able to sustain those feelings.

I asked how that was supposed to work if he wasn't supposed to bring his stuff into the room. He said it'd be more depersonalized. "If I'm feeling this way now, I wonder if this is how other people in your life feel in situations like this." But that the difference was that short of me assaulting him, that he'd be there. That he wasn't going to abandon me.

Like before, that was difficult to hear. I responded that it'd only work if I didn't leave first. That how am I supposed to discern between when something is harmful versus when I perceive something as harmful. (Not a verbatim quote) He paused on that for a moment. He reflected how eloquently I was able to phrase the question. He had me repeat what I'd said so he could write it in his notes. He said he didn't have an answer, which was fine, it was more of a rhetorical question. What did I think? I said the only difference is that hurt, actual hurt, was overt and measurable versus the perception of hurt is more of an internalized concept.

He said that thought, too, was eloquent and profound. That I was extremely emotionally aware. That made me sad; I thought of RoboT and our conversation about the observing ego.

"I'm going to have to start writing the things you say more quickly." I said his notes sounded interesting, and how I haven't had a therapist take notes during session before. That they'd probably be interesting to read. He said that I, of course, had the right to request my file at any time. I said darkly, "and you have the right to deny that request."

"I could, but I'd only do that if I felt like something would be clinically impactful, and the way he takes notes really would only make sense to him. That he writes things that I say that make him think of something.

We were about out of time, and he asked how the session had felt. I said it was good, it felt productive. That it was different somehow from our previous sessions, and he agreed. "Do you think there's something that we've discussed that you'll take away after you leave?" There was, but I couldn't remember what it was, and it was irritating me. He read out some of his notes trying to jog my memory, but it wasn't helping.

I remembered later, it was his question about trust that resonated. I know that I don't trust people, but I minimize its importance.

We engaged in some small talk as I paid. He asked me what my copay was. I answered and he laughed awkwardly. "I'm sorry, I'm so bad at the office end of things. I'll probably ask you every time we meet."

That's what RoboT said, and he did. With the exception of the session immediately after I tried to terminate. I left session thinking if feigned ignorance about money is a therapy ploy.
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  #224  
Old Mar 10, 2018, 09:26 AM
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In session, my T gave me a full intensity, full emotion, powerhoused total-focus that he seemed to have planned. He wants me to understand that shame is always a byproduct o fabuse ,and own it and overcome it(?). ( I think).

Midstream he said that therapy is a medical event, he is the doctor and I am the patient. That really hurt . The context is that my BF is not a therapy fan.

At first I took responsibility for hurt feelings about him not having much skin in the game over the holidays by trying to see if I romaticized therapy too much ( back in January).

This time I just wonder if his worldview, hidden behind neutrality, is far enough away from felt-experience of talking about intimate topics that I feel a bit betrayed, and then silly for feeling that way.

Apropos of nothing, he said that people who have affairs dont trust others bc they themselves are not trustworthy. For some reason, I replied I thought an affair was a boundaried space too ,and that maybe his view was conventional or maybe he saw the unhappy fall out in his practice, but it was generalizing rather than embracing moral complexity.

The session was supercharged and very intense. I feel heartsick about it.
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  #225  
Old Mar 10, 2018, 10:13 AM
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ES, when you posted about the affairs comment in another thread, I was baffled; however, if it was said on the heels of your comment about being betrayed by the distance of his felt-experience, do you think he might have been saying that you betray yourself when you don't embrace or feel your own experience and that that would lead you to not trust him or other people?
Thanks for this!
Lemoncake, SalingerEsme
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attentionThis is an old thread. You probably should not post your reply to it, as the original poster is unlikely to see it.




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