In the long run, do people who fall in love with their therapist get better?

I stumbled upon this forum a while ago and the stories I have read so far are truly heartbreaking: people in love with their therapist, people panicking because their therapists are going on vacation, people unable to understand that their therapists are doing a job...

I can see how romantic feelings toward a therapist would form, and I think they are quite normal, but I don't understand why intelligent people would embrace such feelings and not make an effort to bring themselves back to earth. Unless those people are "lucky" enough to have an unethical/ unprofessional therapist, their feelings are just going to eat them alive and possibly ruin their lives.

I've been there myself but unlike most of you I identified my emotions early on and instead of embracing them I made an effort to convince myself that my emotions were directed toward the wrong person. I still have a lot of work to do before I completely detach myself from my therapist, but I'm glad to know that at least I am making an effort to let the rational part of my brain control my life.

What I want to know from those of you who have been there is whether developing romantic feelings toward your therapist helped you in the long run. My guess is that you ended up worse off.

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Wow. Forgive me Tiberius, but this post sounds extremely 'holier than thou' to me in tone... congratulations to you if detaching your head from your heart is your goal in therapy; I personally was under the impression that bringing the two to work harmoniously together as a whole was the ultimate aim... there are some who sway too much in the direction of the 'heart', and others who try to exclude that completely and try to overide everything with the head. I wouldn't say either is entirely healthy, but then I guess that's what therapy is about.

As for whether they (those who 'embrace' their loving feelings for their therapists) end up worse off, that depends largely on how competently the therapist navigates the client through their transference. This can of course end terribly if the therapist a) oversteps professional boundaries and allows the so called "lucky" client to act on the feelings or b) is inept and unable to help the client process them, thereby leaving them floundering to make any sense of them at all. Some clients are able to struggle through and find some resolution DESPITE an incompetent therapist. However those who have a competent, ethical therapist who is capable of handling the transference very often come out of the therapy with a very positive experience.

Well, First of - i agree with Paraclete completely.

Second - for a while, it helped me with my suicidal feelings. I held strong to my therapist. Then he figured it out when i told him i adored him and he got a little bit nasty...even thought he said it was NOT a psychological trick and he was sorry for hurting my feelings...i...well... the illusion is sort of broken now....but you see -i collected myself right now and decided to move on...IDK how to explain. He told me that it would be hard for me and i could call him - but a part of me (since i do have parts) got hurt form his way too harsh way of saying "you can NOT touch me!!" (never intended to!) and i did not call him this week. Collected myself together and moved on with my REAL goal. I just know he is not my final destination and i will get over him although the process is disappointing and sad.

Still...well to your question - i think that it is ALWAYS both sides. Both good and bad. Like anything. It is all about using the benefits and learning to handle the disadvantages.

This subject is relevant to me, and the answer is complicated. Thank you, Tiberius, for posting it, and in the regular forum too.

You could say I fell in love with 3 out of 5 Ts I've seen. I called it addictions or obsessions because they were female and so am I. I "got better" in some ways; therapy helped me with problems not related to the T. But I kept going from 1 T to another trying to get those "love" feelings again.

In my case, though, I acted this way with others who were NOT Ts, but who were real people in my life. It's a pattern since childhood. So, working on the attachment, or "falling in love with my Ts" if you want to call it that, is a big part of what I am working on in therapy right now. I'm exploring where the need to have T be so important to me, comes from. My T thinks I AM getting better, and that the attachment to her is healing. We both know it's not really about her, but transference works that way, so she is the one who can help me work through those feelings that seem to be about her.

It's not easy because a part of me doesn't want to get better, but my T knows what she's doing, and I trust that I will get my needs met by her and then be able to move away from her.

I have become over-attached to older females ever since I was a small child. From the age of 10 I experienced so much shame and fear over these feelings that I spent my entire adolescence utterly suicidal. Ironically, by my mid-twenties my suicidal behaviour had become so dangerous, I had no choice other than to accept therapy (and thus the therapeutic relationship). For the first year or so, I fought and fought against these feelings, as I have my whole life. And then, slowly, I 'embraced' them. I accept that I love my therapist. For the first time in my life, I have stopped fighting my feelings, and I'm allowing myself to experience it. Far from eating me alive, accepting and expressing these feelings is freeing me up to live properly for the first time.

My T says she loves me (not unethically or unprofessionally) and I believe her. She says she always thinks about me when I'm not with her. It is a boundaried, paid relationship and I would defend those boundaries fiercely if it came to it. But those elements do not make it less valuable, less healing, less real.

It's ok to express your pain, your doubts, your fears. But I don't think it's ok to judge people like me, who make different choices from you, as deluded, or doubt our intelligence. I am doing what I have to do to heal. I'm sorry if this is 'heartbreaking' to you.

(again, my feelings are not romantic. They are feelings for a 'mother')

Tiberius, I've been reading your threads and comments in this forum and in the main psychotherapy forum. You seem to be struggling so much with this issue. Off-hand, from the intensity of the emotion that you bring to the questions of transference, and whether the therapeutic relationship is 'real' or not, I would guess that these touch on core issues for you.

It's not that the questions aren't valid, but that the way you are struggling with them is on the extreme side.

What I mean is, I think you are bringing a lot of your own issues to this, and if you could, somehow, disentangle your own issues, figure out what those are, what you're projecting on the therapeutic relationship, and why, then you would likely learn a lot, and also, the therapeutic relationship would become less painful.

-Far (speaking as one who's definitely been through it! and, more or less, come out the other side)

Unfortunately I am abnormal and as I have learned after reading the replies to my posts in this and the other forum I am mostly alone when it comes to the negative feelings I harbor toward therapy.

Tiberius, I've had the same reactions that you're having. I've been in therapy off-and-on for about 10 years, and I probably spent much of the first four or five years obsessing about whether my T really really liked me, or whether it was just fake, and why was I torturing myself and setting myself up by being so attached to someone who didn't really like me back.

And then at some point I realized that those were my issues, the issues that I was bringing into therapy. And I accepted that she just really does like me. And that, even so, the boundaries will always be there. And figuring that out somehow made therapy a lot easier for me.

I don't know what the issues are for you. For me they had to do with longing for intimacy and also fearing it, and for me much of that resulted for my upbringing.

All I can say, I don't think your feelings are abnormal. I don't even think they're unusual. But they can be worked through.

Good luck,
-Far

I don't doubt that I fear intimacy, but did you really get better after 10 years of therapy? Were you able to accept your need for intimacy and lose your fear of it? Were you eventually able to move on and find a partner and live a normal life? And if you don't mind telling me, how did your upbringing contribute to your fear of intimacy?

I'm really, genuinely sorry that you feel alone. I suspect you're not as alone as it may seem and that others here have had similar experiences.

Speaking for myself I feel quite threatened by your style, which I perceive as attacking and dismissing others' experiences, choices and abilities, rather than simply questioning your own experience. I also think you've chosen a time when I (and perhaps others) are particularly vulnerable because of therapy breaks over the holidays, and I have worked really hard to be able to hold onto and keep believing that it's all still true, even when she 'leaves me'.

I do think that many people here have experienced terrible pain in their therapeutic relationships, and have found different ways to deal with this. I hope you feel able to connect with these experiences.

Yes, I think I'm much much better.

When I started therapy, I was married to a controlling, domineering man with a bad temper. I did not realize this was a bad marriage. I thought the problems were all my fault (for being lazy, stupid, disorganized, inept, etc.) I was deeply depressed, but I did not realize that either. I struggled with SI. (Cutting.) I did not function very well. I was anxious, with panic attacks.

Now, I'm divorced, and about to finish up in a graduate program. I don't cut any more, and I function reasonably well most of the time. (Still struggle with a tendency to depression.) I have friends, I have activities I enjoy. I live in my own apartment, and I've made it nice. I'm enthusiastic about my life.

Yes, therapy helped me.

I accept my need for intimacy, I accept that it's better for me to have friends and be involved with people, and I should put effort into doing this. I haven't completely lost my fear of intimacy. Here, I'm talking about intimacy with friends, and I can do that better now. I have less social anxiety. I'm not so afraid of people, and, more, I can untwist my inappropriate fears of social interaction, so that I am now more able to be with and enjoy people.

I don't have a partner. I was married for over 20 years. I don't want a partner. I don't really trust my ability to pick a good partner. I have a tendency to be attracted to abusive men, and I'm afraid of doing that again.

I like just having friends, and living without being yelled at.

I haven't even dated since my divorce. If I'm ever at the point where I want to date, I would definitely want my T's feedback on my partner(s), etc.

But I do have a close group of friends, and I feel intimate with them. (In fact we are planning to start an intentional community together.)

My mother is much like my ex-husband (surprise surprise!) She is also very domineering, critical and controlling. We were all afraid of her and her temper. I learned from my upbringing that the people who you think love you are also going to destroy you and dominate you; that's just part of the deal. Which is why I accepted my husband's behavior for so long.

*****

Look, there are definitely incompetent, inept therapists out there. My T that helped me so much is the 12th T I tried, and the only one that I ever connected with. And there are therapists that can do a lot of damage, also.

So there are definitely reasons to fire a therapist. But the reason that you've given: that you're deeply enmeshed in transference reactions and you find it extremely painful -- that's not a good reason to fire a therapist, or to quit therapy. That enmeshment most likely reflects the depth of your need, not the competence of your therapist. (I say 'likely' because I don't know you -- so please take what I say with a grain of salt -- use your own judgment).

The big reason to fire a therapist is the therapist has poor boundaries. Sex is the big no-no, but any kind of boundary violation is going to be a problem.

Other problems could be that you and the therapist don't click, or that the therapist isn't trained in treating your particular issues, or that the therapist doesn't behave in a professional fashion. So like I say, there are reasons to fire a therapist. But the reason you've given -- that's one you have to look very very carefully at.

You might look at your T's training and experience. Is your T skilled at working with your particular issues? That might give you some kind of objective measure of what's going on with you.

Anyway, I hope these thoughts help you a bit. I know that none of this is easy.

Take care,
-Far

I posted in the main forum, but here's a different type of answer:
I was SOOO in love with my exT (male). Huge teenage crush, flirting, almost like I was possessed by my teenage self. I let the crush feelings flow. I kept going to therapy, talking about my stuff, learning how to set boundaries and express my needs. I went from being a person who thought therapy was silly to someone who thinks therapy is GREAT. ExT made therapy accessible and safe for me, I learned how to communicate openly with him (and take little steps to open communication with people in my real life). I eventually told him straight out that I loved him. I thought about him all the time. It was a huge issue for me, so guilty in my marriage.

the whole thing made exT so uncomfortable. sigh. he could never help me with the transference.

New T: she's straight-forward with me about being happy to see me, happy to see me smile, pleased with my hard work. I am certain that she genuinely likes me, that she cares about how I'm doing. She's happy to give me a big hug at the end of a tough session, and I feel so healed by working with her. All of her demonstrated and open communication of caring about me means that I do not think about my relationship with her. I don't have overwhelming feelings for her - I'm just super happy to have her as my therapist!

So, I loved my exT. I did get "better" in that I gained many good things from the therapy. And I'm going to finally reap some benefit from having been "in love" with my exT by examining and analysing the transference reaction with this new T. It's not a direct cause-effect like taking amoxicillin will make you get better from your strep throat.

Good luck Tiberius

My having "fallen in love" with my therapist ended up being the very thing that healed me. I'd suffered a very painful loss and needed to believe that loving someone was worth the pain of eventually losing that person. In recognizing that I'd chosen to love my therapist despite having prior knowledge that I would lose him, I came to understand and embrace love itself. When I looked inside those feelings, I found the best of myself. I discovered my capacity to love and in that discovered self-love. Very powerful. Very healing. But that was my journey.

Everyone's journey in therapy is their own. Feelings and responses all hold information about you. Transference is about you. I've haven't yet read your other posts, so I apologize if I'm not understanding your entire situation. I'm sorry that this has been so very painful to you! How are you feeling today? Right now?

I agree with the people who said you were being imperious when you wrote "the stories I have read so far are truly heartbreaking: people in love with their therapist, people panicking because their therapists are going on vacation, people unable to understand that their therapists are doing a job...". But, you sound overly logical and not yet able to understand people's feelings well, so I want to write something to try to be helpful to you in spite of what you wrote. I wrote the sentences above for the purpose of supporting anyone else who might be hurt by what you wrote, not to be rude to you.

As far as negative feelings about therapy, yes, I definitely had them and expect I might have them again. Although I wasn't attracted to my t, I was obsessively thinking about therapy all the time. It was transference. Sometimes I was angry at him for things he said. I was angry because I think he knew that I trusted him a lot and it would hurt a lot if he pushed me the way he did. I am still angry about that sometimes. This seems similar to your anger that your therapist allowed you to develop feelings of transference. (Although I don't think therapists really have a whole lot of control over whether transference happens, I think they have awareness of the possibility of it.)

I haven't gone back to that t because the extent of vulnerability and transference I felt with him seems like too much for me to deal with. I'm afraid I might be attracted to him. Unlike some people who post on this forum, I do not have a lot of confidence that most therapists could deal well with a confession that a client is in love with them. My guess would be that commonly they would refer the client to another therapist. However, that guess is not based on any experience, so maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I think that because I have a little bit of insecurity about intimacy myself. I hope if someone on here knows anything about how therapists are trained to deal with this you will explain it. That is, if there are any standards about this within any of the many programs where therapists are trained.

Nevertheless, I think the transference I experienced made a big, helpful difference for me. I think letting myself spend the time obsessing over therapy let me think through and understand some things about myself better, so that now I'm starting to be more self confident and I'm able to feel more progress from therapy with other therapists. All of this happened less than a year ago. It hasn't been enough time yet to report a final outcome.

I don't know what I think the best thing for you to do would be. From your posts, it seems like learning to value the experience of letting yourself be intimate and vulnerable with someone could be really useful for you. But when you have really strong, overwhelming feelings, as it sounds like you do, you probably will feel strongly affected by whatever your t does. Therapists can't be perfect and she may not be able to guess or do exactly what you need.

I thought it was good that you reinterpreted your feelings for your therapists to understand that you have a need for intimacy in your life, like a boyfriend or girlfriend. But I thought there is probably more you would need to understand about intimacy than just that it can be a good thing, and that you could learn more about it from therapy if the therapy goes well.

I don't know you, so I am just guessing.

If handled correctly by the therapist, transference can be the way to heal trauma.

I went to see a t for a business dispute, and had no real emotional issues other than that. Once the dispute was settled, I stayed with him. I loved him....too much to go into here.......We cannot help who we love.

Wow, this is the big issue for me right now. I am 55.5 years old, and the object of my obsession is only 31. I have two stepsons in that age range, one 30 and the other 32, with whom I am very close, but the ex-T seems so much more mature. I also have a bipolar nephew I am very close with who is the same age as the ex-T, and who also seems far less mature, because I watched him grow up. I am notorious for getting "obsessive crushes" but this was the worst. It did not even happen until half-way through therapy. At first I razzed him about the age difference and his dweeby clothes. I left therapy for a while, after witnessing a suicide on the road on the way home from a session. The guy always bugged me to wear nice clothes and makeup, so when I came back, I did that, and his reaction was amazing. Even then, I did not feel attracted to him. I thought of him as a "boy," but one day when I was depressed and arrived wearing rumpled clothes and no makeup, he said I looked like a bag lady. I got mad at him, and then he asked to hold my hand. Our knees were touching and I was shocked to experience sexual feelings. He WAS an extremely attractive young man with a beautiful, soft voice. He had already said I was beautiful on several occasions. He was married, but I did not know at the time that his young wife was pregnant. After the hand-holding, all I could do was think about him. I knew about transference. It was very difficult telling him about it, and I was disappointed by his cold, clinical reaction to it. I suspected that he was in a relationship with a younger client. I don't know why. However, the session after I told him, he seemed nervous and was crossing his arms protectively over his chest in a manner I'd seen a man who I'd had an affair with many years before do, in an effort not to touch me. We never talked about the elephant in the room, even though I badly wanted to. He kept changing the subject. This was October/November of last year. Then he said his wife was pregnant. That stung. Two days before Christmas he announced he was relocating to a better job far away and I wanted to die, but congratulated him. The last session was a dream of him saying beautiful, thinly-veiled romantic things to me that he never followed up on. At the end, he stood up and held his hand out to me, but he looked sexually angry. I was too terrified to take his hand, for fear that I would just force myself on him. He sat back down at his computer to do the last paperwork (which I stole). I bent down and gave him a soft kiss on that erogenous zone near his right ear. It was like he wasn't even aware of it. I didn't even look back. Two weeks later I had to be hospitalized. I never told my husband or daughter. It has been five months now and, of course, I have not heard from him. I can still hear that voice, "I can't stand the thought of not knowing what will happen to you," and the whisper, "You deserve so much better than that," when I described something very, very personal to him. It was like he wanted to give it to me himself.

I'm going on and on but I have a new therapist and she doesn't want to talk about HIM. She's good, but she's concerned about the here and now and how unprofessional this guy was and how he lied to me and led me on. Yet I am still deeply in love with him and it hurts so badly I cry when nobody is looking. The shame of being in love with a man young enough to be your son or nephew is unspeakable. I am hoping that time will heal. I have a loving husband but there is no sex and I am busy raising my teenaged daughter. I am getting old, but you remember that scene from "The Thorn Birds" where Father Ralph sees Mary to bed on her birthday. I still feel, I still want, and oh, how I love him.

I'm sorry this is so long, but in answer to your question, I know that, for me, it is going to take a long, long time to get over him, because I really fell hard. He said things to make me think he felt the same way about me, in a clinical way, of course, and would never forget me, but I do not believe him. I think he gave the same lovey-dovey speech to all his patients, especially the chix. He is busy now with a new baby, and my intuition tells me that he won't stay married long to his wife. I never even learned her name, though I did of the impending baby. There is a better term for how I feel: limerence. I was coined by a woman at the University of Connecticut, in the very city where he was born. I don't believe in coincidences.

Somehow, I have found a way to live without someone that I love.

Hey Binkle,

This old T of yours crossed all sorts of boundaries with you emotionally and you are still paying for his imcompetence. It doesn't matter that he was younger and you are older..............you were vulnerable and it sounds to me like he exploited that. Especially if he told you to dress not and when you didn't, you looked like a bag lady? Absolutely ridiculous! A T is not supposed to comment on your appearance at all, unless I guess if you smell bad or something. That is part of the unconditional positive regard.
If your new T doesn't want to discuss it, get another one. I know that sounds harsh but it is obvious to me that you are still in deep, deep pain over this and your current T needs to address that or you will not get out of therapy what you need. THIS IS NOT YOUR FAULT. IT IS HIS. I hope you can get the healing that you need. Big, big hugs. ((((((((((((((((binkle))))))))))))))))))))))))) I've been there but thank goodness my T handled it the right way.

I love my therapist

And sense I started seeing her I have gotten SO much better

I don't want to ever get to the point where I don't love her, I understand that nothing romantic could ever develop between the two of us, but that doesn't change the way I feel about her, and that is a feeling I NEVER want to give up.

First of all.......my 'transference' with my therapist is something I have struggled with for over a year. It was not something I was proud of, it hurts, it's confusing, it's opened up another side of me that was not there before, and in the end it HELPED me.

Being able to open up to someone and tell them my most personal issues towards him TREMENDOUSLY HELPED THERAPY. It let me realize where things were coming from inside and in relationships in my life.

As truly upset as your 'original' post made me (as it seemed to judge those who come here to share their experiences in hope of help and understanding) it is obvious it hurt a lot of people. I pray for you and i hope you have a great day.

'Yet I am still deeply in love with him and it hurts so badly I cry when nobody is looking.'

Hi Binkle! That course of therapy sounds truly disastrous. I too suffer/have suffered from 'limerance'. It began with what I thought were crushes at age 10, but at age 21 almost destroyed me. I have spent over a decade recovering from the trauma of that particular one, as well as all the side effects of the meds (for depression etc) and other related fall outs.

The therapist i began to consult at that time also refused to discuss OOO (the Object Of my Obsession). I assume she thought that addressing it directly would only strengthen my fixation. (The OOO was what I had come to see her about, not her). I dont know whether or not her approach was right.

After 5 years I did not feel as though I had made a great deal of progress. Also, it seemed like too many sessions were difficult, in terms of friction between us. I terminated it as I didnt want to see her anymore. Unfortunately I still wasn't well, and was in hospital a few months later. I had seen a couple of therapists in the interim, but no-one that I worked well with.

Finally, I saw a cognitive therapist who was highly recommended. At first there were no 'feelings' but as he fitted the profile of my OOOs the possibility was there from the beginning. My therapy started with the theme of my tendency towards limerance and my fear of his becoming another OOO. I also expressed the hope that if this did happen we would be able to use the experience to understand and break the pattern. (I kind of muddled through these thoughts, not making them so clear as I have now).

He reassured me saying that if I became obsessed with him we would work through it, and if I became obsessed with a canary in a pet shop we would work through that too! The important thing is that he was mature enough to help me through it. He did not reject me, which is what I was terrified of. And, 2 years later, though I still need to see him, I am much much better and also in an appropriate relationship with someone wonderful, my own age.

Sorry about the loooong response but I hope that this story provides some consolation: through all the damage and incalculable pain, I think it is possible to reach the other side, so hang in there

Hi Blinkle
I was also re-reading the responses on this forum and wanted to repeat what Paraclete said on pg. 1

Paraclete: 'As for whether they (those who 'embrace' their loving feelings for their therapists) end up worse off, that depends largely on how competently the therapist navigates the client through their transference. This can of course end terribly if the therapist a) oversteps professional boundaries and allows the so called "lucky" client to act on the feelings or b) is inept and unable to help the client process them, thereby leaving them floundering to make any sense of them at all.'

Perhaps T did intentionally mistreat you (very possible) or was just totally inept (also possible). Perhaps, worst of all some of a and some of b was involved too. I don't think someone could be very experienced at age 31, but I think the role of T automatically invests T with a lot of power. No matter how they handle it they are in a position of authority, making it much easier to appear mature. Also, you are meant to confide in them, and this is necessarily intimate. Whatever the age diffs, I think the client plays the child in therapy and the T, the ideal parent. And so, in a way, you were meant to 'fall in love'. He, in turn, was responsible for keeping appropriate boundaries, and making YOUR issues the centre of the therapy, not his own! It seems to me that he was primarily concerned with his own desires, and needs (whether or not the details of your suspicions were correct) and not yours...

Deleted... sorry.

Well, my therapist is a woman and so am I so I was a little confused at first when I "fell in love" with her. I had the courage to bring it up in therapy and she was wonderful about it. We discussed how it related to the emotional/physical abandonment issues I had around my father and that I needed to be able to really trust her so that I could work on my core issues.
In many ways, I see her as a mother/aunt/older sister figure and when I start thinking of her in a romantic way, I know that it is part of the process.
Someday I want to be able to transfer those feelings to a romantic partner.
Hope this helps!