is reconciliation wise for me

*** Trigger Warning ***

*** Trigger Warning ***

*** Trigger Warning ***

I cannot be sure this will trigger anyone. However, I want to be considerate.
I am sharing a situation with Big Mama in this post. It is an unpleasant one.
Please take good care of yourself at all times.

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Hi Big Mama,

You've been on my mind.

I think you will find "time" is on your side. By this, I mean, some of the aspects you find somewhat "confusing" right now may all become clearer with time.

In relating the story about my friend, I did not mean to suggest your therapist is projecting. I do not get that feeling from what you write about her. She seems to have patience and seems to genuinely care. She also seems to clearly voice her concerns and give you the room to make decisions, which is very balanced and very healthy.

Again, we all have to live with these decisions. Our own lives are impacted, not the lives of the therapists.

I also feel so many here have amazing insights and do care deeply for your welfare. Wonderful people have written here in support of you.

Again, time. More time will show you more about yourself and more about your husband and more about how you both interact together.

Do you keep a journal? Just wondering. Sometimes journals can help us to recall and to further process. Keeping a journal helped me to get some desperately needed help when I was once in an abusive relationship.

I will share with you:

I had dated a guy for a couple of years. As soon as we were engaged, he quickly became very abusive. When I had changed jobs, where he no longer had me working in the same hospital with him, it became a nightmare. It was so insidious and then eventually truly dangerous.

He was initially very "sneaky" in his ways. He knew just how to make it look like he was not doing anything wrong and told everyone I was just "off the wall" with my questions and concerns. It was his official public opinion that: I was "off the wall," yet he wanted to desperately remain engaged -- and was pressuring me to elope in order to marry as soon as possible?

He was a psychiatric nurse practitioner and 12 years older, which makes quite a difference when I was just 20 y.o. It became all so crazy-making for me that, at times, I often could not recall all that had happened. I was, at times, terrified of him and of this threats toward me and my welfare. I was in shock about how he could act and what he would say to me, making very serious and graphic threats to me. How could this man have a career showing compassion to people and be like this in his private life? I had seen how he was with clients, that was a part of what made me think he was truly deeply compassionate.

We were work colleagues. Many of our mutual friends also knew him through work. They did not believe me when I told them about the threats he was making to my life. The kicker was : I had a hard time believing it all, too.

Once I had started documenting/journaling, keeping his notes to me tucked in the journal, etc. -- THEN it all made sense. I kept the journal and all of his notes and more -- hidden. He had no idea the journal existed.

I took it all to a psychiatrist who was able to help me to process it all and was also able to help me to get out, no matter what my ex-fiancé was saying to me or what he was doing to make it all look like he was sorry, etc.

The journal helped me to recall/recount much that was too scary to me to fully recall otherwise. It also helped me to remember just how frightened I had become at times and all I had gone through.

There is more. More I won't share here. It had become a nightmare, like something we'd see on television or in the movie. The journal not only kept me fully oriented to/aware of all that had gone on, it also gave additional evidence to a judge who then issued a lifetime restraining order against him.

Suffice to say, the journal helped to save my life.

I am not implying you are in the same kind of danger. I have no idea, really.

I am saying keeping a journal helped me to gain more objectivity and also assisted others in helping me to the degree I'd needed their help/protection.

Both time and a journal helped me tremendously.

We are all here for you.

May you feel Loved and Supported at all times.

Heart-to-Heart,
WC

Oh Wild Coyote, hugs,hugs, hugs. That is all I can say. That is terrible. I think we both fully understand how serious this is. As do many here that life has been so unkind to. We do have to count our blessings and push forward as hard as it may be sometimes. It appears we have all done just that.

I ment to respond earlier to your post about the T who was swayed by the things going on in her personal life. I had one of those two, and she made it quite difficult to move forward with her stuff wrapped up in mine. As it turned out God was protecting my family, she had to have a surgery and the recovery time took longer than expected and she had came to us threw a government agency so she was limited to a 6 month timeline with us and time simply ran out.

The T we have now is very good. She specializes in trauma's and PTSD. Which is right up my ally. My H and I started with her as a Marriage Counselor. But it turned into me needing to deal with my past. (rape, and child sexual abuse, and maybe even spousal abuse) I worked threw my past, and I still am, your past never goes away, it just gets easier to deal with. Then when things got more manageable we started back with the MC (marriage Counseling). We did MC several times throughout because several things came up, becasue that is what happens when the abuse triggers thoguts of rapeand CSA. (Child sexual abuse)

I work on my stuff only one day a week with the T, and then my H and I work with the T one day a week on MC kind stuff.

____________________________________________________________________

Do I journal? Yes I do. I have learned a lot about journaling. IT can be so much more helpful then just record keeping and thoughts. With the help of my T she has showed me how to get the most out of my journaling experience. To involve every sense possible. I just a pencil, you can feel the lead scratch on the paper. I use the cheap recycled paper kinda notebooks, it has a smell sometimes but mainly because it is scratcher. The more sences you involve the greater the recall and the greater the ability to express yourself.

I have learned that it is ok to switch back and forth between cursive and print when writing. Teachers would flip out at that notion, but from a therapeutic writing standpoint it is the difference in the right brain and the left brain thinking. One style is the left and the other the right. IT helps the T to see when my brain is talking from a place a reality and current stuff and a place of triggered PTSD memories and feelings. When I go back and look at it is quite cool to see that switch first hand.

I do journal and it is mainly a way to keep my mind clear. I have so much turmoil living inside of me, and being able to put it on paper and explore it threw words and feelings and it be safe because it is mine helps so much. I can put it in a notebook and there it will live gently folded into the confines of a notebook instead of in my mind. I can give my thoughts and feelings words in a place it is safe to do so.

I share my journal every week with my T. She can see how my mind is working through things. She suggests I keep a journal for myself separate from the one I share with her. Though the one I share with her is my main journal. She is ok with some things not being for her to see, some thoughts are mine only. She doesn't want the journals to become something that is written for her or to her or swayed by her. I write what I write, and it it is something I do nto want to share then I put it in a separate note book. If it turns out to be an ah-ha moment then I zerox it and attach it in the note book she reads.

That reminds me I have a lot of writing to do today. When my T is unable to keep our appointment and has to cancel or the other the other way around, I am easily held captive by my own thoughts. I have learned it is very wise to write in that journal. My T is sick today so I am missing T this week. That is hard because of hte things I have talked about her with PC friends all week long.

Sorry to go on and on about that. In short I fully recommend journaling. Share it with the T if it is allowed. Journaling works wonders.

Hi Again, Big Mama,

Wow! Great info on journaling! Thanks so much for sharing that with us!

Great insights, too!

You mention so many important points. Thank you.

Yes, you are right on. The abuse from my fiancé had triggered feelings and memories from a very traumatic childhood. His threats were so severe, so unimaginable, I would become disoriented and, sometimes, would forget and/or could not process all of what he was saying to me. I would become "paralyzed" with terror, in a sense. If I had not had a past of having been terrorized, I am sure I would have had a different response to his chronic threats. I was also very young then. In time, as I could get more space and distance from him via a change in employers, I then could process more and could break away. I had also started to see a therapist on my own, of which he had no knowledge. When I changed employers and he was no longer my direct supervisor, he could not track me as well anymore. (I was able to edit out details in the above post so it would, hopefully, be less triggering to any reader.)

The "tools" and/or strategies we both have used have been helpful.

Having your own space to continue to heal is such a blessing!

Journaling, time, space and a skilled therapist -- all very helpful!

Journaling, even at the most basic level, saved me.

I am so happy for you, in that you have such a well-trained, talented therapist and you have an exceptional handle on your past and your present day life.

I have a lot of faith that you will do just fine.
This doesn't mean you won't want/need support. We all need support.
It means: You are making sure you are doing the things you need to do in order to keep perspective, in order to cope and in order to continue on your healing path.

Your story inspires me.

Your heart shines. Brightly!

To Our Healing,
WC

I wanted to up date you all on things. I had T today. I shared with the T this post, the beginning any way. She had some words of wisdom. In order to be fair to both of us, my H and I she had some options.

She suggested due to my own fears, the stockholm and the PTSD and my H's issues, the aspergers that both of our needs should be met. That he likely has no idea what he is doing is wrong. IT has been laid out to him what he needs to do on some occasions, but he still has a lot to learn. For me, I am reacting with the PTSD in mind. I am operating out of fear and triggers.

We decided, the T and I, that we will give things 4 weeks. I had planned on going back in 6 weeks. We will give things 4 weeks to show me proof. IT things do not go well then I will have two weeks to continue to tell him I am not coming home.

During hte next 4 weeks when things arise and I start to say "Don;t do that, or Say this instead, I need to wait for his response, nto retreat. I need to give him a chance to prove to me how he is going to handle the situation. I am not being fair to him by assuming what he is going to say or how he will handle things. Worst case senerio he will handle them just as poorly as I anticipate.

So after every response of his that is heated, I need to either respond to him by saying. I am so glad you changed, you would not have said that a year ago, or That is the kind of thing that give me hope and makes me feel safe enough to return. If he doesn't respond as I would like, then I need to say "That is what I am talking about, those are the kind of things that make it hard for me to consider coming home"

So like this weekend when we talked about July 4th, I should have told him he was right to take a break. (HE didn't get angry and threaten me, I do need to mention he forgot to tell me that he needed sometime to cool off) That was the right thing for him to do. I needed to tell him that being angry with me is ok, it happens, but do not take it out on our son. Rather then retreating I should have stayed and waited for his response to that. That way I can prove to myself and him that YES he has changed or NO he has not.

So the next 4 weeks I need to look for hard proof and evidence that he is changed or he has nto changed. Then I will have my answer. We worked a little more on a back up plan as well.

Thanks for the update!

((((Big Mama))))

When I began keeping a journal with my marriage, I initially noted that I wanted to give myself 1 year to recognize if there was indeed some cyclical pattern or if I was overreacting. It was cyclical.

It took years to reach that point to begin with. That was 2006.

It took me to 2015/2016 to comprehend the pattern of where my father's role in my life factors in. I reviewed my mother's role back in 2008/2009.

For the first time in the year we have been separated, I am actually thinking I want to go back home. I at least want to give it a try. I have done the work on myself, and H is working on his stuff. I hope with the help of the T that I can look back 10 years from now and simply say "Wow, that was a tough time, glad we got thru it."

I am also prepared to be a realist and keep my options open. I will move back home with him, but I will continue to pay rent at my current location. I will continue to keep the electricity turned on. I will still save $$ the best I can. I may even get a part time job. I am still kinda nervous about returning, but I am nto going to let my fears take irrational control over me. I am going to be paying attention and being careful, and that is all. I also know my T will be watching. She will be talking to my kids, and she will be having me there every week alone, and me and H together for joint T as well. My goal at this point is to go back in August around the middle to end of that month. I will still continue to come back to MY house during the day while H is at work and keep things sorted out mentally. I have a yard to mow there, and my garden is there. It is going to be hard to move from total relaxation into an environment that requires more.

I will definitely be journaling a lot to. Sometimes being able to write helps to show you where your true heart really lies. So we will see. The only way I would not go back at this point is if something were to happen in the next few weeks that is really not right. If we go on vacation and my H loses control like he has on past vacations, or if one of the kids does something stupid (Which teenage boys sometimes do) and he acts out irrationally and shows that hte same old pattern exists.

Oh my gosh...when I read that your H has Aspergers....I totally related to your situation (though everyone with Aspergers has their own place on the spectrum).

I had stuck it out in my bad marriage for 33 years though the last 13 I was separated from him though living in the same house because he made divorce almost impossible & I ended up feeling trapped with no way out after me career ended with the collapse of aerospace in Calif.

I had no idea what I was dealing with all those years I just knew that communication with him was next to impossible. He would look at me as if I were speaking in a foreign language. Agree to do what I asked then never do it so he came across as passive agressive not knowing what I was really dealing with. Had no idea that he didn't understand or didn't know how to do what I asked as he never communicated. Sabbatoged everything I did that excelled beyond him. He was always bragging about how intelligent he was but he didn't have a lick of common sense. Destroyed us financially until I took over but when depression hit me, I could no longer handle the finances so it went back on him & he did drive us to bankruptcy but since he couldn't handle things, he let that slide also leaving me being the one at home getting all the collection calls while dealing with major depression that he just no way could possibly understand.

I left him on & off during those 3 years but always came back. Hate grew al least on my part. Lost count of my number of suicide attempts thinking it was really my only way to escape but it never worked even when it should have. It felt like emotional abuse but he came across as if he really didn't know what he was doing let alone intentional. There was never any emotional connection with him. Finally toward the end before I finally just walked out, I realized that he knew what the right thing to do was like visiting me in the hospital but I realized he wasn't doing it because he felt anything for me but just because it was the right thing to do.

There was never any cheating in the marriage as he didn't know how to be around other people which I have since realized that was why we didn't have any friends we socialized with other than people I knew. There were times at the end when the battles became slightly physical though nothing horrible....I would get so frustrated with him I would punch him in the arm & he would hit back. One time my pdoc wouldn't release me from the psych hospital if I was going to go home. Ended up staying with my mom for awhile.

It was so strange knowing something was wrong but not knowing what & in many ways it was my normal because my H was just like my dad....so I was actually thinking that the fighting was my fault & I was the one who was wrong since I fought with my parents just like I ended up fighting with my H....so anyone had to be a saint to put up with me (according to my mom).

Well after my mom died of cancer I sold her house & took MY inheritance money & finally left....2100 miles away. Never felt any desire to go back to him after I left though I did give him a few weeks chance 6 months later to come to me farm & see if the separation had made any difference in him. Thought maybe being hit over the head with my leaving would get through to him though there was no communication during those months I was away & IT WAS SO PEACEFUL....no way I wanted or was willing to go back to the way it was.

I did find out on the 2100 mile drive in my truck that he didn't want a divorce all those years or now because he said "it would make him look like a failure". & he said that he thought "because I had tolerated him all those years he believed that I would tolerate him for the rest of our lives together".

Ended up kicking him out & sent him back home after only 3 weeks. I couldn't tolerate him any longer after having those months of peace & knowing what a wonderful feeling it was.

Oh that wasn't the last of his irresponsible behaviors effecting me though. I had all the mail forwarded to our farm....good thing as I got a letter from the IRS stating it was the 2nd letter & there had been no response to the first one....huge mistake had been made on the taxes that my H had done on my inheritance money because like usual, he refused to ask for any help because he knew he knew what he was doing. I had been dealing with PTSD after what happened with the home care person caring for my mom when she was dying of cancer. I had told my H to take it to the accountant I was having do the estate taxes but he refused with his know it all attitude & sure he knew what he was doing. Asked him why he didn't communicate about the 1st IRS letter. He said oh yes, he got it but couldn't figure out what they wanted & couldn't find the taxes he filed that year so he didn't bother responding. I ended up sorting out the huge mistake, getting all the letters from Pdoc & T to get the penalties waived & negotiated payment with the IRS. He was always incapable of handling anything it was like I was married to a child buth emotionally & with his incompetent way of handling anything out of his very narrow norm.

Dealing with this in the joint situation, divorce at that time wasn't a good idea.

Several years later I get a call from the lender on the house. Turned out he quit paying property taxes & then when they set up an impound account he quit paying the house payment, letting it go into foreclosure....without saying a word to me even though he knew my name was still on the loan....& he never returned the calls from the lender....he just quit paying. They were willing to do a loan mod with just him qualifying for it though my name was still on the loan with it only being a mod. Couldn't get him to respond & when he did, he lied about talking to the lender as I was talking to them & knew everything that was going on. Almost a year later that got resolved & he still wasn't making on time payments. Found out later when I finished paying the IRS & needed to cash an overpayment check in our joint account that he was living on overdraft charges to pay every bill he had & never did communicate for me to know when it was safe to cash the check without the account being negative. I was so angry...there was$14 in the account that day I cashed the check at a sister credit union in the state I live in....got so angry I came home, called our credit union & closed the account. I had talked to one of the tellers the night before & that was what he had suggested I do...so I did it not caring where in the world he got money to pay his bills that month. They also sent me 3 years of statements that H told me was none of my business.

It was right after that I started putting the pieces together. A T I saw after first moving here said it sounded like my H had undiagnosed Aspergers. I bought a wonderful book on it & in reading it brought back all the things I experienced in my marriage. For the first time in all those years his behavior was finally explained. Later looking even farther back it explained my fathers behaviors also.....& finally living around normal friends in my new life I realized that I wasn't the one causing the problems & my fighting against their behavior was a normal reaction even....but it had made my situational depression from loosing my career that much worse & it also made worse the PTSD that hit a few years before I finally left.

I have been gone 9 years now & have never regretted leaving or looked back with any desire to go back to that life I am finally free of. Divorce will happen when I finally get enough money to file for it....he sure isn't going to spend the money to file. But I have other higher priorities for my money at the moment. Just praying he doesn't do anything irresponsible that I become financially responsible for in the mean time.

I know Aspergers is on a spectrum & maybe your H is a bit more functional in most areas....I hand it to you to have the tolerance & the patience to even want to try going back to your marriage. My H kept saying he changed but there was no sign of the change he said he made. I realized later that in reality his mind was never capable of making the changes necessary for the marriage to work.

I'm glad you are keeping your place for awhile so you have a retreat if you need it. That is sort of like going home after being rested even in the psych hospital...home is like sensory overload & hard to go back to & be dumped back into life as it was before.

I wish you the best with the choices you are making...take it slow & be patient with your own reactions.

Thank you for sharing. Your story has some definiate similarities.

We never knew my H had aspergers. We always said he was OCD and we laughed about it. That is just what you say when people are kinda spicific about things. But he really does have OCD of the REAL variety. WE found out he had aspergers when we took my son to be tested. The T was quite suprised to find my son had that and it was confirmed by teh neurologist and the child psychologist. As it turns out that is an inherited disorder passed as down from males to a male usually, Not all the time but usually. The T laughed and said YOU definitely don;t have aspergers you have ADD from hell, but not asperger's. She then shook her head and said, but your husband, it all makes since now, he has aspergers.
Your son has it, he has it.

Because of my son I learned what a self absorbed disorder it is. It truly is that the person is not capable of thinking of others. It is not something they do because they are mean, or bad, there brain simply doesn;t have the ability to operate any other way. My son is like that to. It is a very lonely and confusing disorder for some people.

With the help of my T lots has been learned about how to deal with my H and my son. My son is 16 now, and it is very interesting for sure. With my son I learned that he can be tought phrases and times to use them. My H is the same way. We have done many sessions, VERY many on when this happens say this. Simple things like "excuse me" instead of "get your *** out of my way". Or "can u set back or I can;t see past you" instead of "Move your Fu cking fat head." I really don't think he ever remember saying those things. My kids did, there mouths dropped open when he said them, but I truly think he had no idea.

When I was pregnant he never went to the first doctor appointment. He never saw an ultrasound, it was jsut so hard for him to realize and understand fully that there was another person living in there. He got it, but he missed what that ment and the bonding that took place before birth. During delivery he was there, but during our hospital stay he went to work. He claimed I didn't need him setting around all day. I could do that by myself. When we took the baby home and for the early months he never changed his routine, he still had me pack his lunch. He never ever thought of me. When I was so exhausted and I jsut needed someone to hold the baby so I could shower or go to the bathroom alone, no luck. When he got up and got himself something to drink and gave me an ugly glare because he had to get his own drink, it never occurred to him to see if I needed or wanted something. Just common courtesy, he lacks.

It is indeed a lonely disorder. We have no friends, his response is "Who had time for friends." I have told him everyone needs an outlet, someone to talk to. His response was "Well I don't."

My H is a business owner. His OCD and the way he is so literal about things helps him with his business. HE is great with book keeping because of his OCD, and when he tells people I will see you SAturday at 4:00 to look at your job, come hell or high water he will be there. (even if he has to miss his kids birthday party, or a kids ball game)

When he comes home from work, I know that he takes off his shoes at teh door, puts them in a specific location then goes to the bathroom. After supper he exercises. He exercises. He exercises from 6:00 to 6:30. If I need him to pick up a kid at 6:15 then forget it. He can't do it. His reason is "But I am exercising at that time."

Vacation is a nightmare. He eats at 6 am, 12:00 noon, and 5 pm. IF we are somewhere then we have to stop and eat at that time or he will simply say any other time that we are not going to stop and eat, it's not time or it is passed time. It doesn't matter if you are hungry. HE goes to bed no later then 9:00 and always gets up at 5:00 am, and anyone else who does things differently is wrong. All the continental breakfasts at hotels are wrong, Mcdonald's is wrong, Country cookin is wrong. Breakfast is to be ready by 6:00am or before if he says so.

When it comes to communication he talks "At You" not to you. He talks in statements, and it comes off as complaining. It is all his opinion, no give and take, and you must agree with him and his point of view. Mainly becasue he is RIGHT!!

He is very jealous. Maybe he doesn't mean to be, but he says you may not call your mom or your sister or anyone else after I get home. You have all day to talk to them, if you care about me, then talk to me. You only have 3 hours each evening you can talk to me any way. Who would want to talk to your mom or your sister anyway.

I have learned that when he feels out of control that he tries to gain control over the one thing he can. Cleaning. You can always clean more, mop more, dust more, clean the car, the toilet, the boot tray. That is the key, the sign that says wait, he is feeling out of control about something. I have to figure out what, and ask him "Hows work", or "Hows your dad" or "Everything at church ok" Once we figure out what it is and he tells me about it then he chills out on the cleaning stuff.

He manages all the money, very VERY tightly. We are going to assume it is not because he is a control freak but because he is good at it. I know he is completely trustworthy with money. It is near impossible for him to miss a deadline. HE does not lie, if there is no money he says so. If he wrote a check for $300.00 I can know it was for something very necessary. I never have to worry about him spending excessively. The problem with that is what he considered a waste and how to spend $$. My teeth, my eyes, any doctors, there a waste of money. (Thats about me , not him so it is not important, to the point that it can be considered financial abuse because he is denying me the opportunity to have medical care) I had a lump under my arm, I thought it might be cancer. When I asked him if I could go to the dr, he said sure. WE have 100 left over this month. Do you want to use it to pay for the electric bill or so you can go to the dr. He was dead serious to. But I would be the reason the power was turned off and that would affect me and 3 kids and him. But it is up to me. WE had money in other areas, that could be used for me to go to the dr. WE had money in other areas that were not being used so we could borrow from one area to supplement another and pay the electric bill. CANCER, my god it might be cancer. But nope lets pay teh electric bill. You and your cancer will jsut have to wait.
Turns out I let it go for 6 months and one of the kids had a dr appointment (they have medicaid so the dr knew we had no money) and I asked the dr if he would look at it. He did and it was a non cancerous lump.

With the help of the T we have come to many conclusions. IF someone needs medical or dental care that trumps all else. Just having her say "That's the new rule", that is all it took. Having her say if you are thirsty then she is to. IF you get up to get you a drink ask if she wants one. He does now. He simply doesn't see or understand or have any idea. He's not trying to be difficult. We will continue to work on these things when I return.

I have to state the obvious. IF he takes it as me being an asswhole and demanding then so be it, but any other way he will never ever know what I want or need. When I carry in groceries and he watches me do it all, I need to ask him nicely to help me, when I have to much stuff to carry into church I need to ask him to help me, he will nto know to help. When I have 4 loads of laundry to wash becaseu there a re 5 of us in the house hold and we jsut got back from vacation and everything we own is dirty, I need to ask him to help me fold the clothes. HE will nto be able to look and see he needs to help me, or that I even need help. I have a lot to learn and so does he.

In the upcoming months I need to decide if this way of life is going to be something I can live with or not. If not, then it is perfectly reasonable to not stay married to him because he has a mental disorder that I cannot deal with. He can be tought skills, and phrases, and what to do in certain given situations. It is up to him though to decide to be tought. If he decides that he doesn't want to learn how to do something then I don't have to stay. IY makes me look like the bad buy, learn and change this or I am leaving, but in reality I have to taek care of me. I have to do what I can live with.

I don't know what the future will hold. I do know since I have been gone for almost a year, that my blood pressure has dropped 40 points, I have lost 30 lbs, my depression is gone, and I no longer take anxiety medication. When those things start to increase or return, then my answer has been maid for me. My body knows the answer even though my heart may disagree. So for now I will hang on to this house and hope for the best. I will continue to try to accommodate him and hopefully he will continue to learn what I need. The things I do to accommodate him and teach him, I will also be teaching my son since he has the same thing.

Thank you for sharing, and I commend you for your strength. It does sound like the two of you truly know what you need, but change can certainly be challenging. I think it is important to remember your own self worth and value. Sometimes, we get comfortable with someone and we stop trying. We stop appreciating them. It sounds to me as if he takes you for granted. Trust yourself and the progress you have made with you T.

My direct experience with those with OCD can be very regimented. As for Asperger's, my direct experience is that communication can be challenging. However, I don't think either MI is about belittling, insulting and being abusive. I could be mistaken and I hope things go well upon your return home.

Is there a personality disorder here? One where he may lack empathy?

Are you excited to return home?

((Big Mama)),

You were very alone and intimidated in your relationship with your husband. It made you question your personal worth too.

It's a "big" decision to give up the distance you gave yourself, the safety you created and go back to a place where you really don't have your own distance and "safe zone". Your husband wanting "you" so bad isn't enough, it's what YOU want that is important in this picture, what's right for "you" instead of you giving that up again.

The likelihood of him having a personality disorder IS there. I'd be lying to myself if I said it wasn't. My T is confused as to whether he has OCD and Aspergers or if he has a borderline personality disorder. The same can be said for my son.

Before the word aspergers was invented he would have definitely been borderline personality. Asperger's was a label that didn't hang around long. It is no longer recognized. Here today gone tomorrow, great huh. It only exists if you happen to have it.

Am I excited to go home? I actually want to go home for the first time in a year. Maybe not today or tomorrow, but with in some reasonable time frame, yes.

We have been working hard in T, we as in the T helping me, to find what has made me happy here and to take with me what makes me happy and incorporate it into life with my H. Some things are simple. Pictures of my horses that I so dearly love. Things that I have painted, but other things like calmness, and contentment, and the ease of coming and going and talking with family. The ability to go to the store jsut becasue, the need to jsut drive around and clear my head. I need to be able to take these things with me. These things are very important and If I can;t find them and take them with me then I am not in the right place. If I can;t find happiness and contentment, if I can;t find peace of mind, if I can have some freedom then I know my answer. For that reason I am hanging on to what I have as far as a back up plan. The house I am in now I will keep because I hope I can find what I am looking for, but I can't be certain. After I am home for a while I will know more.

I do know I NEVER EVER!!!!! want to go back to the way things were and I think the T has measures put into place to protect me and my kids from ever letting that happen again.

Asperger's now has the label of ASD......Autism Spectrum Disorder.....they have thrown ALL autism together under that label so high functioning & low functioning people with autism are given the term ASD.

My H was diagnosed with adult ADD.....but most of the time, ASD/Asperger's comes along with ADD

I'm glad you have such a good understanding of his behavior that is caused by the ASD/Asperger's. It helps to understand what you are dealing with. I left before I found out, so I never will know if knowing might have had a positive effect on the marriage.

I know being in my own home for the first time in all the 53 years of my life (9 years ago) it was the most awesome feeling figuring out who in the world I was not based on my reactions to someone. I think my H would have been more like yours but I never gave him the chance from the beginning of our marriage. I fought a LOT, but I think I broke him of some things. He hated so many foods (including pizza which was one of my staples). His mother told me that when he came home & saw that she had cooked something he didn't like, he would go storming out the front door & drive to McDonalds & buy a hamburger with NOTHING on it except the meat. I let him know if he EVER pulled that on me even once, the door was going to be hitting him in the rear on his way out & the locks would be changed so he would NEVER get back in. It was like dealing with a child my whole married life & it was totally exhausting after 33 years. My depression was gone as soon as I left him also & my anorexia got under control because my life was finally under control for the first time.

I can understand the struggle you are going through. Getting that chance to know who you are without it being defined by how you respond to someone is so important & oh yes, being the bad guy.....that was me for leaving. Luckily the only people alive to have an opinion about it were his parents & I really didn't care what they thought about me by that point. My daughter is good with it because she grew up around all the fighting & she had already moved far away. We are closer now than we ever were before so the change has been very good for that also.

I'm glad you have such a wonderful T who is helping you sort through all the emotions & finding what the happy things are for you when you are away......just being able to be YOU is a huge thing. I remember my first grocery trip where I bought only foods that I liked & all the foods that my H had hated. It was such a liberating feel.

Your T is helping you to KNOW YOURSELF & that is very important at this point & you are able to analyze what those things that have made your life good again. I hope that changes can be made to make your marriage work.....with Asperger's it's never easy as you already know.

I'm sure you will make wise decisions in going back & test the waters to make sure it is truly safe to go back to.

Rainyday......the thing is that they don't even recognize that this is what they are doing. My H started with the sarcasm after we got married & putting me down with it in front of friends. It made me angry so I started throwing it back right at him because I wasn't going tolerate being treated that way. He thought it was humor & he would laugh at himself thinking absolutely nothing about how mean he was really being. It took a few months but I didn't like what it was turning me into so I told him to either stop or GET OUT. He had no idea that there was anything wrong with what he was doing. It wasn't done out of intentional meanness or being abusive & their communication skills are so lacking & they have no emotional connection so they don't sense or even read from the other person how it's affecting them.

I respect you so much Big Mama for having such a positive approach to wanting your marriage to work & having such a good understanding & patience......while doing that, also knowing that you do have your limits for what is healthy for your own self & understanding that YOU aren't the BAD GUY if in fact you do need to not go back in the long run. I was a fighter & even fought my own parents (realizing now that my own Dad has Asperger's) & I wasn't easy going when I felt like I was being wronged so my H didn't get an easy ride all those years...but hey, that was fair, if he was going to make my life difficult then he was entitled to have his life made difficult also. Sadly I grew to hate him because there was never any LOVE to start the marriage with & I realized I had issues with him before we ever got married. If only I had known why I felt those issues I would have followed through with cancelling the wedding like I had wanted to.

In response to your reply to Rainy Eskie.... I can certainly understand people thinking sarcastic comments are funny instead of rude... I'm sarcastic my whole family is. But we know others find it offensive, so its a family and close friends thing.


But there's no way in hell anyone is going to convince me a person without any substantial cognitive impairment doesn't know that the term "effing fat" is just plain rude.


The first word is a swear word and the second most people find offensive.


It's not innuendos or something else equally obscure that the person is unknowingly using wrong.


Please ladies, don't make excuses for people who treat you like shyt on purpose. There's still a man behind that label and that man is not completely oblivious. It's plain impossible.

I jsut want to scream. I don't know what I want. I just don't know. I had T today. Teh T and I talked about how my H is slipping back into old patterns. Date night has stopped, calling each other and talking for at least 30 min a night has stopped. Our visiting which was supposed to be Friday, Sat and Sunday all along has been reduced to A few hours on Saturdays nights, and maybe a couple of hours on Sundays. It is inconvenient for me to pack up my stuff and come sleep at his house and talk and be a "family" for a few hours on weekends.

My H is a workaholic. He works between 12 and 15 hours a day, 6 days a week. So he is tired. He claims I jsut don't get it, when it comes to him having to provide an income for "US." Actually I am good with a minimal relationship, living as roommates, if that is what he is willing to offer. I have been at home for 20 years and not worked. I am used to being alone, and not having friends IRL. Being alone and having no connection doesn't bother me. I have intimacy issues so I am good with lack of connection. He is not a good conversationalist at all, so I don't really need to talk to him much. I have issues with attachments, well the lack of them. I don't see a need for attachment. I do everything alone, never ask for help, and forget about leaning on him for support or connection, or anyone else IRL for that matter." So going back to a relationship with no connection feels safe to me, but over time it will not.

The T said pretty much "You know no different, in your raising you had no connections and it lacked concern and caring and intimacy. (hence the CSA and rape) So you are accustomed to that kind of life now. But one day I fear you will want to have a connection with someone and have somebody who cares about you"

I don;t have a problem with a lot of things but what I do have a problem with is playing family. If I am going to raise the kids alone, and make the rules, and do things the way I do them, do not step in on weekends or on the few hours you are home and tell me how to do things. Don't get pissed at me because you feel left out. When you make your bed you have to lie in it. When we make plans as a family of mom and 3 kids, because dad is never around, when you are around, don't get mad because you were not included. Join us because you want to. Don't tell me "you need to clean the house first before you take the kids to the fair" or phrase it nicely and say "I can't believe you are not going to clean the house before you go."

That burden falls on me. The T is right. I need to stand up and say, nope, the house is not getting cleaned before we go, or no it is not gonna be cleaned until this evening after we return. And stick to it. I'm a people pleaser (pushover) In short, participate if you want to in the event that you take a day off of work. But don't tell me how to run my life if you are not going to be there to help me along the way.

The T asked me a really good question. If I know I may be ignored and feel alone, and I am going to be living like a roommate not a wife, then what keeps me wanting to go back.
I told her the financial security. God what a desperately sad answer, sad but honest. The label of married, the thought of a house that is new and paid off, the notion that I will nto have to work and all my bills will be paid for. I'm not going back for a husband or to be a friend. I am going back to be a roommate. I'm going back as a potential servant. I'm not sure I am ok with that. I have a lot to think about. I just have to much going on and I want to scream and to cry would be nice, though I don't know how to do that. I need to try to talk to him some this weekend, but I first need to sort my thoughts out and write them down.

Prayers is all I know to ask for. Sometimes you get so low you can;t even pray for your self. You have to rely on others to do it for you, at this moment that is what I am doing. Please pray that God shows me what he wants me to do. That he shows me the path he wants me to take and I don't doubt that path or question that path, and that somehow I know that is God telling me what to do. Even if it is to stay with him thats ok, or if it is to not return that is ok. I just need to know.

Will keep you in prayer BM

(((((((((((((((((Big mama))))))))))))))) prayers for you.

Hi Big Mama,

Your story reminds me so much of growing up helpless against my abusive mother except NO one had the courage to tell her she was abusive and needed therapy to deal with her anger, rage and control issues. (We couldn't use her special fork or eat the ice cream she bought for herself.)

Anyhoo... It okay to tell him you need more time. I learned in therapy that BOUNDARIES ARE HEALTHY. Identifying what feels better means you are on track. Take the time to get strong. He may not realize it but he needs more time too.

Practice communicating with firm statements delivered in a calm manner, without sounding defensive or fearful. A fearful response from you is like a trigger for him... it tells him unconsciously that his methods are working. From now on, if he interrupts you, slightly raise your voice, smile, and again, say, "Excuse me, I need to finish what I'm going to say right now." No need to yell, cuss or get mad.. that feeds the hungry beast!!!

Another thing that helps communicating with difficult people or situations is a sense of humor so remember that on your next family outing. Telling him you don't want a repeat of what happened last time is like erecting a giant hurdle. In family prep... keep it simple and remember an ounce of prevention... make everyone use the bathroom, be as prepared as possible in all things will avoid hassle.

Best of luck from an abuse survivor!

LeeeLeee - Thank you so much for your understanding. It sounds like you know exaclty what I am going threw. You have been there and done that.

I am scared to death some days to go back. It is like russian roulette. I am taking a huge gamble. IT could go badly, he could watch me like a hawk, limit every ounce of money, and not let me out of his sight with out knowing where I am. Eventually fear will keep me bound just like I was before I left.
or
There is a chance that things will be ok when I fist get home but turn out to be difficult. But there will be some long term improvements, enough to make things at least bearable long term. I feel like I have to at least give things a try. Work has been done and I feel like before I can completely say I am done or I am fully committed to this, I need to live in it a little while.
or
In a perfect world, things will have improved greatly, and the situation will look nothing like it once did. We will have one less child at home by the time I move home and the other will be turning 18 in a a couple of years. In a perfect world all will go smoothly and it will be smooth sailing minus the average hiccups.

Big Mama, it's very hard to teach an old dog new tricks. It's understandable that you worry that "if" you choose to go back to your husband that he will end up slipping back into his old patterns that were not healthy for you.

It's probably not so much that he works so much, but that he tends to bring home whatever is stressing him and takes it out on you in some way. It also sounds like he is the type of individual that takes up "all" the space when he is around, takes up whatever space you happen to be "in" when it comes to "his" home.

It sounds like the time you have been "away" and have had your "own" space has become meaningful to you, even comfortable. Well, once one has that and realizes how nice it is to have one's OWN SPACE, it's hard to go back to a place where that simply did not exist for you.

Remember also, his brain works the way it works for a reason (Asperger's & OCD), not by choice & even if he can learn to respond differently, many times the way the brain works slips out no matter how much learning is done when it comes right down to every day living situations.

Even before I found out what was the cause of my H's issues, I realized that he was NEVER going to be capable of change (I had no idea why at that time). He actually told me that he had worked hard at changing & had changed some. For the life of me I still don't know what that change actually was that he felt he had worked so hard to do.

It's not easy having your own space just having your kids but having a H that doesn't respect your space or is capable of understanding your need for that space, would make going back that much more difficult.

I know for me, when I committed to getting married in the first place, it was for better & worse & even though I really didn't like it, I tried to find whatever way I could to tolerate it for as long as I could (33 years) but it finally gets to a point where there was no more ability to tolerate the behavior & it just continued to escalate on the abusive end of things including me getting so frustrated & exhausted that I would punch him in the arm because it felt like I couldn't get him to even listen or hear what I was saying & that was the wrong approach because it caused an escalation of the physical problems only at 95 pounds to his 230+ pounds, I was hardly going to do any damage to him.

It honestly would have been better if I had left sooner but God didn't open up the door for it to happen until after my Mom died because she needed me while at the same time my own life & breeding my mare was going on in my own life. It wasn't until the point in time that it happened that all the pieces came together to make it possible for me to leave by just walking out & leaving EVERYTHING behind & starting over from scratch. Our daughter was grown & out of college & even out of state by the time I finally left......& Yes, I was the bad guy for leaving after those last 13 years that he "put up with" my continual migraines, my depression, suicide attempts & anorexia. Had no idea at the time that much of what I was going through was because of the bad marriage on top of loosing my career & had no place to hide away any longer. So much we end up seeing years later......that's why it's so wonderful that you are becoming aware & have a good T who is asking you questions to think about when you don't have the answers.

Something I have learned over the years......is that God will give you the answer you are asking for & until He does, it's best to do NOTHING but keep working on therapy & growing & learning how to best care for yourself. That way if God does give you the indication that it's right to go back, you will be stronger at caring for yourself & God knows the right time even for that. It's only been these last 9 years since I left my H that I have grown in my relationship with God & have learned to listen & hear His directions for my life & I have learned to have the patience to wait until I do get the directions clearly & realize that when it's not clear, then it's not time to take any action (or the action that keeps me where I am at the time without going back to where I was (or in my case to make other changes in my life). Trust prayers for you (keeping you in my prayers also) & trust that God will give you an answer that you will be aware of & like I said, have the patience to wait until you to get a clear answer & that no answer is to stay where you are & keep growing stronger on your own & in your relationship with God. Sometimes I have realized that it was so easy to depend on H for everything when in reality, God wants us to depend on Him & sometimes staying on our own longer gives us more time to learn how to depend on God rather than on H or ourselves for the things that we need in our lives. Just a few things that I have learned over the last 9 years after I left my marriage & patience was a huge learning curve for me. I wanted answers NOW, not later or when God would finally give me His answer. Have also found that God seems to give his answer after I think it's too late. Sort of like in the OT when Sarah gave Abram her servant Hagar to have a baby with because God hadn't gotten her pregnant yet. She was sure that her thinking that the promised baby had to come through those means rather than continuing to wait for herself to become pregnant when she knew it was impossible even though it was a promise from God. So often we are sure that our answer is the one God has for us when in reality we just haven't waited long enough for His REAL answer that he had all along for us.

I was honestly surprised when God opened the door for me to be able to walk away from my 33 year marriage because I thought God hated for marriages to end & that we were supposed to try to keep making them work no matter what. I know that God opened the door because I have been so blessed since walking through it & know what life would have been like if I had stayed.....but it took 13 years of really bad life (at the end of the 33 years) before that door was opened so that I could get out without having a horrible mess to deal with.

OE, thank you for stating that so well. You are exactly right. I have always been living in "HIS SPACE" and I have now had a taste of "MY SPACE." I don't want to give up "MY SPACE." I have learned to like ME and everything in MY Space that represents ME. I wish there was a way to combine MY space with HIS space. I guess that is part of my fear.

Can one actually combine HIS space with HER space and make "THEIR" space? Is it really possible? Guess we will see.

I agree about having your own space and the other person not respecting ones need for that. It is going to be a challenge for sure when I return. I have to chisel out some time and space for ME in that house. H did finally agree that I could being a couple of shadow boxes of my two horses that have passed. He agreed that some of the things I have painted can come to the house. For him that is a huge step. Lets hope it continues.

You are so right about hte ASP and OCD brain. It simply is what it is. That is the catch 22. HE may not be able to change. He may be able to learn responses, and to be quiet sometimes, but there will be things that come up that you cannot teach and you cannot rehearse. That may well be the last straw.

I feel like I have to try. We have both learned things. I feel like I have to go back and try. I have to see if these things make a big enough difference.

My aunt told me a long time ago, "Sweetie you should have left his *** a long time ago, then you could have a marriage like mine" She left her H, took the kids and returned some time later. He missed his kids and had a whole new respect for her. She had a balls of steal after she returned. ( Not sure if I can say that here, sorry to any one that may take offence to that)OR at least her H thought she did. The T has tole me I absolutely must set the stage now for what I will accept for the rest of my life. This is my one big chance. (thanks, that makes me feel better :/ )