Raising the White Flag - I Surrender

I thought about it tonight, had a good cry, then decided to accept that I didn't get the nurturing I wanted as a child. t can't give me what i missed back then. I have to take care of my own inner child's needs, no matter how hard it is or how much it hurts not to have those needs filled by t. I am done trying to get it from t or looking to anyone else to fill that hole inside.

We cant change the past .... but we can try to have our needs met in the now - you cna give your inner child the love and attention it needs... and we can be there for you if you need a helping hand

(((((((((((((((((peaches)))))))))))))))))))))))

I remember having this realization - it hurt a LOT. Somehow, though, just really accepting this - that what I wanted more than anything was to go back and redo the past, and that there was no way to to that - opened me up to accepting the nurturing that is there for me now, as an adult. I don't know if T changed after I had this realization, or if I changed, but now, I can feel the nurturing and love that he gives me. And I can feel that H loves me, something I never believed before. Letting love in is one of the hardest things for me, I've really never been able to do it. I think it was SO painful as a child to not be loved, that I put up these walls and wouldn't allow anything past them, even though love was what I wanted more than anything in the world.

Right now, I'm really sick with a flu or something....and I am taking care of myself, and it is okay. I've always refused to take care of myself. I think I felt like if no one else would love me or take care of me, I certainly wouldn't do it either, because I obviously didn't deserve it. And it didn't feel fair - why, WHY should I have to love and take care of MYSELF? But I've been making sure I eat nourishing foods when I can eat, and making sure I get enough rest, and just letting myself be sick. I'm taking care of me like I would take care of my kids.

I hope that "surrendering" leads you to a new place of healing and light. I really do believe the quote in my signature. Sometimes it has to get really dark before we can begin to see the beautiful stars that were there all along.

Peaches, I too know how intensely painful it is to come to that realization. For me it triggered a huge amount of grief for all I had lost and all I would never have. But, like it was for Treehouse, accepting that realization also paved the way for an enormous amount of healing and growth.

For me, I learned to depend on and trust ME. I discovered that looking after myself and taking care of my own needs wasn't nearly so bad as I had feared - it actually turned out to be better than anything I had ever imagined! I discovered that I was always there for me, no matter what time of night or day or whatever the circumstances. I discovered I knew exactly what I needed, so was able to fulfil my needs perfectly. I also discovered that it actually felt good. I didn't feel ripped off or neglected or abandoned because I had to take care of myself - I just felt cared for!

Like Treehouse, I also take care of myself just like I would an outside child. That was hard at first, but became easier with time. It means no judgements about worthiness or anything like that - I wouldn't judge a hurting outside child, I would simply respond to their need. I have a rule about according myself the same respect.

I soooo do not miss the days of having a need and feeling that awful empty pain of yearning for someone to fill it, or feeling adandoned, rejected and unworthy when someone else fails to fill it. When I hurt, need, or am ill, I nurture myself, soothe myself, wrap up warmly and feed me hot chicken soup, allow myself the time and space to recuperate. I never fail to be there for me. It's a rule, and I am dependable!

I know it hurts when the want and the need is so great. I also know the healing that can come from realizing that those wants and needs CAN be filled by yourself.
The grief is enormous.... but so is the healing. And I think that healing can only happen once we fully accept that painful realization without our defences.

I think its when we are trying to "get" the things we need that we do hit a brick wall, almost like chasing an impossible dream, but there are people out there that are able to "GIVE" you what you need without you having to try and "get" it. Have you talked this direct with your T about how you feel? Im not sure how long you have been with your T. But believe me it is possible to finally receive what we never received, and we do not have to take care of ourselfs alone, that hole can get filled.

Peaches, I have been working on this myself. My T says I need to grieve the past, acknowledge those needs will never be met by the people from my past, and that will help make room for something else. It is hard, and for me, I've had to go at it pretty slowly. I think about it sometimes and then leave it alone for a while, so it doesn't become so overwhelming. I think it has helped my relationship in T though -- for the most part, I'm less demanding/it feels less urgent because I understand that it's not really about her, it's about me and feelings coming from me about the past. That she's just a person doing the best she can to help me. Anyway, I hope you can find some peace from all these difficult feelings. Hang in there.

Oh, Peaches

You know I struggle with the same thing, and that's why I am having such a hard time leaving my T. It's like she "shattered my dreams." Is that the way you feel too?

It's such a difficult realization, and it is SO painful, but I think we have to accept it before we can move on. I can't tell if you are bitter, though, or angry with your T. I am angry with mine for not being albe to fill that hole, but I understand that she can't. Your T is there for you, allowing you to attach to her, but I know she wants you to be able to become independent and meet a lot of those needs yourself. We only have ourselves; we can't rely on anyone else.

treehouse and Luce: Your responses helped me too.
mouse: Can you (Peaches, hope I'm not hijacking your thread) say who can fill the hole? Do you mean spouse and friends? How can you get what you never received?

notme: "It's not about her". That's so important to realize. Peaches, that's been a big part of the problem. We've wanted our therapy to be about HER and US, about our relationship. Yes, we've wanted our Ts to fill us up. We've wanted THEM to make us feel good, to give us what we missed. It's a fine line beween T being there for us, and being there TOO much for us. I know you think my T has been too harsh with me about this, and maybe so, but her goal is for me to realize that it's about ME, not about HER and ME, and not about her filling me up. I've intellectually known that for a long time, but the needs are so strong that I have always fought her on it.

I appreciate this thread, Peaches. I have confidence that you can gain strength from your pain. How about writing a poem as a way to acknowledge your feelings now?

I hope you are not planning to push your T away. I'm a little concerned about that.

peaches, how are you feeling now about what you posted? i think it would be terribly difficult for me to accept. i would be shattered, actually .

i think i agree with mousey a bit more, though. pdoc certainly fills me. he can't go back to when i was a kid and fill me there, but he sees me struggle now and he heals that wound. he told me once "i can look after you". and i think that is what i've been looking for. someone who can look after me, someone willing to give me that. it is kind of like snuggling under a mother bird. i feel safe there. but he's also a good mother bird (ha! he would hate this analogy!) because he's getting me interested in the outside world and helping me test my wings. i know there is going to be no one prouder when i finally leave home, and i feel secure thinking about that, because i know no one can take away what we share now.

Woooo Hoooooooo, I've been waiting for you to get to this point Peaches! Good Work!

I don't think theres a time limit on love, love just is. For me its like there was a part that was prevented from growing up, because it was stuck in limbo waiting for the natural time line of development, the nuturing mother to the new born amongst other things. This part has in its grief fantasised that it was getting what it needed, but in doing this it was unable to differiencate from what is love and what isn't...hence in my other thread the way I took to stalking and imagining and stuff...could this hole be filled by spouse and children? Well to begin with no, not exactly because the relationship with spouse is a mutual one of giving and taking and this part that has lived in limbo wasn't capable of really giving...not in any real adult sense, it needed someone who was not needing any return, but someone that could devote to "it" like a mother to the newborn, and thats where T comes in..the relationship with her has been entirely about my needs...over the 5plus yrs with her that part stuck in limbo has recreated situations with her to enable further growth, to get past the stuckness and now that this is finally happening in a real way, I am now able to see and know those others in my life that have love to give me, ie, my hubby..because that part that was stuck in limbo has become unfrozen....I never thought the past could be "fixed", believe me I was one sick puppy...but as I get what I needed so bad back in the past, the past becomes much less painful and almost dare I say, irrelavant now, because all we have is now and now is where I am getting my needs met..its unresolved grief that keeps us stuck the past, stuck the pain...but one must have someone that has something to give..qulifications alone do not make a therapist...the humanbeing in the therapist is what matters the most...

I relate. Painfully, I relate.

(((((((((((((((((((deli)))))))))))))))))))

I agree with what you wrote. Once I accepted that I couldn't literally go back to my childhood and get what I needed, I was able to see how much T was giving to me. Now that I've let myself open up to his love and caring, it really does fill me up. He does look after me, and no one has before, and it feels good.

Once I felt sleepy in session and told him that I wanted to take a nap, and he told me, "go ahead, I'll watch over you". And a little bit of that hole was filled.

Bit by bit his loving and caring has made me believe that maybe, MAYBE *I* am *worth* caring for. And then it is easier to care a bit for myself. And to accept the love that comes from others around me (H, friends, kids). I was absolutely closed off to love before T. No matter how much people told me they loved me, it couldn't get in. Now, it can get in a little bit. And I am able to even care for myself a bit too.

It's been a slow process with a lot of ups and downs. But it feels like healing.

While I'm no where near ready to confront/talk about this issue, i know T can never give me what I missed out on.. or what I need. I have experienced so much heartbreak surrounding this topic that it's really been hard for me to read your post. I'm sure I will be ready to address my old wounds someday. Thanks for having the courage to share this with us.

I tend to agree with treehouse. My first T did give me some of what I missed out on, and it made a huge difference in my life.

I just don't think it's so black and white. I feel kinda sad when people say they have to learn how to fill themselves up, alone. Yes, no one person can fill you up but to take care of your own needs doesn't mean you are doing it alone. In alot of ways my T is part of how i am able to fill myself up, as are many other people in my life. It's not some magic thing they do to me, it is part of having caring relationships. My T cares a lot about me, and that "fills me up" to a certain extent.

I can understand peaches that you are surrendering, but are you sure that maybe you are looking at it as either you get it all from t or you don't get anything at all? You said your T was willing to hug you, and you didn't accept it. Are you sure that you weren't jumping to the conclusion that she didn't really want to give it? Perhaps she was hesitant because you seemed ambivalent about it. Didn't you say she got mixed messages from you? Are you sure you weren't afraid to accept it?

I have my own difficulties with physical touch, and want a hug from T but am afraid to ask. I plan to ask next session. It's scary. She said she would hug me and I know she was saying that sincerely to express her joy about my graduation. She has invested in me like no other. Of course she cares, and it feels good. It's also scary for me because I am afraid i won't want to let go. But I will.

I think it's healthy to accept reality, but just make sure you know what reality is. Reality is your T cares very much about you, has been there for you.

that's a really great post, tay . thank you so much for sharing.

((tree)) - yes, i relate quite completely to what you shared. pdoc cares about me even when i can't (or won't) care for me. and somehow, this manages to fill me up enough that i'm strengthened to try again. and then i look around and am surprised! that there are other people in my life who care for me also. weird stuff, eh? but yeah, i didn't accept people's caring or love very well before pdoc. i still have a hard time accepting it from him at times, but he's someone who is consistent and doesn't get put off by my repeatedly questioning why.

I don't know what to say because I feel like this too. IT SUCKS completely. I am so sorry you are feeling this way.

I think of therapists as being like training wheels. As a kid, one day one fell off as I was riding my bike, and I was o.k., I could keep riding --I was able to do it. And then I kept riding with only one after that day. Then at a later date the other fell off while riding and I was able to keep riding without it, too. *

We in therapy have many and many different kinds of training wheels.

As hard as it is to face that you need to face it on your own, and that it will be difficult as you move forward, it sounds like you just jettisoned one. You can do it.

* (true story; not just an allegory)

Just my take on Peaches post here but I think that her surrender is a good thing. I have been watching her here, IMO, chasing something that is not going to heal her while she has been avoiding what will heal her. I see her surrender as giving up what she was stuck on (the stuff that was not going to bring healing). Surrendering this will allow her to finally focus on what will work.................

Hey Mouse, awesome, awesome post. I am going to go back and read it again!

I totally agree with that concept of being able to give up something that is not going to work. When we have 'sought' that all our lives it is so, so hard to come to the realization that it is never going to work. And there is so much grief involved with that, too.

But, giving it up truly does mean being open to finding other ways of healing. And there is immense power and hope in that.

When we want someone else to fulfil our need we are so dependent on them... if they can't give us what we need we are left empty, unfulfilled, alone, wanting... if they can't respond to us WHEN we need them to we are left feeling the same.
If we are able to develop ways of meeting our own needs, without the deep yearning for someone else to fill the hole for us, we are in control of our own feelings.
It is hard to believe when we have spent our whole lives looking for that fulfilment outside of ourselves... because as children we *needed* it to come from somewhere else. We were dependent on others for all the things we needed, and when they didn't deliver we were left bereft. It is difficult to shift that belief that it needs to come from others, but as adults we really can learn to fulfil those needs for ourselves. Even if we have never had nurturing from anyone in our lives before, we can still learn to give it to ourselves.
It is only the want for it to come from someone else, and the disappointment and pain when it doesn't, that holds us back.

Recognize a need -----> want someone to take care of it for us ----->
1. have another respond to need ------> contentment
2. be disappointed ---------> pain.

Recognize a need ----->
1. respond to need in self -------> contentment.
2. ignore need in self -------> pain.

It is only in the second example that we can be responsible for our own being.

(((((peaches))))) I hope your new revelation will help with your movement forward and healing.
That's kind of how I feel too. I never had an expectation that my T would completely fill the hole inside. Maybe I'm not as honest as some of you. My T is very caring and we are very close. I really like our relationship and don't wish it were different. Maybe I just have lower expectations than some people, the if-I-don't-expect-much-I-won't-be-disappointed attitude. I know this is a protective mechanism. Sometimes I do feel like a dog, cowering and wagging its tail, scarfing up scraps that are thrown my way. From that mindset, what T has given me is phenomenal. I don't have to beg for scraps. He just gives freely and willingly! One day, he fed me a loaf of carrot cake.

I do strongly relate to this statement, in regard to my H and my failed marriage. 20+ years of unfulfillment. I do have a lot of pain and grief about that. I do wish I were done grieving. I do just want to leave the ache behind. I get impatient with myself that it takes so long. I don't really see T as filling that same need, but it is really great to have him to share my pain with and to be with me when I grieve, to have him along on my journey.

Excellent post Luce!

I agree with everyone who says grieving/accepting that certain needs weren't met is an important step towards healing/growth/moving forward. I also agree that learning to nurture ourselves may be the best answer in the end, for the reasons Luce says.

But I think, for me at least, I could not have gotten to those points without therapy (or some relationship that provided similar features in real life). So having a T was/is really an essential step for me -- I could not have just snapped my fingers and decided to meet those needs for myself. For one thing, I didn't have enough self awareness to even be fully aware of those needs prior to therapy. For another, I think when my T acts kindly and nurturingly toward me, that models for me how to do it toward myself and towards others. Likewise, I think having the experience of opening up to another person and trusting trusting them could not have been completed on my own. I think learning those things will eventually help me in several ways:

1) I won't feel so "needy" in the first place because I'll have gotten used to feeling securly attached to someone and having those needs met. That hole just won't be there any more. (I've been feeling this more and more lately.)
2) But eventually I will be ready to move on because I will have acknowledged the limits to the T relationship and how my feelings in it are largely based on past unmet needs. I'll still appreciate it, think of it warmly, but other things, like focusing on more reciprocal relationships and family and career, will just start to feel more important. (Not here yet, but I think someday I will be.)
3) I'll be in a better place and have better skills to get my needs met by other real life relationships, to various degrees and from various people. This will also decrease my reliance on my T for getting those needs met. (Still working on this.)

So anyway, I guess my point is just I think both can be true: that learning to nuture yourself is a good thing, but that, in the meantime, relying on nurturing from T (to some degree) is also a good thing. JMO.

I agree, notme. I really liked what Luce said, but I agree with you too. Your post helped me realize how far I've come, if I stop to think about it. I HAVE reached the point of reaching out to others instead of my T, and realizing that what I want from her is based on unmet needs from the past. I'm reaching out to others, but it's slow, like a snail. I go 2 steps forward, fall on my face, and want to run back to my T to make it all better. But she, knowing I'm capable of being independent, doesn't let me cling to her. I go back out and make more connections in real life. I'm doing that now. Wow. I think I'm getting it--but it's so easy to want to slip back into relying on my T.

So, thanks for your posts, notme and Luce.

But, Peaches. How are you? Where are you? I'm concerned. Please post and tell us how you are.

I think that you all are talking about the same thing. We all need help and support but we need to be the person out front driving........