[Leah123]

That's what my therapist said at the end of our session last night.

I was criticizing her. Been having a rough time. Been feeling let down too, but trying to balance out and be thankful for her too and be mindful of her, but anyhow, I blew it last night.

I'm in a little bit of shock here I think. I kind of rely on her. I don't know what I'm going to do. I don't know what she's going to do.

I was having a rough time, and she promised to keep in mind I was fragile and to give me a safe gentle space, but I guess I was too mean to her and messy and she couldn't.

I can't sleep. I had a nightmare about starting a fire and it caught on my clothes.

I think she was tired and she had a rough week.

The rational voice in my head last night told me that relationships have complications and it will be ok, but I don't believe that voice at all maybe. Everything is a mess. I am so tired, and I shouldn't even say that, as if it were some excuse. I am struggling, but I have to do better.

When she said that, I told her I would listen to her very carefully and I wanted to be open to her and I understood I was criticizing her, she probably felt like I was saying she couldn't do anything right, but she would not answer me. She just said she was tired and ended the session.

[archipelago]

Oh, wow, that is upsetting. I would have trouble sleeping too if that happened to me. I'm sorry it did to you. I'm not sure what to say because I don't know the way your relationship has worked in the past. In my own therapy there have been times when we have fought and then worked to repair things. That only made the way we worked together stronger. So just saying some good can come of these types of things but it doesn't feel good until later so you have to hang in there feeling yucky for a while. It is worth it in the end though.

[Leah123]

I don't want her to be tired of me. I want her to have limits so she won't get too tired of me, and I want her to help me but I don't seem to get it right, asking her for concrete supports, because that doesn't work out too well. Anyway, she's only human, and I blew it. I expect too much of her I guess and was very scared to work with her after last week and I blew it. I should have taken the day off therapy. I've been pushing hard through the work and needed a manageable session and I blew it. She is fed up with me. I'm thinking of skipping the next several sessions, give her time to see what she thinks of me. I don't know how to deal anyway, I am feeling so reactive, she told me something big before she was tired of me, and I couldn't cope with it.

I can tell she's really mad at me. Mad at the way I do therapy, mad at how hard it is for her. I'm too controlling I guess, and I'm too demanding I guess, wish she would have told me though.

Edited to add: I guess she was trying to tell me, and it just didn't go well.

[archipelago]

I understand why you would want to pull away, maybe have a cooling off period, time for reflection. It sounds like she felt frustrated, but you keep saying you blew it. Maybe she blew it? She lost her cool. But that might just be one moment and not how she feels or something she considers the sum of how things are.

I think there is room for repair here, but that might have to happen by facing it sooner rather than later. It might be hard, but if this were me, I would consider trying to talk about what happened so that something could be done about it. Letting it just sit there could make it worse.

[Leah123]

I did try to talk about it, but she would not. She just told me she was tired and stopped. I am scared to do emotionally intense work right now. I had an anxiety attack type episode last week, I was triggered, she says (I have PTSD she says) and it lasted four days and I was not functioning as well as I want to, and it really scared me. I was trying to take baby steps into therapy yesterday and it went really badly.

She thinks I am looking for quick solutions, I think because she has referenced things like that in the past, but actually, I am looking for ways to manage my emotions a little more while I work on the bigger picture issues. I just want some techniques, like breathing exercises or whatever that she can do with me to help me stay calm enough and feeling in control enough when my home life and issues get hard for me to work through.

I will listen to whatever she says though, I mean, I am open to knowing what she wants me to do and to making amends for criticizing her, because I could have done better and not let my frustration show if I were more careful, if I gave myself cooling off time I think, I lost perspective maybe. I just don't want to intrude on her- I don't want to initiate anything, because she doesn't want to hear from me.

I'm sorry, I'm just a mess. I should stop talking now!!! I'm not good at shutting up.

[MoxieDoxie]

Not a single therapist should ever say that to a client. I would have gotten up and walked out and never gone back. You should not tolerate that from a therapist and find one experienced and mature enough to know how to help you.

[Leah123]

She has 20 years of experience. I am a very intense person, I know I am a very demanding client. I thought... I thought I was rewarding too, like a mixed bag, to work with me, but... anyhow, I'm probably making a bigger deal out of it than it is, but those words are sticking with me, hurting.

She had a rough week, and I was criticizing her, and she probably lost sight of what I was trying to get, I was being very reactive, and have to do better, rest and do better.

[growlycat]

That is really really upsetting!!!

My main T has "lost it" with me before but never said anything like that (therapy is supposed to be about you, you are paying for it!!!!!!!!!!) Main T always apologized afterwards once he had time to reflect.

If she does not apologize-run!!!! You deserve better care.

[archipelago]

I have PTSD so I know how hard intensive work can be. The pacing should really be set by the client. Being pushed with those intense issues is not good. A therapist has to be really patient and gentle around them. And when they do get worked on there has to space around it for a break so that normalcy can return. So it's a lot of peaks and valleys not just one straight path.

Wanting ways to manage seems perfectly healthy to me. Have you said that to her? I can't really tell but it sounds a bit like she's being too confrontational at exactly the wrong moment.

By the way, I know of a breathing exercise that was shown to me in the hospital so is based in science that works to calm yourself if you want to know about it.

[Leah123]

I hope maybe she will apologize and I think I should apologize too, I'm just not sure about what I am doing in therapy right now. I feel like I am flailing, I feel completely at a loss, I feel out of control, and I want her to help me with limits and concrete things, but we are having a disconnect about that and I'm having a hard time figuring it out.

Anyhow, I don't think she wants to apologize. I think she is pretty pissed at me. But I wish she had told me to stop and helped redirect me if I was being unproductive, but I feel like she was missing the point of the conversation again. I want help to feel talked down at my very worst moments and to get back in control, just to be able to breathe and focus a bit, and she's not helping me with it. I don't know if it's because I refuse to be helped or what, I had one session w/another therapist Sunday, and he seemed to know exactly how to calm me down, way down, in an hour, but it's not apples and apples. She says I'm struggling more with her because she knows so much about me and I'm not ready to deal w/everything I've shared with her yet, but I want her to help me get comfortable, i.e. be able to breathe through it, and I don't know if she can or will. I try to talk to her about it, but it goes wrong.

Edited to add: I should add, to be fair, she HAS offered to do some grounding techniques when I ask her too, but we get off track sometimes, and also, I don't feel that she has shown that "Ok, keep calm, we're going to do this and help you feel better" approach that I crave in my very worst moments.

[Asiablue]

And here lies the problem with online therapy. Things can be said that people wouldn't dare say to each other face to face. What your therapist said is completely unacceptable and had nothing to do with you or your behaviour and everything to do with her crap boundaries and her inability to recognise when she's getting burnt out. She might have 20 years experience but it goes for nothing if she can't pace herself and by the sounds of it she can't pace you either. You may have ptsd but what is her qualification for dealing with that?
What she said to you is unprofessional and damaging. Go find a therapist that you can meet face to face and one who can actually help you.

[Leah123]

It is very different in some ways to do online therapy. I find it goes excellently when I am somewhat centered and purposeful, and this part, where I've made major life changes and am feeling completely off-kilter, it's hard to bring that level of performance and to maintain a sense of her as an ally rather than feel a little more neutral and easier to have miscommunications, I think. On the other hand, it has huge advantages, too. I've made a lot of progress, and faster, than in traditional therapy....

I think maybe the experience is one w/more volatility than traditional for me: higher highs, lower lows, so yes, it's really important for us to pace!!! You are so right, and I think maybe we're both learning that part as we go. Sigh, the new frontier, ha.

I just want to know what she'll say next, I want it to work out, but I'm just being insecure now.

[archipelago]

While I agree that a therapist shouldn't say things like this to anyone, people are only human and sometimes they lose it. It really should be the therapist's responsibility in that case to apologize and try to repair the relationship immediately. I'm not sure why that isn't happening. The client shouldn't have to be left hanging with this sort of thing.

[BPandMe]

Hi Leah,

I'm sorry to hear that happedened. Therapists ARE there for You. She made a mistake, a big one at that for what she said, and the after-effects that you have clearly demonstrates it.

I understand therapists are human, and do make mistakes, but they are educated enough to know when to step back and breathe. Words hurt.

I agree that you could sit down with your T and calmly discuss what happened, as to never let this happen again. In the meantime, I know it's easier said than done, but don't dwell on her words, as she probably feels aweful, and will certainly offer a sincere apology and explanation. Good luck, I'm thinking of you. <3

[Leah123]

Originally Posted by archipelago

I can't really tell but it sounds a bit like she's being too confrontational at exactly the wrong moment.

YES! That's exactly how I felt. I tried to tell her to please take the issue with me in baby steps, the way she confronted me was too hard for me to manage yesterday, and I thought she knew I was feeling so overwhelmed and scared because I told her and she said she'd be gentle, but then she said something major and I just couldn't cope.

[Leah123]

Thank you all so much. I am so sad and hurt and I really appreciate everyone talking to me. I just feel so muddled I have no idea what is best right now or what to do or what to say. I wanted to write her and tell her I was sorry for the way I criticized her and I know she was having a hard week, and I am sorry if she feels I'm too controlling in therapy and I will be more open, but on the other hand, I was struggling so much and don't want to just ignore how I feel, and I don't want her to be waiting on me to apologize, but I don't want to write to her because I don't want her to feel I won't let her alone.

[Asiablue]

Leah, you have complained consistently about this T on these boards all with good reason, this T is raising major alarm bells and her practice is shoddy at best. Do you have proof of her qualifications, have you looked into her licensing board? Is she even real or is it Mickey Mouse at the other end of the screen? Why are you entrusting your mental health to someone who treats you badly and is questionable in their practice?
The fact that your are questionning yourself in this and taking on a large proportion of the blame just shows how untherapeutic this therapist is. And TBH even if she was a decent therapist i don't think it sounds like the type of therapy you need.
I think you need to think hard about why you're putting up with this, why you're not giving yourself the best chance to receive the healing you obviously need and want and why you're putting yourself in a perilous situation by allowing someone you don't know and can't physically see to meddle in your mental health.

[archipelago]

In my view, she should be taking immediate steps to remedy this. The burden shouldn't be on you because of course you are confused and torn. Problem is that she isn't doing that and it is a holiday. A tough one.

I would write but I wouldn't apologize. I'd just say what the impact was and let the therapist take the next step. But that is what I would do with my therapist so it's not advice, just trying to feel empathy so you don't feel so alone in this.

[Leah123]

Originally Posted by Asiablue

Leah, you have complained consistently about this T on these boards all with good reason, this T is raising major alarm bells and her practice is shoddy at best. Do you have proof of her qualifications, have you looked into her licensing board? Is she even real or is it Mickey Mouse at the other end of the screen? Why are you entrusting your mental health to someone who treats you badly and is questionable in their practice?
The fact that your are questionning yourself in this and taking on a large proportion of the blame just shows how untherapeutic this therapist is. And TBH even if she was a decent therapist i don't think it sounds like the type of therapy you need.
I think you need to think hard about why you're putting up with this, why you're not giving yourself the best chance to receive the healing you obviously need and want and why you're putting yourself in a perilous situation by allowing someone you don't know and can't physically see to meddle in your mental health.

She treats me extremely well in many ways, admittedly I may not have posted as much at length about those, although I do contribute to the threads about great things our therapists have said, and such, because she's really been amazing to me a lot of the time: and she has been extremely open, fair, trustworthy, empathetic, soothing, non-judgemental in many, many cases. She's had a lot of good ideas too when I need help brainstorming. We've been working very closely together for a while and most of it has been very very helpful. I've made major life changes for the better and my real life has definitely benefited. So, it's not at all black and white. She and I have done a lot of wonderful work together, and at other times have an excellent rapport, so I definitely don't want to just throw the baby out with the bathwater, but I do need to work on concrete supports with her, somehow, and of course, work through this, sigh.

(Yes, I have verified her credentials as has the agency we work through. I am confident in her qualifications and she has experience dealing with PTSD. I am, it is fair to say, a demanding client, and there are unique challenges working online.)

She should not have said that. I'm clear on that. But.... I don't want to lose our relationship, there has been an awful lot of good to it.

I think part of the problem is she has really let me lead in the therapy to feel safer and get what I want out of it, and now maybe I'm wanting to negotiate that role, kind of like Sweepy referenced in another thread, like a copilot that might need to take the wheel occasionally- to where she is partnering with me as I tackle stuff that's harder for me to maintain equilibrium on, and this is a hard spot to be in.

I think we're maybe working on the rocky transition from me trusting her with all my secrets, to trusting her to direct me when I'm feeling unstead. This is a MAJOR challenge for me and risky. I am independent to the extreme. It's been a challenge for me to let my husband carry any of our groceries in the house, ha, to give you an idea. Anyhow, my whole life is feeling unsettled and unsafe right now, so... yeah, messy.

[Leah123]

Originally Posted by archipelago

It sounds like she felt frustrated, but you keep saying you blew it. Maybe she blew it? She lost her cool. But that might just be one moment and not how she feels or something she considers the sum of how things are.

Yes, I think so. I think we both blew it. I was harsh, that is for sure. But she is there to work with me constructively, and she definitely wasn't doing that or managing the session. Admittedly, I think I'm hard to manage, and this was absolutely an off night for her. Very very off.

Edited to add: I was thinking about our overall relationship and like you said- how this was one bad moment, that when we are very close to anyone, and spend significant energy/time with them, there are bound to be conflicts. I mean, I love my daughter way more than anything in the universe, but we certainly aren't always peaceful, same with my husband. And though therapy is safer, all relationships can have conflict, this one is still a lot smaller than once in my outside life. Sigh. I was thinking about the good times, and that I do appreciate her and show it, and that we have such good conversations, and how she is almost always there for me, so reliable.

I have to see how it goes, I guess.

[Asiablue]

personally, it doesn't matter how good she is the other times, the magnitude of the mistakes she has made shadow everything else. The hard thing is, she can disappear at the click of a button and you'll never see her again. I'm not sure i'd be comfortable with that. But it's your therapy and obviously you are, the buck stops at you, you are responsible for taking care of you and if you're happy with the standard of "care" you are receiving, great.

[Leah123]

"She can disappear at the click of a button"

Any therapist can terminate at any time... I wouldn't have any more recourse than I do now. She's been doing online therapy a while and says she does not have plans to leave it anytime soon. I have to take her at her word, as I would with a therapist in person.

I really don't know how to judge the mistakes against the successes right now. I'm very upset, struggling in real life, and mindful of the great progress I've made with her too. But yes, this last week has been very rough, it's going to have to take me time to sort out what happens next.

Right now, I'm just... struggling. Not wanting to decide, just wanting to manage.

[ScrewedUpMe]

My T once said to me "It's all ME ME ME, what about your husband and how HE feels?!". I was furious and went to her supervisor about it and a couple of other things she had said (she was inexperienced back then) and it all got pretty messy. Weirdly I am still seeing her and we got over it. I do remember it though and it scares me to think she has that side to her.

Sorry you are going through this

[Leah123]

Thanks so much for saying that. I'm gonna cry again. It helps to know you've been there, but I mean, I'm not glad you had to be.

I think she was mad because I was sharing a problem about my daughter having scary tantrums, and I *think* my therapist is very anxious for me to do a big thing about it that she thinks is necessary, but I was asking her to break it down for me to small steps, something concrete, because what she said was huge and arbitrary and she didn't stop to think that I was having trouble breathing and just slow down her pace for me. She got passionate, and then later got very tired and frustrated. Big disconnect between us two. Not sure right now how it'll be fixed, maybe not sure if it will be fixed.

Ugh.

[ScrewedUpMe]

I really feel for you. My T too has been amazing in lots and lots of ways but I will never forget the few times that she was less than professional and blurted things out that she shouldn't have. My husband wanted me to quit there and then and my head wanted to as well. I do believe that the therapist has to be the bigger person 100% of the time. They are trained to be strong enough to take what you throw at them. It's not their life that is being discussed after all and there is the old saying in therapy, 'above all, do no harm'. BUT having said all that from a rational point of view, every T is human and can have an off day. I would certainly expect a sincere apology from her and an explanation and take it from there. Only you can judge how sincere she is and how it fits with the way she usually is with you. I don't remember your other threads so am not aware of other problems you may have had with this T. I hope you get out of this what you need and will help you move forward