an end to the pain....

you can come to PC if it helps YOU; allowing others to reach out to you is helping them, you don't have to say a thing.

Poetgirl,

You aren't bothering anyone here. We care about you! And you need the support right now. So please don't go away!

I agree with the others that you sound clinically depressed. I know because I've been there, i recognize the thought patterns. I encourage you to look into the med situation.

I know things feel absolutely hopeless right now, but that is because you are seeing everything under the dark cloud of depression. It makes everything feel unbalanced and SOOO much worse than usual.

I know you have a difficult situation in life to deal with, and i'm not saying that your external circumstances are not causing you to feel hopeless. But what i am saying is that when you are clinically depressed, you are not able to think clearly about the situation you are in, or to see that there is hope and possibility for dealing with it successfully.

You are not a bad person or a bad mom! A bad mom wouldn't care about how she affected her kids. You are concerned about the effect you have on them. Don't listen to the self-hate. I had so much of that myself during the worst part of my depression. Don't believe what the depression keeps telling you. It is wrong.

You can pull through this! We're all here with you, holding on.

thank you......thank you all.
I am still here. My internet will be off soon, but I will be back, I think.....I plan on just being numb and inert today really......like I told my T yest., the best I can manage right now is simply keep breathing.
Too big of a wimp to handle the pain of sui......but hardly able to stand the pain of life......bad bad bad bad bad place.

poetgirl--PLEASE don't stop posting. I care very much about you even if you don't post in anyone's thread. I know you don't think so, but I think that you WILL get better, that you need the right meds. There is always hope in each new day for your situation to change even though you think all is hopeless now. You don't have to pretend to feel good in the forum, either. We all want to see you feel better.

you're in my prayers

Yes, I do. Stay here as often as you can and wish to.

thanks again......
BTW, does anyone think I am playing games, and just being borderline? A friend who was on my case this morning thinks I am just playing games and CHOOSING to think this way, CHOOSING to be in the pit, CHOOSING to worry so much about money/the future that it is disrupting my today. Just a choice that I should change, as if it were so damn simple......if it were that simple, I would totally do it......I have done it before, but as I have said, there are things that make this feel so different, things that won't leave my mind, things that feel like bleak reality that I can't handle....it's so hard. I hate it. If she thinks it is a game, fine, let her think that. I can't change her mind anymore than I can just change my brain......

Of course I don't think you are CHOOSING to feel the way you do! I'm very sorry your "friend" feels that way.

thanks rainbow.....
actually, she is a good friend. she knows what depression is, says every day she fights it, she keeps going on, she keeps choosing to give of herself to others so that she doesn't sit down and never get up, she says the pit will never swallow her up.
I said, you have more strength and character than i do. she said, it's not about that, I am as small and weak as anyone else, it's just that I WILL NOT LET the pit swallow me up......
The pit, I said, HAS swallowed me.......she said, you are CHOOSING to stay there. Get up off you duff and DO something, stop thinking about yourself.....

PG your friend is right in the sense that you do have to make an active choice. Waiting until you feel better won't help you feel better. Sometimes you have to force yourself to do something, to "act as if" even if it takes every ounce of energy you have.
You can't change anything by worrying about it. Worrying gives you an illusion of control -- it makes you think that you are doing something about a situation by thinking about it, like maybe if you think about it and worry about it enough it won't really happen, and if you stop worrying for even ONE minute, the worst thing really will happen because you stopped thinking and worrying about it. In reality, though, worrying does nothing except make you feel even more helpless. Can you provide more for your kids by wishing things were better? No, you can't. And you won't feel any better by waiting until you feel better. It's like being forced to get out of bed and walk around almost immediately after surgery even though that's the last thing you want to do because it's so painful. Seems like a cruel thing for the nurses to do when you're exhausted and in pain but it helps you recover faster. You wouldn't feel better by waiting until you felt better before you got up.
And remember that a passive decision is still a decision. If you do nothing because everything seems too difficult, doing nothing is still a choice. Nobody is forcing you to do nothing unless they prevent you from getting up and doing something, so even if it doesn't feel like a choice, it is. If you want things to be different, you have to make a different choice. You can do it.

[quote=poetgirl76;1933853]BTW, does anyone think I am playing games, and just being borderline? A friend who was on my case this morning thinks I am just playing games and CHOOSING to think this way, CHOOSING to be in the pit, quote]

I sometimes have the thought, when I'm feeling at my worst, like I'm outside of myself watching myself making poor choices or choosing to be miserable or whatever. So I get why a person might say that. But the thing is, as that's happening, it seems impossible (in a deep, cellular way) to make a different choice. I mean, I know other choices exist...but there is no possible way I can find in those moments to make a different choice. It's a horrible feeling.

And I hear how horrible you're feeling right now, too. I hope you get some peace and light soon.

worrying as an illusion of control, that's an interesting thought. I don't quite see it, but maybe I sort of do......I am worrying and trying to fix things in my mind so I can feel in control, only it doesn't work that way. I feel more OUT of control......
OK, so I could make myself get up and do things, but how does that stop the worry or the anxiety or the dread fear that paralyzes me......which is good in one sense that I am paralyzed, otherwise I would go do something stupid to myself if I could muster the energy to do it.....so I don't see WHAT to do! I just want OUT. I want to be DONE with this......

(((((Poetgirl)))))

Something is coming to me as I read your thread.

We both want "OUT" of the terrible feelings.

We want to be RID of the feelings.

And if we can't be RID of the feelings, we want to be RID of ourselves so we don't have to feel the feelings.

But maybe the only solution is to keep putting one foot in front of the other DESPITE the terrible feelings.

We have to learn to tolerate and work with them, instead of trying to be RID of them. Because they are a part of us.

I know it's so hard. . .

oh my goodness i so hate that statement playing games.no poet i would never think this at all.believe me i bet you could think of a lot funner games than this one.if these people that say this could only feel the turmoil you are in so much they wouldn't think this at all.no one chooses to feel so bad.at least i would hope not.sending you so many hugs you just cant handle it.

thanks, peaches.....you are right. hard as it is, you are right. we have to live DESPITE the feelings......that is what I don't seem to be able to do. live and accept that I feel this way.....it means living while feeling like I haven't hope, and it is hard to live that way.
thanks granite, I feel hugged! and you are right, there are funner games one could play. better ways to get attention, easier ways to operate......so no, this is not a game or meant to manipulate, though I understand how it feels that way to others. like I am trying to scare them, trying to get them to change in ways that I think will help me feel better and trying to have some control where I really feel there is none. I see how it looks that way.
frankly, I am not at the point yet where I am convinced that living is a good thing.....I am barely holding on and not committed to giving up sui as an option. it's still there. still beckoning......the only thing, or one thing, stopping me, is that there is no painless way to do it, for me, or for those left behind to deal with the pain of my choices.....maybe that's good. maybe it's good that I have a fear of pain, physical pain.....and some thought for the emotional pain of others......although my pain is feeling so huge I WANT to carve it out of me......

My T reminds me sometimes that even in the darkest times, grace is around us if we will open ourselves to it. A couple of weeks ago, I left a session and just felt decimated...like I couldn't go on, like the feelings were too big and too painful...and I stopped at my mom's house to feed her cats because she was out of town. She had some painkillers in her house that I seriously considered taking (just enough to be numb) and I literally had them in my hand and then decided to put them back in the bottle. I walked out her front door and a hawk flew right past me and sat in a low tree by my side. I LOVE hawks. Love, love, love them. And it was this moment of grace in the middle of all the yuck.

When I am in the dark places I try REALLY hard to notice anything happy that happens around me, and then I narrate it to myself in my mind so I will (hopefully) remember it. Right this second, my 11 year old son is running around the house lighting candles, because he decided yesterday that candles are beautiful. When I brought my 8 year old home from martial arts last night, my 11 year old ran outside, all breathless and excited and brought me in to see that he had put little tealights all over the house and lit them. And it was really pretty, and I loved him loving them. Right now, he is going around the house and lighting them again. There is something so sweet about it, and it's a happy thing that I can notice right NOW.

Can you find any grace in now? It's there. And it's always, always always in NOW, not in the future, where our worries are. It is right here, now.

I hope that you will get your meds straightened out and that will help things look less dark...and in the meantime, I hope you will let grace find you.

((((((Poetgirl)))))

You're going to ride through this. The awful way you feel is not going to last forever. Did your t ever use the example of a wave? It comes and goes. When the wave is high, it feels overwhelming, like you're going to drown. But it subsides. It doesn't stay at its peak forever. Same with our feelings.

Try to let the wave of feeling ride through you -- without hanging onto it or pushing it away. Can you do that? Remember, no matter how awful it feels, it's just a feeling. It's not going to destroy you. It feels really bad now, but it won't stay so bad. You can get through it. You can do this. And when you do, you're going to look back and say. . ."It felt like *&%&, but I rode it through. I guess I'm a little stronger than i thought i was."

Poetgirl,

Can you sit outside and listen to the sound of a bird? Sometimes when life is so painful i don't think i can stand it any more, i sit outside and listen. Birds are small, short lived, and often taken for granted. But when I've been so low that it seems like nothing could penetrate my wall of pain, it was a little bird's song that found it's way to my heart. A simple, little thing. But enough to remind me that in the darkest night, something of beauty still remains.

Poet,

I've been reading your suicidal threads and I can't help but feel so sad for your children. My mother killed herself, and she left behind four young children, including me. If you are worried about there being no painless way to die, think instead about the lifelong pain and suffering you will put upon those precious babies. Seriously poet, you have no idea how bad it is to lose your mother that way! You never get over it! I can tell you how bad it is, every day when i remember that my mom was in so much pain that she didn't even think of us...we weren't worth living for.

All i can suggest is to get some photographs of your kids and put them where you can see them at all times so that when you are in so much emotional pain you can remember them. My mother loved me, but in that deep abyss was able to forget i existed for long enough to follow through. Please think about that. You had those children and you owe it to them to be there!

Tay... your post brought me to tears. There were times when my children were young and I thought they would be better off without me but somehow I always managed to think of the lifelong pain they'd be left with, and I realized I owed it to them to be here for them as long as possible. That's what kept me alive sometimes, because I somehow managed to remember that my own pain was nothing compared to the legacy of pain I would end up leaving behind for them to bear. I loved them too much to sentence them to a lifetime of unnecessary pain.
PG, somehow you have to find it within you to keep going, if not for yourself, then for your kids. Nothing can replace a mother's love.

Tay and PH, thank you. Your posts bring tears to my eyes, too.....
Tonight, the boys were talking to me about dying, because sometimes they do ask........I asked (foolish I know) if they would miss me if I died.......they cried and said, please don't die mommy, we love you. So how can I hear that and still do it......although the desire to go beyond is so great I can't stand it hardly. It almost isn't enough. Someone said to me though, how selfish it would be to leave them behind like that.....even though she said that she would leave the judgment of my soul to God and didn't believe necessarily that it would consign me to hell.....
I really don't believe I am a fit mother. I really don't think I am a good mother. I know I am not. I don't believe I can be in the future, either.....I am so selfish and sometimes unkind; I know I am my harshest critic, but I think that is true.
But my oldest said to me, you're a good mommy. I said, sometimes I yell at you....he said, that's not naughty.....
Yes, I see it would cause them pain......
How old were you when your mom did that, tay? I am so sorry for your pain.
PH, I admire and respect how you held on, considering what you said of what you had to go through with your H.

Oh (((((Tay))))).

why can't this pain just go away? why can't the fear go away? I am so terrified today.......I keep feeling like something has to give, and I don't know what it will be. Either I have to completely give up SU or give in, I think, because living with constant SU thoughts/desires is not living. I am not really living right now and how sad that is.......almost as sad as not being here anymore. I don't know, I don't see how, to live.......the fear of the future is so great that even when I try to distract myself from it, it sneaks back around and wallops me again. I simply can't live like this......I am so sorry for my children too, because right now they really don't have much more of a mother than they would have if I weren't here, because I am not so present...
My H simply does not see the storm clouds in the future, but they ARE real and they terrify me. I know money isn't everything, but if you don't have it, life is a miserable, brutish thing and I don't want that kind of life, but am afraid it's the kind of life that awaits us if finances go on as they are now. It terrifies me. And knowing that I have mental issues and may always struggle with them, how am I to think I have the capability to endure and to raise the children in the midst of both natural deprivation and emotional/mental illness?! It's too much!

((((((Poetgirl)))))))

This is the first chance I've had to read this thread and I have to tell you how sorry I am for the despair you are feeling right now.

I've felt the way you are feeling and I know how desperate and overwhelming these thoughts are. They eat you up and make you feel like there is no respite from them. But I have to tell you one thing PG- my eyes have filled with tears- not only for you and how you are feeling, but because of the outpouring of love for you that has filled the pages of this thread. I have read some very beautiful, heartfelt responses to your pleas. People extending their personal experiences to you in hopes they can somehow bouy you up if only for a moment. Hands reaching to you- to help you- to calm you- to support you. Can you see them? I think you can because you keep reaching out- and I'm so thankful that you do.

Please remember , when you are feeling so desperate that you don't think you can take another breath, or live if another thought or worry goes through your mind, that you need only step outside to hear the sweet, simple song of a bird, in the silence of a day, (what a beautiful thought peaches- I will always remember this- thank you so much), or listen to the laughter of a child, to know that there can be peace if we will look to the simpleness of life to find it.

My thoughts and prayers are with you- I hope you can find some peace and solace soon.

PG don't let money become your god. It simply isn't true that life without money is miserable and brutish -- it CAN be, but life WITH money can also be just as miserable and brutish, because the more you have, the harder you have to work to hold onto it, and the more worried you become about losing it.
I lived in a tent in a campground for 3 months when I was homeless. I had a few pieces of furniture and some treasured items like pictures and gifts from my kids in storage. Other than that, everything I owned was in my tent. But it was actually the most peaceful time of my life, because I realized through that experience that I truly had all that I ever needed, and anything else was a bonus. I had four great kids. I had friends who did what they could to be supportive and helpful. I had enough food so that I wasn't hungry, and I had a tent that kept me dry and sheltered. I was lulled to sleep by owls at night, and every morning just before dawn, the birds awakened me with their songs.
I miss that, PG. By the end of that summer I had an apartment, and that of course was wonderful because winters are cold and snowy where I live, but every spring I can hardly wait until I can leave my windows open all night long to be awakened by the birds just before dawn. It brings me back to a time when I finally realized that God had already given me everything I ever needed, and anything else was an extra blessing.
Being poor doesn't have to lead to misery, PG. I have friends who are far more affluent than I ever was or will ever be, and sometimes I feel sorry for them because they don't have time to walk through the woods to collect firewood for a campfire. They don't have time to watch an owl glide effortlessly between the trees just before nightfall. They don't have time to float down a river on tubes with their kids or save the salamanders from being squashed by cars after it rains. They have a lot of stuff in their homes but they aren't happy. Most of the time they're stressed out or completely unaware of what they're feeling because they don't even have time to feel.
Take a walk with your kids, PG. Pay attention to what you see, hear, and feel. Look for the beauty that surrounds you, and don't waste precious moments worrying about tomorrow. You don't know what the future holds so all you can do is worry about today. And if you have what you need for today, then you have everything you need.