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  #51  
Old Apr 25, 2007, 01:35 AM
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Maven Maven is offline
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Incidentally, as MadKitty brought up, he may very well have lied to the other woman. This isn't an excuse on her part--if she knows he's married, a woman is still wrong to participate in his cheating--but I'm making the point that I've seen many women who cheated, and they believe the man when he says the wife has cheated, they're not happy, they're having problems, they're getting a divorce, the wife is a B, etc. I'm not saying these things are never true, but the point is, the "other woman" often decides she can trust him, so she doesn't even check out the wife, to see if any of it's true. She shouldn't get involved with a married man, IMO, but my point is, if you're going to do it, you should find out if he's already lying to you about the most important part of cheating--the party being cheated on. Frankly, I believe, if he'll cheat on his wife, he'll cheat on you. I also believe, while the cheating is between the husband, wife, and the person(s) being cheated with, if there are children, they're victims, too.
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  #52  
Old Apr 25, 2007, 05:59 PM
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So, she could learn from the other woman, the one who sent the pole dancing pics, that her husband has been untruthful about the marriage? Well, I suppose that would be enllightnening, but, ultimately, it's a humiliating action on her part, and since he has already caused so much insecurity, not wearing his ring because she is not behaving as he feels she should....He's controlling her and using emotional blackmail.
I would not, repeat NOT, call any women with whom he is having contact! Sadmommy needs to start taking care of herself!
A loving partnership does not make you cry and lose valuable sleep. It does not harm your children's mental states. It should give you peace and assurance.
Patty
  #53  
Old Apr 25, 2007, 06:42 PM
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I just want to add here that I think Sadmommy is in the "can't see the forest for the trees" mode. I know, believe me, I've been there, and taking many years to gain clarity, recover, and start valuing myself finally!
When one is "enmeshed" with someone whom they perceive that they love, regardless of the abusive treatment from them, it is virtually impossible to detach from them, unless something drastic occurs. Perhaps counseling will help with this. I hope!
Patty
  #54  
Old Apr 25, 2007, 10:21 PM
Sadwifey Sadwifey is offline
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My loving Patty. You are exactly what I need! I started counseling today and neither one of them said what you said...which was honest and to the point. Oh my goodness. I need to start with me (well, one counselor did say that)....but I think I need to pay you....you are straight forward! I wish I had friends to turn to. At this moment, right before my kids go to sleep, I feel like my relationship is over. I am sad. I won't have "concrete proof" but the fact that I FEEL that way says a lot, doesn't it? Yes, he is controlling. I know that. He is even lying to me about monies he's getting from a car we sold..(I know this because of the message I heard two minutes ago). Let me explain...he will say to me..."I didn't lie to you because you asked me if I had talked to the dealership...and indeed he didn't TALK to them..they exchanged messages. Do you see where I am going. And he will tell me that because we aren't in a "good state" right now, he didn't NEED to tell me....Oh my, I have really messed up my kids' lives.....I feel for them...

Guys, I am sad....really sad...
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  #55  
Old Apr 25, 2007, 10:45 PM
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just do what is best for you and your children......look at the specific trees, not the entire forest........xoxoxo pat
  #56  
Old Apr 26, 2007, 03:10 AM
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You're blaming yourself again. You may have made some mistakes, but your husband has a lot to do with any problems that might cause hardship for your children.

Patty, I don't know if you were responding to me, or just used the Quick Reply, but if it was to me, I wasn't advising her to call the other woman. I already told her not to in previous posts. My last post was for women who might consider being the "other woman" and had nothing to do with this situation.
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  #57  
Old Apr 26, 2007, 04:26 PM
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Hey, Maven, I have been there! I wasn't responding to you but to Sadmommy.
Many of us who are writing to Sadmommy can empathize because we have been in the same or similar situations.
We are all speaking from the heart here!
Love
Patty
  #58  
Old Apr 26, 2007, 09:49 PM
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Eva1nder Eva1nder is offline
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Hi SadMommy

I'm very sorry you are going through this. I've been there myself like so many others have said trying to support you.

Right now you are feeling very low and blaming yourself, but a lot of that is because this man has beaten you down by his words and actions. He has no right to do that.

He took advantage of you and your past and used it to his advantage to do whatever he wants. He justifies himself by blaming you...coming up with ridiculous statements.

You need to take care of you and get yourself strong and you will see that he is not worth you taking on that blame and ridicule from him. You deserve a caring and nurturing man. You have failed at nothing...if anything you are a fighter and one that will only get stronger and tougher. You and your kids are most important and it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. Especially this pathetic hypocrite who thinks so much of himself. Tell him to put his own ring away and while he's at it ... have him put yours away to.

~E
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Husband's ex-secretary sent him pictures of her pole dancing
  #59  
Old Apr 27, 2007, 02:23 PM
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Direction Direction is offline
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Madkitty - what an amazing story you shared - it brought tears to my eyes...

SadMommy - I'm so so sorry this is happening...I think I would prepare for the worst...

On 4/20 - I gave some specific advice - I don't know that it is necessarily right for you.

You do need to start thinking about you and the children and your future - I would encourage you to prepare.
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Husband's ex-secretary sent him pictures of her pole dancing

Ripple Effect - Small things can make a difference
  #60  
Old May 01, 2007, 03:08 PM
Sadwifey Sadwifey is offline
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Hi, it's me. No change. Except he did put on his wedding ring yesterday. I think because WE are going to counseling together for the first time tonight. When he put it on he said, "Now where's all the love you need to show me that I put it on."

Anyway, I think I will clam up and shut down and not talk. My GUT feeling is that he wants to go to counseling to "prove" to the world and his family that he did "his part" and that counseling didn't work. I think it's his way of trying to justify.....

I can't say what is on my mind about the pictures. So I have no idea what I'm going to talk about tonight. I have no clue. I don't even know how I'm "faking" it.

I am still sad....but plugging on. We don't mention love to each other at all. I will write to you all tomorrow to let you know how my "initial" went.

Hey, one of my counseling appointments from last week (I interviewed 3 to see which one I connected with), said that since my husband denies everything, I should get a private investigator to know FOR SURE. Gosh, I wish I could afford it.....but my "woman's intuition" and "gut" are telling me I'm right.

Love you all...and Direction, why did you change your mind on advice you gave me?
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  #61  
Old May 01, 2007, 04:07 PM
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I simply hate divorce - all the advice from 4/20 is sound. I just don't want to push you...if there is a chance you can somehow keep this together. I, also, don't want you to be at point where I was thinking that suicide would be a better choice than divorce. I was completely out of it, and I had no hope at the time. Hence why I was in the hospital a second time in less then 3 weeks.

Coming out of the hospital, I had hoped to make things work right up to the unexpected night I left. That is why it is so important to put some of those item from 4/20 advice into place as you may not have a chance to get back into the house again or have access to these things.

1. Set up an appointment with attorney - the first meeting is free - you can get a lot of information from this meeting. Find out who is the best, find out who is the most affordable for you.

2. You'll still need this - Go to another bank and open a checking with $100 and a safety deposit box for $50. Set up a P.O. Box with the post office so you have a location for confidential information to go to.

3. You'll definately need this - Not sure who takes of financies - if you do make a list and a copy of every single debt invoice and asset. (house appraisals, vehicle registartions) Basically you need to know everything. Put all the information in the safety deposit box. You may need to get any sentimental valued items out of the house also.

4. Any family that could help you out? You will probably need 2,500 to 3,000 for a retainer fee for the attorney. If you have a house and have a line of credit - use it and then close down the line as well as all credit cards once you've used what you need.

It is sound advice either way you choose. I never expected to leave the night before Christmas Eve. My oldest still remembers it as the day his best friend moved out of state and that I left. I still feel awful..
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Husband's ex-secretary sent him pictures of her pole dancing

Ripple Effect - Small things can make a difference
  #62  
Old May 01, 2007, 04:40 PM
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Sadmommy,
Just the way he put on his wedding ring, in anticipation of counseling (you are right!), and then the caustic comment...What does he mean by this "Where's the love?"
Does he feel you are not affectionate enough toward him?
and thus, refused to wear his ring? This is emotional blackmail in the worst way, in my opinion. So, now he is supposed to be rewarded by you because he put on his ring?
Perhaps you could talk of this to the counselor, his responses, etc., if you feel uncomfortable about revealing your knowledge of the pictures.
Patty
  #63  
Old May 01, 2007, 04:59 PM
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it just tears my gut up to think about al of the emotional abuse this man inflicts upon you......

i want to tell you this. every time he does this and gets by with it, you lose a little bit of yourself. and believe me, it isn't all that easy to re-claim. ask Patty and I...(i know her situation)

i'm 16 years out and i still don't trust people like i used to trust. and i doubt that i ever will.

the more he tears you down, the more power he takes from you. the less power you have, the harder it is going to be to improve your life.

are his good points so sterling that you can overlook the abuse?
  #64  
Old May 02, 2007, 04:19 PM
FatBtmGrl FatBtmGrl is offline
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Sadmom,
Kick him to the curb while you are still young.!
  #65  
Old May 02, 2007, 06:45 PM
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She IS young! Much time ahead for you, Sadmommy!
Love
Patty
  #66  
Old May 03, 2007, 04:06 PM
Sadwifey Sadwifey is offline
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Oh guys...I have my "own" counseling tonight. Thanks for saying I'm young...all of you. But I've been thru a divorce once and it's much easier said than done, even if it is the right thing to do. I am so sad! I agree with you all that say it's emotional abuse...I've been feeling that for a long time. But guess what? At counseling together the other night, she wouldn't let us "hash" out our issues...and she was so "partial" to him....I just couldn't scream out everything insecurity I had and he even told her, "Look, I'm wearing my ring and no, she didn't show me love like she said she would once I put it on." By the way, I never said, "I'll show you love as soon as you put it on."

All she told us to do was talk positive to each other. Well, I am seeking counseling on MY OWN so that I can express to someone how I'm feeling and find out how to deal with it.

Last week he suggested I get a private investigator...even he said this all sounds fishy. But my hubby is always the "center of attention" the "funny guy who makes everyone laugh" "the one everyone goes to for counseling" - he is a charmer...but what everyone sees is not what I get at home. AND................he told the counselor that he never knows what he is going to get when he walks in the door at night...a happy or sad person.......

Thanks for letting me vent...keep up the words that make me feel TOUGH, even if for that moment.
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  #67  
Old May 03, 2007, 04:42 PM
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Direction Direction is offline
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Glad you could vent...

Don't really see the need for a private investigator - your in California which I believe is a no fault divorce state - no need to spend the money there - you'll need it for the attorney.

I'm glad you have your own counselor...

One of the first things are clergy asked us to do is to think and write down individually (no talking about it) what we wanted from our marriage. Interestingly enough it was a partial I opener.

The second assignment was to write down what "baggage" we individually were bringing to the marriage". That is were the skeleton's came out...her eating disorder, my depression were the two biggies...

Anyway - if you are misquoted in a together session - when it is your turn and in a very calm tone tell your side. Remember your hubby hears what he wants to hear...I'm a man and I'm thinking if I didn't wear my ring and then put it on - I certainly wouldn't be expecting my spouse to owe me one.

The ring is a symbol one that is put on when you take vows...to use it as an apparent bargaining chip to get something from you is ... well I don't know what to call it... but in poor form
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Husband's ex-secretary sent him pictures of her pole dancing

Ripple Effect - Small things can make a difference
  #68  
Old May 03, 2007, 06:39 PM
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excellent post, Direction. i agree with all you said......

a manipulator is very, very sly in the way they approach counselors, Pdocs, Ts.....believe me, he had thought about exactly what he would say before he ever walked through the door. and believe it or not, there can be Ts who take sides. it's unethical as all get out, but it happens.

you're in my heart for your journey. xoxoxo pat
  #69  
Old May 04, 2007, 07:37 AM
MadKitty MadKitty is offline
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I have no more words for this man...how can someone be so selfish. he is an arrogant person - i dont even know him and i am upset....douse him with gasoline and light him .....

my bad - its the madkitty talking...

i have no more advice to share with you....i am here for you, a shoulder to cry on, a punching bag if u so wish...

to me it seems that you feel this marriage is worth saving or is it u wan to save face with everyone you know.....

my mother always tells me - u dont live for what other ppl thinks or feels....the first person you should make happy is urself then the other...

how can he throw everything on u, make u seem like the loon....

i really dont understand....maybe u should take his advice and hire a private investigator...this is something he is not expecting even though he has given the advice to you...in his eyes, you are a coward!! (sorry but that is how i see it) and you will never do it.....so prove him wrong. but dont let the cat out the bag....

all my love
Areej XOXOXOXXO

*very tight hug*
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  #70  
Old May 04, 2007, 01:48 PM
Sadwifey Sadwifey is offline
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Hi guys. I went to counseling last night. I cried the entire hour. He really thinks I'm sinking into a deep depression. He said my "insides" are telling me things are right and my "head" is trying to stay hopeful....what a tough situation to be in.

Anyway, the weekend is here...my oldest is turning 15 tomorrow and my youngest 8 on Sunday. I can't concentrate...trying to put something together for them. Please keep comments and wisdom and eye-openers coming....
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  #71  
Old May 04, 2007, 04:03 PM
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I feel like Madkitty...mad at this man who is emotionallly abusive and cunning! ...putting his ring on before going to counseling (just for show!)
As someone else said here, none of us can make your decisions for you. You are truly in charge of your own life and decisions.
I am going to PM you about my depression at age 41 while still married.
There really ARE many postives in your favor..you're still young (though you may not realize it or feel it!), you have job and can support yourself, and you're intelligent and educated!
Personally, I would make arrangements to leave this man, or kick him out!
Love
Patty
  #72  
Old May 09, 2007, 10:08 AM
Smilie Smilie is offline
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What a powerful story,I had tears in my eyes.
  #73  
Old May 09, 2007, 10:27 AM
Smilie Smilie is offline
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That's spookey. It's sounds like he is snoopy in your history on line.Telling you to hire a detective.
  #74  
Old May 09, 2007, 11:00 AM
Sadwifey Sadwifey is offline
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I have been home all week with a very ill 8 year old boy. I am just now logging in because I'm exhausted. I"ll read all responses and keep you updated on my life.

Thanks for being there for me you guys!
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  #75  
Old May 09, 2007, 11:36 AM
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